Nick Faldo Proves You can be Good AND Oblivious

[iacas]

Nick Faldo did a nice job showing how you can be a really, really good golfer and yet still be oblivious or flat out wrong:

[right handed phil mickelson]

I believe on the escape fade I heard him explaning why you collapse your left arm (to help open the clubface or something along those lines). Nice try though iacas

[iacas]

Nice try though iacas

I think you've missed the point. It's not about your arms... it's about ball flight laws.

You need to aim the clubface where you want the ball to start, not where you want it to finish. As I said, this proves that you can have a lot of success and be a great golfer, but not be qualified to teach or espouse your theories. Yet we see it all the time.

[Gordon McTavish]

As soon as I saw point number 3 for the Escape Draw, I thought, "That's getting a thread on TheSandrap!"

[iacas]

As soon as I saw point number 3 for the Escape Draw, I thought, "That's getting a thread on TheSandrap!"

Point #1 is the worst. This isn't about rotating the arms. It's about ball flight. #1 and #2 in each combine to illustrate that Nick Faldo doesn't know why a golf ball flies the way it does.

[popey]

It appears to me that Faldo is not the most popular guy in the world. I have seen on countless occasions that people will jump on his back for the slightest thing. It maybe that I am English so a little biased and also the fact that we do not get to listen to him commentating.

[Zeph]

I'm not surprised, seeing as every fade/draw tip spoken, written or demonstrated out there use the same analogy. Except the chicken wing part, don't think I've read that one before.

Shouldn't magazines, so called experts and analysts have learned what Trackman has proven by now? You will get spin in the ball, and it will take off on a line not perfectly square to where the clubface aim, but you don't want to set up like that. With the clubface a couple of degrees open or shut, you are in the proper place. Doing a chicken wing or rolling the arms is the path to inconsistency. Making the same swing, but with altered alignment target and slightly altered clubface will be far easier to be consistent with.

[iacas]

It appears to me that Faldo is not the most popular guy in the world. I have seen on countless occasions that people will jump on his back for the slightest thing. It maybe that I am English so a little biased and also the fact that we do not get to listen to him commentating.

Nah, that's not it. I've never disliked Nick. It's just that, in this case, he's wrong. He also despises S&T; without really understanding it, but that's a different topic. The topic here is the continued abuse of knowledge by those in charge of putting it out there. In this case, Nick isn't helping anyone - and may even be hurting - to say these kinds of things.

Shouldn't magazines, so called experts and analysts have learned what Trackman has proven by now?

You would think... I hear PGA pros (the ones that teach) are slowly coming around to the new understanding of ball flight laws. But it's still taking quite awhile...

[uttexas]

Faldo, Golf Digest, the Golf Channel all need to study up on the modern and correct ball flight laws.

The pros that "believe" in the old theory of aiming at the target and swinging along your stance line get away with it by manipulating their swing paths, hands in relation to clubface at impact, and weight transfer on the forward swing.

To hit a big push hook (for a righty) that starts right and curves back left----open clubface, ball slightly back in stance, swing in to out, hands infront of clubface at impact, full transfer of weight onto forward foot at impact.

To hit a big pull fade (for a righty) that starts left and curves back right---close clubface slightly, ball forward in stance, swing out to in, keep more weight on the rear foot at impact.

[MSDOGS1976]

I think you've missed the point. It's not about your arms... it's about ball flight laws.

So he is saying one thing but did something different when he played? Or he just doesn't know how to illustrate what he did.

[bogeyhitter25]

I don't care. In my honest opinion Nick Faldo is the best announcer there is.

[iacas]

I don't care. In my honest opinion Nick Faldo is the best announcer there is.

If a guy that says the opposite of fact is the "best announcer there is" then that's not saying very much good about everyone else. I know better than to listen to the dumb stuff he says, but that's different than not caring. I care because he's doing golfers who don't know any better a dis-service with his misinformation.

Today Faldo added that "a level hip turn and level knees are key for accuracy and distance." Uh hmmmm. OK there buddy. Cuz you were such a power hitter.

[Tiger Spuds]

Yeah, for a guy that's 6 ft 3 and well built, he hit it like a p***y.

Wait.. that sounds familiar..

Lets be honest.He's a pompous, arrogant windbag and mediocre announcer at best.Some of those 'Hawaii Fald-o' spots were the laziest, vaguest Pro 'tips' I've ever seen.

[zeg]

So he is saying one thing but did something different when he played? Or he just doesn't know how to illustrate what he did.

I think it's the former. I suspect that he was taught what he said, then learned to set up like that and get the result he wanted. Since you can't actually feel the position of the club head at impact, there's no way you'll realize that you're not hitting like you set up unless you look at it on video.

So, to be a touch pedantic, it's not quite fair to call him oblivious because he tells you how he sets up. It does suggest he plays by feel and may not be the best guy to take lessons from, though...

[iammpspeer]

Iacas, can you please start a new thread on how to hit a fade or draw? This is the way everyone on the GC and in magazines teach it. Aim at where you want it to go, point your feet at where you want it to start, and swing along your stance plane. This is even how tiger taught it in one of his youtube videos. So what is the proper way? Everyone says you can do it without manipulating your original swing.

[Tiger Spuds]

Iacas, can you please start a new thread on how to hit a fade or draw? This is the way everyone on the GC and in magazines teach it. Aim at where you want it to go, point your feet at where you want it to start, and swing along your stance plane. This is even how tiger taught it in one of his youtube videos. So what is the proper way? Everyone says you can do it without manipulating your original swing.

Tiger taught that in a video?Strange, considering he doesn't use that technique at all.90% of it is in the hands for him.The simpler method is, I'm sure, a watered-down version aimed at mid to high handicappers who haven't got the technique to shape their shots using swing path and hand position alone, and thus is the most commonly taught method.

[iacas]

Iacas, can you please start a new thread on how to hit a fade or draw? This is the way everyone on the GC and in magazines teach it. ... So what is the proper way? Everyone says you can do it without manipulating your original swing.

You can.

Aim the clubface where you want the ball to start. Close or open your stance based on how you want the ball to curve. That's the basic version. You can get into slightly different hand positions but you're better off saving that for later... (forward = more draw, back = more fade).

[Shanks A Million]

I don't like to call someone stupid for saying something that may have been incorrect.

The problem is that golfers feel and do two different things. Faldo is constantly berated by golfers. There have been several very negative comments about him in this thread. Others believe he's a short hitter, likely because of a commercial that cut his words to make it sound like he said a shot went 20 yards farther, even though he was saying a mishit went 20 yards farther if you watch the unedited video. His average driving distance in 2004 was 297.6 yards, not short, even by today's standards.

You don't win 6 majors without knowing a thing or two about golf. He is teaching what he feels he does, right or wrong. Most of the tour players I have met were not overly technical, they were more interested in getting the ball to the hole in whatever way worked. So maybe he makes mistakes, but he's human. Any of us in that booth, and given that task would have hate threads about us as well.