Official Tiger Car Crash/Infidelity Thread

[Chas]

I like how you are one to judge. Are you perfect? Ever make any mistakes in life? Do you condemn a person for life because of a mistake, which is not a crime? It's sad that people feel better about themselves because a person made a mistake and acted like an ass. I agree that what he did was wrong and is not repairable, but I believe in second chances and lets see what he does to try and right this ship.

You don't have to be perfect, or anywhere near perfect, to hold Tiger to ridicule and disgrace for the way he has treated his wife and his family for the last five years, not to mention how he has treated his fans with his self-serving public statements and false persona. Well we now know a lot more about the man than we did before and it's going to take more than a little hiatus from the game to set this one right. Let's not be naive, Tiger has probably been busy negotiating with his corporate sponsors to come up with an acceptable plan to keep the money flowing in, and here we have it. What a joke. Like someone else said, I'd have more respect for him if he faced the public on the tour - what a wimp.

What does how people feel about Tiger's personal behavior have to do with what they feel about themselves? - totally irrelevant. Tiger is fully responsible for what many people now think about him as a person, not as a golfer. Why don't you try forgetting about the game of golf for a minute and consider the man, and what all of this really says about him? It strikes me that many in this forum are incapable of even the feeblest attempt at doing that. It's a kind of religion. You call the women low-lifes but have nothing to say about your golfing hero, except "what he did was wrong" - what does that mean exactly? Worse than kicking a ball out of a deep divot on the fairway in your view ? - hard to tell. Those women at least were behaving in a way that was reasonably true to themselves, no great surprise there. That Tiger paid a bunch of high-(and low-) class hookers for sex says a heck of a lot more about Tiger than it says about the women. Tiger has been living a lie and has managed to build a $100M-a-year brand, a big part of which was of course his exemplary family life - makes you want to throw up. It's obvious that the only thing that matters to many people on this forum is the game of golf. To these people, Tiger = Golf, therefore .... Bad for Tiger = Bad for golf. All this talk about loss of revenue if Tiger stays away for a while - so what? If some people are only interested in the game because of one player, they obvious have no real appreciation for golf and the game doesn't need them in my opinion - it's better off without them.

[zeg]

Therefore he should walk away from the sport forever! Which we all know won't happen.

Therefore implies a logical connection between what comes before and what comes after. Why are you using it?

But the way I read your post, it sounds as if its OK for him to do what he has done, its OK for your child to see this as a positive role model his/her life after. "Well if Tiger does it it must be OK". No, I cannot in any way support that stance.

If that's what you get from reading my post, you obviously can't read very well. Tiger's relationship with his wife and family is his business, not yours. Whether you approve of his choices or not is up to you. He doesn't owe you anything.

He "does have an obligation to the people" and should he choose not recognize this, he doesn't desrve to be a public figure with the the benefits that accompany such positions.

He has no such obligation. It might be wise of him to apologize, but nothing he's ever done obligates him in any way to continue maintaining his status as a public figure. But look at that, he already DID apologize. It's up to you whether you want to be a fan, buy his products or boycott them, etc. But he owes you nothing more. If you thought you were buying future access to his private life when you bought that Gatorade, you were mistaken.

None of us know enough details of his family life to say a lot of the things that are being said here. Tiger and his family know what's going on, and it's up to them to decide the course of action. I don't see how doing anything more than he's already done is necessary or beneficial to that.

To your first point: he didn't just cheat on his wife, he cheated on his family the minute he was unfaithful. No good father does that. Any man that cheats is a selfish man.

Iacas already responded to this pretty adequately. I'll just add that the world is a lot more nuanced than you seem to think. People aren't just "good" or "evil."

Like I've said before, and like someone sort of added in this thread, golf was only considered a gentlemen's game because the people playing it were typically men who were well off (land owners and such), had liesure time, and were allowed on the course. There's no implied connection to gentlemanly behaviour.

Good post, although I don't know that he'd be suspended in any sport. I haven't seen an actual report of substance abuse that even hints he'd need to be in a program. Last I checked, getting in car accidents or sleeping around weren't causes for suspension, so I don't see how he's getting special treatment.

And yeah, for your first point especially, I find it amusing the holier than thou attitude that comes up. Golf is pretty well known for encouraging some unseemly behavior... just read some of the posts about cart girls for evidence of that...

