"Swing Machine Golf" by Paul Wilson

[iacas]

Instead of wowing people with my knowledge, why not explain it to them in a way they can understand and gets results?  I think this would be more productive.

I'm asking you to do that here, and you're reluctant to do so, or you don't want to do so.

I don't particularly care for the insinuation that I talk about a whole bunch of physics and science when I'm giving a lesson. Many people right here on this site can attest to how I give a lesson, as well as the knowledge used to give that lesson - I understand the physics, but that doesn't mean I ever talk about physics during a lesson.

It just seems you are forming an opinion of my technique before you even know what I teach.  Why not just ask the question civilly instead of ... things like:  "there is no way this can happen" ... "it can't do that" ... etc. etc.

I think everyone's being quite civil. You've been… reluctant. And of course I'm forming an opinion. So is everyone else reading this. But "forming" does not mean "have formed and will never change." So change my opinion. Talk about something meaningful. Show us a video of your own swing. If you're willing to engage in meaningful conversation, please begin.

Meaningful conversation is not "I'm great, and I have sold DVDs to prove it." Paul, we've had the best selling golf instructional DVD for the past year, so if that's how you measure success or greatness or whatever, then I'll happily take you on there. Please stop talking yourself up and start engaging in actual, significant conversation . Embed a video here and we'll discuss it. Write some meaningful content here and we'll discuss it.

In other words, enough of me talking to you, and you talking to me. Share something of substance, and we can discuss it, or answer questions that come from members.

[boil3rmak3r]

Erik, I see the golf swing differently that others.  My technique was not always based on the machine.   For the first 8 years, I taught people to look like pros when they swung. I knew what Iron Byron was back then but never gave it a second thought.  In 1999, the internet was gaining popularity so I went online and found True Temper's website.  On it I saw a looping video of the Iron Byron.  To me, it looked like a golfer as it kept swinging the club.  After making this realization, I grabbed my golf digest magazines and opened up the swing sequences of various pros.  I freeze framed the Iron Byron and compared them side by side.  Every pro I put beside the machine matched up with the machine frame by frame.  Here are a couple of examples: [URL=http://paulwilsongolf.com/tiger_1.htm]Tiger Woods Swing Sequence vs. Iron Byron[/URL] [URL=http://paulwilsongolf.com/ernie_els_1.htm]Ernie Els Swing Sequence vs. Iron Byron[/URL] After seeing this, I decided to analyze the machine.  The machine hit the ball 100% consistently whereas pros were only about 70%.  To me the machine looked simple yet it got perfect results.  So why not at least look at it?  In looking at it I realized it only had 3 elements that allowed it to hit perfect shots: 1.  Circular Rotation 2.  An Unrestricted Hinge 3.  A Constant Forward Tilt These are the elements I teach in Swing Machine Golf.  I want to make it simple for people to understand and to get great results. From the thousands of testimonials I have received I think what I am teaching is working.  Whoever wants to come out and watch me teach is more than welcome to do so.  Just let me know. Here is what the inventor of Iron Byron, George Manning has to say about how he invented the machine: I answered most of these questions in my very first post. Here are the answers to your questions again: It doesn't have legs: ANSWER:  The motor represents the golfers legs It doesn't have a weight shift:  ANSWER: it is a machine designed to test golf clubs.  It doesn't need to have a weight shift.  The golfer shifts their weight to power their swing. so how much weight is on the left foot at impact ?  ANSWER: 70-90% It swings on plane:  ANSWER: yes, it swings on plane. It replicates Bryon Nelson's downswing. it doesn't have wrists:  ANSWER: yes it has a hinge at the end of the arm which represents the golfer's wrists. a poor grip: ANSWER:  the club is held in a sleeve representing the golfer grip. bad alignment: it aligns wherever they align the machine for what shot they want it to hit.  I don't see how this is bad alignment.  Paul Wilson

