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3 hours ago, Buckeyebowman said:

To the OP. I think you are confusing yourself with too many thoughts. As far as the vid you posted, the guy's first example was nothing more than the "Sam Snead squat", which happens to be very effective.

It seems to me that you might be searching for perfection, and I will tell you right now that there is no such thing in golf! You need to find what works for you "most of the time". Believe me, that's what the pros at the U.S. Open this week are working with! How are the top three pros in the world doing so far?

And what works for you most of the time can change over time! This is evolution! Survival of the fittest and all that! 

You should quote who you are responding to because your comment is a little confusing... the OP is @iacas and this is an instructional thread.

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7 hours ago, mvmac said:

The hips, weight, left knee being forward allows you to then start "pushing" off the ground which also helps keep you turning.

 

Thank you mvmac. That is very helpful

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I for one would like to see the solution to cartierbresson's video.  It's thoughtful and covers a lot of what is in my mind 

i think some of his versions may generate power vs accuracy with pros and cons to go with it. 

I would like if we could get consensus on that as opposed to just leaving with whatever just feels best must be best. 

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19 hours ago, Rainmaker said:

Cool video - from my perspective:

method 1 is right - you might need more shoulder turn, or to keep your shoulders turned back longer to "make room".  Also when you said something like . ."from *here* I can really fire forward" ..your right knee looked like it wanted to go too early.  Perhaps it's because you were talking, though.  To me . .method #1 looks exactly like what I'm trying to do.   

Got it, thanks.

Quote

edit-  another thing I noticed was that you were talking at the top of your backswing quite easily.  Again, this may have been for the camera, but I'm so coiled up at the top of my backswing that I can't easily speak or hold it for too long.  That was one of those things I didn't *see* on video and it took me a while to realize I had no where near enough coil building up in my backswing.

I had a pretty hard time talking and keeping that position!

Quote

method 2 *could* be right but you'd need to "sit back" more with your back facing the target . .ie . .don't let your upper body move so much.  I think you have more than enough flexibility for method 1, though.

method 3 and 4 are both wrong.  Again - way too much lateral movement with the upper body.

Ok.

Quote

I'm searching for some kind of feel to help me with method 1 and right now I'm using that of a "step forward".  I imagine if I were going to hit a baseball  . .how I would take that big step forward . .I'm trying to do that with my *weight* and it's allowing me to really feel like I'm stepping into the ball.  I'm getting a great weight transfer and a great push off my back foot this way but my tendency is to "lose" some of the downward motion with my arms. 

I only just started really working on this move so chances are I'll be using a different feel by the time I'm done working on it.  Hope this helps a little.  I'd say keep working on method 1.  Find out "why" you don't have enough room and fix that.   It took me either 30 years or 5 years to get to this point in my swing (depending if you count times when I wasn't practicing, or playing lol) . .so I'd say you're doing pretty well!  Keep it up! 

Thanks. I tried feeling like I was hitting a baseball too and transferring my weight that way but I found that I could do that in quite a few different but similar ways -- and it leads to very different swings -- so I'm hoping I can really understand what I should be doing. Maybe those small differences don't matter a whole lot, but in that case I want to know for sure.

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3 hours ago, cartierbresson said:

Got it, thanks.

I had a pretty hard time talking and keeping that position!

Ok.

Thanks. I tried feeling like I was hitting a baseball too and transferring my weight that way but I found that I could do that in quite a few different but similar ways -- and it leads to very different swings -- so I'm hoping I can really understand what I should be doing. Maybe those small differences don't matter a whole lot, but in that case I want to know for sure.


What I like to do to try out new feel - like the baseball step, or squishing the tomato or various ones you can find that sort of address this . .pick one, spend 30 minutes or so grooving it in and then take a video of your swing and see what it does. 

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When I work on sliding my hips I like to feel like my lead shoulder moves towards the target which helps my hips slide smoother than usual.

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18 hours ago, billchao said:

You should quote who you are responding to because your comment is a little confusing... the OP is @iacas and this is an instructional thread.

So sorry, I got confused. Since cartierbresson had responded to my earlier post I took him as the OP. As I said earlier, I did not read through 46 pages of posts.

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17 hours ago, jp k said:

i think some of his versions may generate power vs accuracy with pros and cons to go with it. 

You shouldn't have to sacrifice one or the other. What's best or optimal for the player should produce both.

