Golf Snobbery

[hmu05366]

On 03/05/2011 at 3:38 PM, MiniBlueDragon said:

 

 

I guess it depends on the types of club you're playing. I've played members-only clubs in the past where everyone was friendly, happy and relaxed but I also know of clubs that are the complete opposite. There are courses near me with requirements and rules like:

 

 

 

• all players must wear a plain pillar-box red outer garment
• you may wear golfing attire in the "wooden-floored" area of the clubhouse, or outside on the verandah
• leave your mobile telephones in your car
• current handicap certificates, 18 maximum for men, 36 for ladies
• membership interviews
• referral for membership only from existing members

 

etc

 

Ridiculous to go that far with it when it's a game that everyone is supposed to enjoy. I agree with handicap limits to stop the course bein destroyed by people who can't play golf to save their life but a different handicap for guys and girls? Madness...

 

A bit late to this thread (almost a decade) - but thought I'd chime in nonetheless...

Yeh some of the rules surrounding etiquette in golf clubs is still a bit strange and old fashioned, especially how difficult they can make it for new members to join.  The weird thing is that they are so bold about confronting you when you break a stupid rule as well - which can often be a bit embarrassing if you're a grown man.

I agree with what you've said except about the handicaps.  The handicaps are set that way for a reason - the higher handicap and easier tees are to make the game more manageable for women.  That's not sexism, just reality man.  I've enjoyed playing golf with tonnes of women young and old and when the vast majority of them hit 5 wood or stronger off a small 140 yard par 3 from the ladies tees the game is hard enough for them as it is without pretending they'd be okay from the back tees...  Imagine how bored you would get if every hole was driver off the tee then another 1 or 2 fairway woods until you've even reached the green.  If women hit off the back practically all golf courses would need to be redesigned to accommodate for this.  I've never heard one of them complain about this.

The main problem I experience with golf is what I would call "reverse snobbery."  I play on loads of public courses in Scotland and never any problems - everyone friendly and nobody cares what you have in the bag... but when you play on some decent private courses the members seem to look at you with suspicion if you have a Titleist bag or Mizuno irons etc.  It's as if they're utterly paranoid about you thinking you're better than them haha... They don't seem to mind if you have a lesser known brand, but always will make some sarcastic comment if you are sporting something you've perhaps spent a wee bit of money on (and why not).  I don't give a monkey's about what people have in their bag, wish everyone was the same... Makes you feel like you're being looked up and down when you walk into a new club for the first time.

 

[saevel25]

2 hours ago, hmu05366 said:

Yet some of the rules surrounding etiquette in golf clubs is still a bit strange and old fashioned, especially how difficult they can make it for new members to join. 

Depends on the club. I agree that a lot of private courses make it very difficult to let new people join. It very much can be, you have to know someone to just get the foot in the door.

Also, when they charge $10 K initiation fee, $10 K a year member dues, add in cart fees and a monthly spending requirement I don't think they are strapping for money. There isn't an incentive to really need new members.

They are a private organization that has the right to make their membership process how ever they want.

2 hours ago, hmu05366 said:

The weird thing is that they are so bold about confronting you when you break a stupid rule as well - which can often be a bit embarrassing if you're a grown man.

They have no one to blame but themselves for breaking a by-law. Being a grown man doesn't give a person a license to be ignorant and act stupidly.

 

[uitar9]

I rarely play private clubs. I'm a muni guy. The one thing I have noticed at the private clubs tho: plastic surgery. Often, quite impressive. 

[hmu05366]

25 minutes ago, saevel25 said:

Depends on the club. I agree that a lot of private courses make it very difficult to let new people join. It very much can be, you have to know someone to just get the foot in the door.

Also, when they charge $10 K initiation fee, $10 K a year member dues, add in cart fees and a monthly spending requirement I don't think they are strapping for money. There isn't an incentive to really need new members.

They are a private organization that has the right to make their membership process how ever they want.