Paul, I have a TON of respect for you in coming into this website and engaging in conversation. Not many professionals would do that. I also think you've made some awesome YouTube videos. I bought your book a few years ago and think it was very informative. As a 7 handicap that is always trying to get better (I hope to get down to a 5 next year - you know how that goes...), I've done a bunch of research on golf swings. I'm wondering if you can give me your thoughts on two things regarding your book. 1. You preach rotational movement in the golf swing and specifically say that a hip slide is a fault (see pages 47 and 53 of your book). At the same time, you want 70 - 90 percent of the golfer's weight to be on the left foot at impact. I struggle with this... If I want to get that much weight on my left side at impact without any sort of hip slide, I'll have to do one of two things - either preset my hips way forward (which goes against your recommended set up), or sway my upper body to the left during the downswing. Can you clarify how I eliminate hip slide and get my weight properly shifted to the left side at impact? 2. As I've gotten better as a golfer, I've notice that I've had to actually correct arm and hand positions. I really like your idea of keeping the wrists loose to produce the highest swing speeds. But what if that means I banana slice every shot, no matter what grip I take? Is there some point where I'll need to think about changing my arm/wrist/hand positions for the swing? Again, from what I've learned about you, you seem to be a great instructor. I hope this doesn't come across as me knocking you (heck, I wish I had half the game you did...). Any insights would be appreciated.

[Slowcelica]

Boilermaker, Are you using the grip described in Paul's book? I too used to have that banana slice with my driver but since I've started Paul's program I have been hitting most of my drives straight as long as I don't intentionally slide my hips or try to kill the ball. Have you watched the you tube video of Paul's called how to cure a slide?

[boil3rmak3r]

Boilermaker, Are you using the grip described in Paul's book? I too used to have that banana slice with my driver but since I've started Paul's program I have been hitting most of my drives straight as long as I don't intentionally slide my hips or try to kill the ball. Have you watched the you tube video of Paul's called how to cure a slide?

Thanks for the suggestions. My questions were more geared toward better understanding Paul's methodology. I've become somewhat of a nerd in terms of learning the golf swing and am interested in different ideas from different pros. My scenario of a banana slice was just that, a scenario. I play a consistent draw and struggle to work the ball left to right when the shot calls for it. Also, my grip is a bit more weak than Paul suggests. As for my first question... Maybe I would have been better served to ask Paul if he felt everyone had a natural hip slide... Think about it... If your hips turn in a truly rotational manner, yet 70 - 90 percent of your weight should be on the front foot at impact, how can that happen? If the hips are truly rotational, your belt buckle would be the center of the rotation. How can that happen without having a terrible reverse pivot? I was just hoping he could speak to that... As for the arms/hands/wrists question, again, I just wanted to learn more about his thoughts...

[xerex250]

paul wislon describes swinging easy which ive tried. he says that if you want more distance that you should first swing easy and you will hit your best shot when you were swinging hard. its just not logical. i swung easy and the ball went 50 yds. with driver. i dont think paul knows what hes talking about. i did his method and my drives went straight but about 75 yards on average. even with the fast hips idea that he gioves, wthats when i lose all control. my arms are still losse, mind you. its just that i cant use his method without either hurting my lower back from the coiling or having terrible shots and no distance. makes me wonder if what hes selling is legitimate.

[xerex250]

by the way Boil3rmak3r your handicap is fine. you know more than paul wilson knows most likely. i bet paul cant break 90. most teachers teach the swing but dont score very well. david leadbetter cant break 80. i dont truly know how paul wilson scores, but with that easy swing of his its like something like 100 yards with driver and with that much distance no one could break 100. not insulting him, just using common sense.

[xerex250]

just to give you a heads up im a 20 handicap because in my entire life of playing golf ive only actually played 10 rounds. i usually just hit balls in my yard or at the range. this is how i know my distances. but ive only ever played 9 to 10 rounds and logically i wouldnt score well because i dont have thje experience on the course. i did break 100 5th time. so i guess im doing something right. and yes i did count penalty strokes and played by the rules.

[Slowcelica]

just to give you a heads up im a 20 handicap because in my entire life of playing golf ive only actually played 10 rounds. i usually just hit balls in my yard or at the range. this is how i know my distances. but ive only ever played 9 to 10 rounds and logically i wouldnt score well because i dont have thje experience on the course. i did break 100 5th time. so i guess im doing something right. and yes i did count penalty strokes and played by the rules.