17 hours ago, jp k said:

I would like if we could get consensus on that as opposed to just leaving with whatever just feels best must be best.

Well I don't agree with that. When making a change, sometimes (even typically) what is best feels like crap at first.

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1 hour ago, mvmac said:

You shouldn't have to sacrifice one or the other. What's best or optimal for the player should produce both.

Well I don't agree with that. When making a change, sometimes (even typically) what is best feels like crap. 

Every time I made a change for something that worked better, It felt horrible for 2 or 3 rounds. You have to stick with it if you are getting good results ,no matter how bad it feels. 

Edited by Natural Patrick

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1 hour ago, Natural Patrick said:

Every time I made a change for something that worked better, It felt horrible for 2 or 3 rounds. You have to stick with it if you are getting good results ,no matter how bad it feels. 

I accept that as a "golf truth" . .what feels worst is best. 

If I leave my lesson hitting the ball better than ever before . .I got ripped off.  I *expect* to leave my lesson barely being able to make contact, confused and befuddled . .with an understanding of what I want to achieve but barely any idea of how I'll actually achieve it. 

I've noticed my instructor is on to this fact.  On several occasions, when we're deciding what to work on next, he'll ask me to do 2 different things and then ask me which feel more natural . .which is easiest to do.  Invariably, it's the *other* thing that is next up, lol. 

 

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12 hours ago, Rainmaker said:

If I leave my lesson hitting the ball better than ever before . .I got ripped off.  I *expect* to leave my lesson barely being able to make contact, confused and befuddled . .with an understanding of what I want to achieve but barely any idea of how I'll actually achieve it. 

I don't think it always has to be like this, just depends on the change. I've certainly had lessons where the change has felt "weird" but I've hit the ball better immediately. 

I think if you're going into a lesson struggling with your ballstriking you should leave seeing some positives, even if you're only making 3/4 length or 60% speed motions.

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6 hours ago, mvmac said:

I don't think it always has to be like this, just depends on the change. I've certainly had lessons where the change has felt "weird" but I've hit the ball better immediately. 

I think if you're going into a lesson struggling with your ballstriking you should leave seeing some positives, even if you're only making 3/4 length or 60% speed motions.

Yes, I will reverse my position and agree there.  That's how it's been for me *lately* . . I haven't left every single lesson totally unable to hit the ball.  I almost never leave hitting it *better* but there are usually some positives - like you say, at half speed, etc.  Right now, though, I'm learning to do stuff I've never done before in my swing so a lot the stuff in my lessons feels super awkward to me.  When I get around to refining stuff that I'm already doing semi-correctly, I'm sure it will get less weird.    

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I've been finding more distance with what I'll call a hip thrust or dramatic transfer of weight from the back hip to the front hip.  Is this the same thing as the hip slide?  I think this is what I used to do years ago but got away from it.

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2 hours ago, Kujan said:

I've been finding more distance with what I'll call a hip thrust or dramatic transfer of weight from the back hip to the front hip.  Is this the same thing as the hip slide?  I think this is what I used to do years ago but got away from it.

I did too. 2 clubs to be exact. Did you manage to keep your head in place as that is the hard part in dramatic shift and jump.

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4 hours ago, Peter_b said:

I did too. 2 clubs to be exact. Did you manage to keep your head in place as that is the hard part in dramatic shift and jump.

Absolutely because it is a controlled move.  Also it feels like it's the right thing to do.

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23 hours ago, Peter_b said:

I did too. 2 clubs to be exact. Did you manage to keep your head in place as that is the hard part in dramatic shift and jump.

Same here! Went and played today in the insufferable heat and humidity! Sometime during the round I began to feel how the left hip should function in the swing. I suddenly began striping every drive down the the center, and 20-30 yards farther than normal!

It's a very simple physical move, but it can make all the difference in the world!

And, it's not a "big" move, it can be very subtle. For instance, as Peter_b referred to it, you don't want your head moving toward the target, just your hip. Getting the head sliding toward the target is pure death!

The feeling I get is one of just "shoving" my left hip toward the target a little bit when I begin my downswing,

After a particularly fine drive I like to joke with my buddies that the secret of the golf swing lives in the left ass cheek!

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Yeah In the whole swing I let subconscious work but I check to things like a hawk. Head position and weight left foot and left heel. 

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