The One- and Two-Plane Golf Swings, by Jim Hardy

[lookimtigerwoods]

im thinking about going to a guy who does the jim hardy method. i use the hank haney right now, how much of a transition will this be

[tm22721]

Hogan had a rotational swing without any lateral movement which made him VERY consistent. All he had to do was to rotate his hips with everything he had.

[MPS67]

Hogan had a rotational swing without any lateral movement which made him VERY consistent. All he had to do was to rotate his hips with everything he had.

You know, I see things differently. In the following video, you can see Hogan's hips slide forward quite a bit (maybe 4-5 inches) as he transfers his weight. Matter of fact, in the slow motion portion, he transfers laterally forward before he reaches the top of the back swing. I also believe he, as well as any other PGA Pro, are consistent because they use their large body muscles instead of their arms from the top. That, and most of them practice for countless hours per day.

[MPS67]

Sorry, here's the video

[titaniummd]

What does that old man with the funny hat and steel shafted wooden head club know, anyways?

He has a one plane swing but his legs are too active for me. I am in the process of watching his video by Jim McLean "Ben Hogan, The Golf Swing"

[worst_shot_ever]

When I try to do what Ben does at the beginning of the downswing with a driver, I put my clubhead 8" behind the ball and in the dirt at impact.

[tm22721]

You know, I see things differently. In the following video, you can see Hogan's hips slide forward quite a bit (maybe 4-5 inches) as he transfers his weight. Matter of fact, in the slow motion portion, he transfers laterally forward before he reaches the top of the back swing. I also believe he, as well as any other PGA Pro, are consistent because they use their large body muscles instead of their arms from the top. That, and most of them practice for countless hours per day.

Hogan's left hip is in the same place at the end of the backswing as it was at address. He achieved this by rotating his right hip back toward the target at the end of the backswing to prevent right lateral movement. He did it by screwing his right foot clockwise into the ground at address and through the backswing so that he swung into his right leg, not over it. He had to have an extra row of cleats installed on his right shoe to prevent the right foot from slipping during this move.

During the downswing he rotated his left hip back until it was directly over his left leg to act as a pivot. This appears to be lateral movement but it is more rotational. It is easier to see in video taken from the back. Shaun Clement has videos explaining this hip sequence.

[MPS67]

Hogan's left hip is in the same place at the end of the backswing as it was at address. He achieved this by rotating his right hip back toward the target at the end of the backswing to prevent right lateral movement.

Well again, I don't know if I agree completely.

I see it differently. To me, it looks as though Hogan allows his hips to be pulled back by his shoulders. Before he completes his back swing, he subtlety shifts/bumps/slides his hips towards the target without rotation. And I believe he does this as the impetus to get all of the necessary components of the downswing to move to the correct positions and in the correct direction. He's starting momentum with this move.

He did it by screwing his right foot clockwise into the ground at address and through the backswing so that he swung into his right leg, not over it.

Makes a lot of sense, otherwise he's have no leverage from his right leg from which to push off in the downswing.

During the downswing he rotated his left hip back until it was directly over his left leg to act as a pivot. This appears to be lateral movement but it is more rotational. It is easier to see in video taken from the back. Shaun Clement has videos explaining this hip sequence.

I see a combination of hip rotation and, to a lesser degree, a lateral hip slide as Hogan moves up to and around his posted left leg. In you previous post, you stated...

"Hogan had a rotational swing without any lateral movement which made him VERY consistent. All he had to do was to rotate his hips with everything he had." I wasn't sure if you were writing that Hogan simply spun in place. I reviewed the Shawn Clement video, and he claims Hogan employs lateral movement as well.

[mikelz]

This sure is a great thread, I guess.

The music goes in right here, it goes up and down and round and round, and it comes out here.

Turn your back to the target and hit the ball.

[Bo the Golfer]

This sure is a great thread, I guess.

Amen Brother!

[tm22721]

You know, I see things differently. In the following video, you can see Hogan's hips slide forward quite a bit (maybe 4-5 inches) as he transfers his weight. Matter of fact, in the slow motion portion, he transfers laterally forward before he reaches the top of the back swing. I also believe he, as well as any other PGA Pro, are consistent because they use their large body muscles instead of their arms from the top. That, and most of them practice for countless hours per day.

The lateral shift is an optical illusion created by the rotation of the left hip to the rear tush line.

[MPS67]

Maybe I'm not understanding what you're saying, so I attached this small image of Hogan's top positions vs. his impact position. If you don't mind, maybe you can clear the fog from my head.

I drew red vertical lines indicating his ball address position, yellow vertical lines that represent his left hip position, and a pink vertical line showing the front of his posted leg. Hogan's hips are probably rotated 40-45° back at the top, and approximately the same amount forward at impact, so there's no optical illusion that I see from a view perspective. I do see a substantially wider gap between the yellow and red lines at impact. Doesn't this show some kind of lateral movement that goes along with his rotation?

Thanks,

Mark

[Brakkus]

TBH the gap between the red line and the yellow line isn't the lateral movement of the hip,it's his right hip which has rotated round to where his left hip was.

As for the slide forward it was a well known move of Hogan to tilt his spine toward his target at the top to initiate his downswing,so therefore he does slide forward but only by a small amount at best.

Then again who apart from Hardy and his star pupils actually use his model.

[MPS67]

O.K., I hear you guys, but don't agree with your explanations.

Thanks with your insight though, and I appreciate your perspectives,

Regards,

Mark

[erikpmort]

that shawn video really helped me understand my hogan book. i've read the hogan book and the tiger book. whats the next best book to read?

[highcut28]

Hi all of u. I am new to Sandtrap, in fact this is my first forum.
I have just started with Jim Hardy's one planer after yet another frustration golf outing.
I think its brilliant, but boy its very different.
I was wondering what happens inside fifty yards, or sand shots.
How do u use this swing to pitch??

[mm6840]

Hi all of u. I am new to Sandtrap, in fact this is my first forum.

Hi,

Jim Hardy talks about that in Secrets #6 DVD series. However many of "us" using/learning Stane Utley methods I'm just curios : Did you manage Down Swing ? Drop/twist/hook right forearm to the Inner circle ? best regards,

[highcut28]

Hi everyone I am new to this forum and this is my first comment.
After struggling for consistency for 10 years (hc 12 to 15 now) I have been really impressed by the Jim Hardy 1 plane swing. After studying the DVD i tried it yesterday and find it quite amazing.
I also think its the cure for tennis elbow (brought on by golf) on my left.
I hit solid irons and even some long drives.
Its a weird but wonderful action!
My question is what happens inside 100 yards?
How do you pitch or play sand shots with this swing.
Does Jim discuss this in his book?

Hi MM6840
Sorry i did not realize the bit i wrote last night went thru- the connection was so bad.

Once you get the correct backswing you basically smack the ball with you upper body/chest. Your hands are behind bcos the left arm is still across your chest. When your chest faces left of target is when the club impacts the ball.
I found my hands were just in it for the ride but they did follow the sequence he takes great pains to describe.
You do all that with the spine centred. It really works.
I actually did try pitching.
Yes works too but was wondering if there are any specific tips.