[NormH3]

If some people are only interested in the game because of one player, they obvious have no real appreciation for golf and the game doesn't need them in my opinion - it's better off without them.

Nailed it!

[golf_junkie27]

well, hindsight has its advantage. it would have been a bold if not a smarter move if tiger had a press conference immediately after the car wreck and revealed to the world his extramarital affairs in a lump sum, instead of what we are seeing now, one thong at a time. he could have said:

I never wrote Tiger should be held in the same regard. I wrote specifically that like them he should have come before the camera.

No one in baseball is bigger than Arod and no one is bigger than Kobe in the NBA. All three are Nike guys and yes, Tiger should have learned something from both and put a kabosh on it by coming forward and not sending wire transfers.

[golfdad]

I never wrote Tiger should be held in the same regard. I wrote specifically that like them he should have come before the camera.

i am not in a position to second guess what tiger team should have done instead of what they did, but one thing that is possibly agreeable is that the tiger team in the past 10 years has done a remarkable job creating a world known brand, reshaping the face and possibly the future of a sport, something the agents of arod and kobe cannot achieve, mostly because i think it is due to the uniqueness of tiger woods, the inborn talent to be a history in the making. some outside usa follow kobe, not many are familiar with arod (just like some of us are not familiar with messi). tiger, with his multi-cultural background, is imo as well known globally as the coca cola brand. to come in front of a camera to self incriminate (well, sort of) is not a move that can be taken lightly by his agents right after the wreck. for one, tiger might even have kept his agents in the dark until just recently. those lawyers are not gamblers and for a moment they probably could not effectively evaluate the risks and benefits of the next move to take.

my personal feeling is either say nothing at all or tell everything honestly. tiger said a little (can transgression simply mean hitting the fire hydrant? :). that is like the fuse, like feeding the wild animals so they keep coming back for more to wear him out.

[Lemay427]

You call the women low-lifes but have nothing to say about your golfing hero, except "what he did was wrong" - what does that mean exactly? Worse than kicking a ball out of a deep divot on the fairway in your view ? - hard to tell. Those women at least were behaving in a way that was reasonably true to themselves, no great surprise there. That Tiger paid a bunch of high-(and low-) class hookers for sex says a heck of a lot more about Tiger than it says about the women. Tiger has been living a lie and has managed to build a $100M-a-year brand, a big part of which was of course his exemplary family life - makes you want to throw up.

What Tiger did was wrong to his FAMILY. I am not to judge what someone does behind closed doors. People put Tiger on a pedestal because of his golf. Tiger was/is very private. We never knew his family (besides Earl). His wife never spoke in public. All we saw is what we watched on TV or at the tournaments.

You think a "big" part of his fortunes was because he had a wife and kids? Are you serious? You don't think 99% of the reason Tiger was making millions is because he is world #1, 14 majors, and black/asian? I am 26 and do not have any kids yet. If I did, I would still want my son/daughter to look up to Tiger, FOR HIS GOLF GAME AND APPARENT WORK ETHIC IN THE GAME. Even if these events would not have come out, we still wouldn't know jack shit about Tiger. He isn't in the public eye off the course. I won't watch golf without Tiger. I don't care about watching the rest.

[Three Putt]

Elin is nuts if she takes him back after he is out banging porn stars. They can be friends and be good parents. Then he can chase all the •••••s he wants and blow fortunes on his own time.

I think 95% of the excitement for him was that he was doing it while married. What a head case...really.

[Three Putt]

What Tiger did was wrong to his FAMILY. I am not to judge what someone does behind closed doors. People put Tiger on a pedestal because of his golf. Tiger was/is very private. We never knew his family (besides Earl). His wife never spoke in public. All we saw is what we watched on TV or at the tournaments.

I take it you have never seen an event live? It's incredible what these guys can do. Your loss.

[Lemay427]

Like I've said before, and like someone sort of added in this thread, golf was only considered a gentlemen's game because the people playing it were typically men who were well off (land owners and such), had liesure time, and were allowed on the course. There's no implied connection to gentlemanly behaviour.

Oh you don't mean the gentlemen at Augusta that wouldn't allow a black person into the club?