Xerox, Paul says to swing at about 70% of your normal swing at first because most people swing as hard as they can and lose accuracy and control, also when you swing and try to kill the ball you do what is called a chicken wing with your arms, as well as try to use your arms to much in the swing. What Paul teaches is not that different than what other teachers teach, it's just the way he teaches it that is different, he simplifies it and breaks the swing down in a way that makes it easy to understand.

[mvmac]

Xerox, Paul says to swing at about 70% of your normal swing at first because most people swing as hard as they can and lose accuracy and control, also when you swing and try to kill the ball you do what is called a chicken wing with your arms, as well as try to use your arms to much in the swing.

People chicken wing because they don't want to hit the ground 5 feet behind it, not because they "use their arms too much".  Creating some decent arm speed is very beneficial in good golf swings.

[xerex250]

i just applied pauls full method now. still dont have as much distance as i would like but at least the thing is hit solid and straight.

[xerex250]

i did post on another area that i was going back to my noprmal swing. goes very far but less accruate than usual. so i will styick with short hitting.

[Slowcelica]

People chicken wing because they don't want to hit the ground 5 feet behind it, not because they "use their arms too much".  Creating some decent arm speed is very beneficial in good golf swings.

Arm speed to me is different than trying to hit the ball with your arms.

[iacas]

i just applied pauls full method now.

No you didn't. I don't care what the method or "swing philosophy" is, you can't just "decide" to apply it and then do so.

[Slowcelica]

No you didn't. I don't care what the method or "swing philosophy" is, you can't just "decide" to apply it and then do so.

Lol

[csciguy77]

So here's the deal. I really suck at golf but really want to get better. I have tried Paul's method without much success. I recently picked up Ben Hogan's Five Lessons book, and it seems that this information completely contradicts what Paul is saying, especially when it comes to the stance. My take on Ben Hogan's stance lesson is that you should have tight arms close to your body with elbows as close together as possible, as evidenced by the image with the web around his arms. I have been hitting some practice shots with this tighter setup and it appears to have improved things, at least over the couple days I have tried it. My question is this: how do you reconcile the "powerless arms" approach with the tight to the body and elbows close together approach that Ben recommends? I find it much harder to repeat my swing with the powerless arms approach, because my arms are loose and flying all over the place. How should I proceed? Would most people here say they use powerless arms or tighten them so they are close together? Is Hogan's method antiquated, or am I missing something? Thanks in advance for any feedback.

[14ledo81]

So here's the deal. I really suck at golf but really want to get better. I have tried Paul's method without much success. I recently picked up Ben Hogan's Five Lessons book, and it seems that this information completely contradicts what Paul is saying, especially when it comes to the stance. My take on Ben Hogan's stance lesson is that you should have tight arms close to your body with elbows as close together as possible, as evidenced by the image with the web around his arms. I have been hitting some practice shots with this tighter setup and it appears to have improved things, at least over the couple days I have tried it. My question is this: how do you reconcile the "powerless arms" approach with the tight to the body and elbows close together approach that Ben recommends? I find it much harder to repeat my swing with the powerless arms approach, because my arms are loose and flying all over the place. How should I proceed? Would most people here say they use powerless arms or tighten them so they are close together? Is Hogan's method antiquated, or am I missing something? Thanks in advance for any feedback.

I think they are both more or less "feels". Either could work for different people. JMO

[csciguy77]

I guess that is what I don't understand. To me it feels totally different to have my elbows tight together versus having my arms just powerless, hanging down.

[Holein1]

csciguy-

I'm not a great golfer, but have read and studied the same stuff you have.   I think it might be helpful to remove the word "tight" from your application of Hogan's material.   Your arms could be very close together, yet not "tight".  Tight, to me, implies tight muscles, tension, etc which is the worse thing for any golf swing.   I'm sure you can have your arms close together, but still relaxed... That way you can blend Hogan's setup/swing ideas with Paul's.  I know Paul does not seem to make a big deal about your arms being real close together.  He tries to keep things as simple as possible and to get things to flow together automatically.  By the way, if your arms are flying all over the place as you say, I'm thinking you need to look at how you are  coiling and uncoiling.