They have no one to blame but themselves for breaking a by-law. Being a grown man doesn't give a person a license to be ignorant and act stupidly.

 

I would hardly describe wearing the wrong kind of shirt as being "ignorant"... 

[David in FL]

4 minutes ago, hmu05366 said:

I would hardly describe wearing the wrong kind of shirt as being "ignorant"... 

You're right.  Ignorant means uninformed.  If they're a member, they know the bylaws, and therefore aren't ignorant.

Stupid would be a more appropriate characterization...

[iacas]

Wearing the wrong shirt could also just be a simple mistake.

It's not always ignorant or stupid.

But in the instance, @hmu05366, you just buy a shirt from the pro shop (or go home, or change into one in your locker, etc.), and don't make that mistake again.

[hmu05366]

2 minutes ago, iacas said:

Wearing the wrong shirt could also just be a simple mistake.

It's not always ignorant or stupid.

But in the instance, @hmu05366, you just buy a shirt from the pro shop (or go home, or change into one in your locker, etc.), and don't make that mistake again.

I appreciate the comments guys but the bit about etiquette wasn't really the main point of my post. It was about the reverse snobbery - have any of you encountered this? 

 

Cheers

[CarlSpackler]

This isn't just golf. If you move in to a neighborhood, visit a different church. People are always sizing up others. I always thought it would be interesting to dress up like a homeless person and wonder the streets or walk into a mall. Or from your perspective of reverse snobbery, dress up in a tux and go to a hole-in-the-wall bar.

[GolfLug]

3 hours ago, hmu05366 said:

I appreciate the comments guys but the bit about etiquette wasn't really the main point of my post. It was about the reverse snobbery - have any of you encountered this? 

 

Cheers

I guess some are intimidated or suspicious of everything/everybody new. But after a few rounds everybody gets to know you and you become good friends with them, yeah? Kinda like life in general, no? 

[hmu05366]

25 minutes ago, CarlSpackler said:

This isn't just golf. If you move in to a neighborhood, visit a different church. People are always sizing up others. I always thought it would be interesting to dress up like a homeless person and wonder the streets or walk into a mall. Or from your perspective of reverse snobbery, dress up in a tux and go to a hole-in-the-wall bar.

Yeh but I think it's the brazenness of some golf members openly commenting on what you're wearing or have in the bag... you don't encounter this in normal life really.  What you're talking about there is simply people being judgemental.  It's nobodies business what is in my golf bag.  

[rehmwa]

On 25/04/2011 at 4:29 AM, ilikefishes said:

Sounds like a great place to hang. Nothing like dealing with a bunch of snobs in an anonymous setting.

it's called the "internet" of "social media"   ; )

 

 

as for the topic:  snobbery.  I've encountered some serious, serious snobbery at many places.  HOWEVER, for each of these situations, I've met and befriended hundreds of strangers that were just fantastic.  And for those snob situations, more than half someone else in the group apologized for their acquaintance's actions or even called them out on it.

If someone gets snotty with me, I'll go out of my way to act in a way to really bug them.  Courtesy get courtesy, dickery gets dickery - it's up to them, I'll alway start/default with the best intent and expectations.

Edited August 21, 2017 by rehmwa

[WUTiger]

I haven't noticed so much snobbery in golf, but rather intolerance of self-proclaimed hard core golfers towards the average player.

Also, if the hard-core get kicked around in everyday life, golf becomes one place where they can lord it over lesser humans. I lived twice in a midsize town in Oklahoma, and the area had some of the most hateful golfers in the world. 

6 hours ago, saevel25 said:

Depends on the club. I agree that a lot of private courses make it very difficult to let new people join. It very much can be, you have to know someone to just get the foot in the door.

Also, when they charge $10 K initiation fee, $10 K a year member dues, add in cart fees and a monthly spending requirement I don't think they are strapping for money. There isn't an incentive to really need new members.

They are a private organization that has the right to make their membership process how ever they want.