[Lemay427]

I take it you have never seen an event live? It's incredible what these guys can do. Your loss.

I believe I have been to 7 pro events including 2006 and 2007 PGA Championship. Went to the BMW Championship last year. I play golf, I don't watch it unless Tiger is playing. It's not interesting to me.

[golf1234]

Tiger can attract many casual fans to watch golf, while most other golfers can't. If you like watching golf, you would continue to watch golf with or without Tiger next season and certainly would continue to watch golf after Tiger retires. However, the Tour will get hit pretty hard without Tiger since the casual fans wouldn't watch golf without Tiger. Anyway, I will still enjoying watching golf next season, but also hope that Tiger will return sooner rather than later.

[Three Putt]

I believe I have been to 7 pro events including 2006 and 2007 PGA Championship. Went to the BMW Championship last year. I play golf, I don't watch it unless Tiger is playing. It's not interesting to me.

I will agree with you. Tiger damn sure makes it fun to watch, great shots mixed in with club throwing and temper tantrums...which I find entertaining.

Also Ocho Cinco is one of my favorite football players. I like to be entertained, I could care less about pro sports...just like the pro's do..it's all about the money.

[PaddyHarrington]

I haven't read the whole thread so dunno if it has already been posted but does anyone else think the major winners next year will all have a question mark against their wins because Tiger wasn't around?

[MSDOGS1976]

I don't watch it unless Tiger is playing. It's not interesting to me.

To each their own, but I have watched and enjoyed golf for years before Tiger came along. It makes no difference to me if he ever plays again, but I will still get the same enjoyment watching and following golf as I always have. Heck, I enjoy watching the ladies and the Champions tour.

[Three Putt]

I haven't read the whole thread so dunno if it has already been posted but does anyone else think the major winners next year will all have a question mark against their wins because Tiger wasn't around?

Not at all..he didn't win one this year. I think he plays all 4 and he hopefully will be more focused on important things in his life and his blessings, the golf will take care of itself and he could win all 4 maybe..or 1, 2 3, or none. I think his sex charade cost him a couple of majors over the past couple of years.

People seem to forget that he is playing against the best golfers in the world, any one of them or a couple of them always seem to get hot in the majors (Cabrerra, Paddy, Immelman, Cink, Yang, Glover). When he was younger he was an undeniable force, maybe not so much now a days in the big events.

[The Road Dog]

For the average sports fan or American citizen... golf interest begins and ends with Tiger. Look at the viewership and ticket sales of the chevron world challenge if you're still not convinced.

You make an interesting point, but golf purists would likely be better off if the average sports fan or American citizen weren't able to get their Tiger fix. Courses wouldn't be as crowed with newbies and companies wouldn't be pushing new driver designs out the door every 6 months. We could get back to a more sedate golf lifestyle. Less glitz and glamour.

[The Road Dog]

I haven't read the whole thread so dunno if it has already been posted but does anyone else think the major winners next year will all have a question mark against their wins because Tiger wasn't around?

What would the question mark be? Those who win go in the records books and get to cash the checks. No shows and DNFs may be talked about by sports casters for a while but they get no lasting accolades nor should they. A Tiger on the sidelines doesn't cast any doubt on the skills of the winning players. I follow Bicycling and I can tell you the winner of the Tour De France after Lance Armstrong's retirement had to work to get there and no one thinks " he only won because Lance wasn't here". So it goes in any sport, the quest to be the best will not wait for sideliners.

[Chas]

I believe I have been to 7 pro events including 2006 and 2007 PGA Championship. Went to the BMW Championship last year. I play golf, I don't watch it unless Tiger is playing. It's not interesting to me.

And that's your choice, but it does raise the question - just what is it about Tiger vs. all the other players out there that makes him the

one and only player worth watching? Sure I enjoy watching Tiger at Torrey every year (for a few holes) and it's a shame he won't be there in 2010 but the idea that I wouldn't show up because he isn't there ....... absurd. The pleasure I get from watching all those marvellous and diverse golfers is far, far greater than any one player could possibly provide. One of the things I like about golf as a spectator is the great variety of playing styles that you witness out there, any one of which is capable of winning a particular tournament. You must expect Tiger to win every tournament he participates in. How disappointed you must be most of the time.