Opponent Did Not Know Stroke and Distance Rule

[ChetlovesMer]

47 minutes ago, Rulesman said:

So you go up the snakes and down the ladders? Don't try that with my grandkids.

Ha, that's funny. Here in the US we call it "Shoots and Ladders". 

[mcanadiens]

12 minutes ago, ChetlovesMer said:

Ha, that's funny. Here in the US we call it "Shoots and Ladders". 

Thanks to Milton Bradley.

It's a really old Indian (as in Asia Indian) game also known as Moksha Patam.

Oh yeah. It's Chutes and Ladders. Like down the chute. Less moralistic or something like that.

Edited May 27, 2021 by mcanadiens

[iacas]

1 hour ago, ChetlovesMer said:

Shoots and Ladders

Ummmm… 😉

[ChetlovesMer]

19 minutes ago, iacas said:

Ummmm… 😉

Shoots and ladders..... it's like "He shoots and scores!" or "He shoots and ladders!" 

 

Okay, I'm an idiot. 

[reidsou]

On 5/26/2021 at 10:45 AM, ChetlovesMer said:

I just assume everyone "wants" to play by the rules..... am I wrong? 

I have encountered much reluctance to play by USGA rules that make the game "too hard". Examples are no automatic two-putts on temporary greens, balls that are lost because they embedded are still lost, bare ground is not GUR, mud is not temporary water, penalty relief area may be on a cart path, no relief from divots, no relief from boundary fence, no line of play relief from immovable obstructions, etc. 

[saevel25]

2 minutes ago, reidsou said:

I have encountered much reluctance to play by USGA rules that make the game "too hard".

Golf is just a difficult game because of the required precision needed to hit strait-isn shots when the downswing is a fraction of a second in duration. 

Golf rule are made because they are fair and for the most part simple to understand. This means, there are not 100 different situations for one rule. Which is good. None of your examples are anything to complain about regarding the rules. Honestly, you don't encounter those situations that much to say it make golf excessively hard. 

[WillieT]

Was searching the TST site for any discussions related to "temporary greens" and how they are to be played and came across this thread.  Good discussion on stroke and distance penalty.  I have used it a number of times against myself when my tee shot is water bound or lost in the woods bound.  I have yet to play in any regular league action but rather limited to rounds with friends/family and the once a month men's group from church round of best ball (where penalty strokes are never in play, shoot even sand traps are not in play as someone always has a ball that is not in one).  Now back to my search on temporary greens as the course I have been playing as two greens that they are working to restore and has temporary greens cut in front of the regular greens.  

[DaveP043]

33 minutes ago, WillieT said:

Now back to my search on temporary greens as the course I have been playing as two greens that they are working to restore and has temporary greens cut in front of the regular greens.  

In my mind, I'd treat a hole with a temporary green as a hole not played.  For Handicap Purposes, that means you'd record par plus any handicap strokes to be applied.  Based on your post, I'm not sure you keep a handicap, so maybe that's not really useful. 

From a "rules" standpoint, you simply count strokes until you hole the ball, temporary greens or not.  But your league or your group of buddies might decide to limit you to 2 putts on each temp green, or the golf course itself might provide some guidance.

[reidsou]

20 minutes ago, DaveP043 said:

... But your league or your group of buddies might decide to limit you to 2 putts on each temp green...

(We're off the thread topic?)

I mentioned automatic two putt "local rule' as an example of "making golf easier" that does not follow the rules - not approved by the USGA because it violates rule 1.1, the most basic rule of golf.  

I agree with the rest:

30 minutes ago, DaveP043 said:

In my mind, I'd treat a hole with a temporary green as a hole not played.  For Handicap Purposes, that means you'd record par plus any handicap strokes to be applied.  Based on your post, I'm not sure you keep a handicap, so maybe that's not really useful. 

From a "rules" standpoint, you simply count strokes until you hole the ball, temporary greens or not.  

 

[DaveP043]

26 minutes ago, reidsou said:

(We're off the thread topic?)

You're right, we can stop here, or start another thread if interested.

[WillieT]

9 hours ago, DaveP043 said:

In my mind, I'd treat a hole with a temporary green as a hole not played.  For Handicap Purposes, that means you'd record par plus any handicap strokes to be applied.  Based on your post, I'm not sure you keep a handicap, so maybe that's not really useful. 