As for private clubs, they are private. They make the rules. One example of private clubs that people don't realize are the Republican and Democratic political parties. Other than obeying existing statutes, they are pretty well free to do what they want, run what candidate they want.

In private country club courses, they have very strict rules. The former president of my University was a member of one such club, and he ended up on probation for 6 months for playing golf with his shirttail out  on a 103-degree day.

These clubs have probably three generations of golfers all intermingled, and the general manager has to keep peace among the Boomers and the GenXers and the few Millennials who might belong. Intergenerational cultural strife is a major headache for private club managers. People go ballistic over things like a young guy wearing his golf hat backwards (many clubs have a rule against this!), or a sweet young female wandering into the dining room in her bikini. The battle over where on club property one can wear denim is a common war.

If you don't want to follow the rules, find a different club. That's why many clubs have a yearlong trial period to see if the golfer and the club like each other.

Edited August 21, 2017 by WUTiger

[CarlSpackler]

3 hours ago, hmu05366 said:

Yeh but I think it's the brazenness of some golf members openly commenting on what you're wearing or have in the bag... you don't encounter this in normal life really.  What you're talking about there is simply people being judgemental.  It's nobodies business what is in my golf bag.  

As for me, I could give a **** less what people think of me or my bag. It sounds like you are allowing them to get under your skin. If someone gets snotty with me, which is very rare, I ignore it. If they persist, I get snotty right back. Life is too short to worry about such things.

[metbid]

On ‎10‎/‎13‎/‎2008 at 3:33 PM, RMD said:

There are snobs everywhere...try showing up at church in cut-offs.

LOL, at my church you wouldn't even stand out.  Our pastor preaches in a flannel shirt with the sleeves rolled up and his tattoos showing.

But as far as snobbery in golf goes, I have never seen more than any other sport, and probably a lot less than some.  Ever play pick-up basketball or volleyball at the Y or local gym and see the treatment the newbie or novice gets; the groans, eye rolls, curt remarks.....

I play at many different courses, and often as a single and really can't remember a time I felt snobbery from the staff or other players.

Edited August 21, 2017 by metbid

[hmu05366]

1 hour ago, CarlSpackler said:

As for me, I could give a **** less what people think of me or my bag. It sounds like you are allowing them to get under your skin. If someone gets snotty with me, which is very rare, I ignore it. If they persist, I get snotty right back. Life is too short to worry about such things.

Wise words there.

 

it doesn't really bother me on the grand scheme of things, it just kinda bugs me... and it's off putting because it's not exactly the friendly welcome you want from club members.  After playing golf my whole life it's just one of the few things that consistently irritates me about the sport 

[JonMA1]

At the courses I play, the other members often ridicule me because my shirts all have sleeves, my shorts are hemmed, my hat isn't (always) camouflage, and I don't sport confederate flag motif covers for my woods or driver.

I hate those snobby bastards!

[CarlSpackler]

4 hours ago, hmu05366 said:

Wise words there.

 

it doesn't really bother me on the grand scheme of things, it just kinda bugs me... and it's off putting because it's not exactly the friendly welcome you want from club members.  After playing golf my whole life it's just one of the few things that consistently irritates me about the sport 

I have taken more ridicule for playing by the rules of golf. I am called a golf Nazi. Some guy actually got Mad because I played 3 from the tee after yanking one OB. How's that for reverse snobbery. 

[iacas]

10 hours ago, hmu05366 said:

Yeh but I think it's the brazenness of some golf members openly commenting on what you're wearing or have in the bag... you don't encounter this in normal life really.  What you're talking about there is simply people being judgemental.  It's nobodies business what is in my golf bag.  

People are judgmental - and comment aloud on it - in all areas of life. Not all people, but in all areas, you'll find people commenting on… what kind of car you have, how you raise your children, what you're wearing, your job, how you spend your money, how you decorate your house, how you drive, whatever…

It's all just noise.