From a "rules" standpoint, you simply count strokes until you hole the ball, temporary greens or not.  But your league or your group of buddies might decide to limit you to 2 putts on each temp green, or the golf course itself might provide some guidance.

Thanks @DaveP043 - only keeping the handicap via the tracking on the Garmin Approach S20.  So it’s not any official handicap.  The reason for the pondering has to do with a comment a member, that once he landed on the temp green he picked up his ball and counted 2 strokes and moved on.  I need to talk to the course folks and see what the local rule is.  I know they have a cup cut at each hole so it may be up to the individual or group.  

Edited September 3, 2021 by WillieT
Grammar

[Ruler]

17 hours ago, DaveP043 said:

In my mind, I'd treat a hole with a temporary green as a hole not played.  For Handicap Purposes, that means you'd record par plus any handicap strokes to be applied.  Based on your post, I'm not sure you keep a handicap, so maybe that's not really useful. 

From a "rules" standpoint, you simply count strokes until you hole the ball, temporary greens or not.  But your league or your group of buddies might decide to limit you to 2 putts on each temp green, or the golf course itself might provide some guidance.

Why would you treat a temporary green differently from the Rules point of view and for handicap purposes?

Our version of WHS says that a score is valid if there are no more than one temp green per 9 holes and the overall measure of the course is not reduced more than 50 meters from the nominal value per 9 holes. Thus you play the course as laid out and count your strokes like any other time.

Edited September 3, 2021 by Ruler

[reidsou]

On 9/3/2021 at 1:12 AM, Ruler said:

Our version of WHS says that a score is valid if there are no more than one temp green per 9 holes and the overall measure of the course is not reduced more than 50 meters from the nominal value per 9 holes. Thus you play the course as laid out and count your strokes like any other time.

Are you sure that is in WHS?

Appendix G of The Rules of Handicapping addresses temporary course changes. Section 3.2 addresses what to do if a hole is not played. I do not see that temporary greens are directly addressed in either. 

My understanding is that the Rules of Handicapping are the comprehensive rules of the WHS. 

[Rulesman]

On 9/3/2021 at 9:12 AM, Ruler said:

 

Our version of WHS 

Which version is that? USGA, GB, Australia?

[WUTiger]

On 5/13/2021 at 1:04 PM, ChetlovesMer said:

"Yeah, I know, I'm just going to drop up where it went out and take a stroke." He repeats. 

Any chance he's confused about the new local rule option for OB?

Quote

New rule: A new local rule was introduced with the newest edition of the Rules of Golf when they were released in 2019. The new stroke-and-distance local rule allows players the option of dropping in the fairway if they so choose. Players must find where their ball went out of bounds and create an imaginary perpendicular to the fairway, no closer to the hole. From there, you can now drop anywhere within two club-lengths behind the line. The next shot will be your fourth.

From Golf Magazine's Rules School. 

He might not realize that the shot - after his drop on edge of fairway - will be his fourth.

[ChetlovesMer]

1 hour ago, WUTiger said:

Any chance he's confused about the new local rule option for OB?

He might not realize that the shot - after his drop on edge of fairway - will be his fourth.

I don't think so. We were specifically given a rules sheet which stressed that this rule is NOT in effect for our league. I am pretty sure he simply didn't know the out of bounds rule vs the lateral hazard rule. 

[Ruler]

On 9/4/2021 at 8:18 PM, reidsou said:

Are you sure that is in WHS?

Appendix G of The Rules of Handicapping addresses temporary course changes. Section 3.2 addresses what to do if a hole is not played. I do not see that temporary greens are directly addressed in either. 

My understanding is that the Rules of Handicapping are the comprehensive rules of the WHS. 

I checked it and I had mixed that up with the previous handicap system. Indeed there is no mentioning of temporary greens in the WHS. Then I called our NA and asked what is the role of a TG. The answer was that they are regarded as normal greens and ball is to be played into the hole. That is how we do it here in Finland.

[WUTiger]

On 9/9/2021 at 7:04 PM, ChetlovesMer said:

don't think so. We were specifically given a rules sheet which stressed that this rule is NOT in effect for our league

That's understandable. Our league uses it for one-day medal play matches, but not in our annual championships.