Hank Haney's Book "The Big Miss" about his time teaching Tiger

[turtleback]

Originally Posted by brocks

Wait till you get to the part where Hank used wire hangers to hang up his clothes.

WHAT???  Tiger made him use WIRE hangers?  The b@st@rd!!!

But the book is just about the golf.  Everyone knows what a crucial role popsicles play in golf.

I can see the part where Tiger tells Elin that they do not throw parties to celebrate wins.  That gives some insight into Tiger's mindset.  But then Haney oversteps and claims that her smiles got smaller and smaller at subsequent tournaments - and some commentators transmogrify that into Tiger telling Elin she could not smile at tournaments.  And what does any of THIS have to do with the golf?

[jhwmusic]

Wait till you get to the part where Hank used wire hangers to hang up his clothes.

How dare he!! That explains why Hank always had those nipple looking things on the shoulders of all his shirts! ;-)

[meenman]

Originally Posted by turtleback

WHAT???  Tiger made him use WIRE hangers?  The b@st@rd!!!

But the book is just about the golf.  Everyone knows what a crucial role popsicles play in golf.

I can see the part where Tiger tells Elin that they do not throw parties to celebrate wins.  That gives some insight into Tiger's mindset.  But then Haney oversteps and claims that her smiles got smaller and smaller at subsequent tournaments - and some commentators transmogrify that into Tiger telling Elin she could not smile at tournaments.  And what does any of THIS have to do with the golf?

Honestly, through the 1st 4+ chapters I have read, it is about golf and Hank.

[ggallant1]

I finished the book yesterday and seems like a lot of comments in this thread are based on excerpts or hearsay about Hank. Take the time and read the book and your opinion will change drastically. The book is hard to put down and gets into a lot of Hanks philosophies around the golf swing, and Tiger's swing in particular. It IS a golf book. Does he get off on short tangents about Tiger's obsession with the military, his personal life, and his moodiness? Yes, but that probably makes up 5% of the book.

Read the book, you may be surprised at what you learn and how interested you become in different swing theories.

[turtleback]

Originally Posted by ggallant1

I finished the book yesterday and seems like a lot of comments in this thread are based on excerpts or hearsay about Hank. Take the time and read the book and your opinion will change drastically. The book is hard to put down and gets into a lot of Hanks philosophies around the golf swing, and Tiger's swing in particular. It IS a golf book. Does he get off on short tangents about Tiger's obsession with the military, his personal life, and his moodiness? Yes, but that probably makes up 5% of the book.

Read the book, you may be surprised at what you learn and how interested you become in different swing theories.

That may be.  But it is exactly THAT 5% that got the book published and is what the publishers CHOSE to highlight in their releases of those excerpts.  And a pint of sewage in a barrel of wine turns the whole barrel into sewage.

And unless someone convincingly says that those excerpts are not in the book at all, then no, I won't read the book.

[k-troop]

Originally Posted by turtleback

That may be.  But it is exactly THAT 5% that got the book published and is what the publishers CHOSE to highlight in their releases of those excerpts.  And a pint of sewage in a barrel of wine turns the whole barrel into sewage.

And unless someone convincingly says that those excerpts are not in the book at all, then no, I won't read the book.

Well, the book was going to get published regardless.  I'm sure HH had a contract with a guaranteed number of first-print copies and a sizeable advance.  However, the publisher certainly chose to excerpt the portions which would generate the most buzz.

Just like a comedy movie where the trailer is much funnier than the movie, the publisher chose to excerpt the only really interesting portions of the book.  Apparently.  And it's quite possible that, in the context of a 250-page book, those four or five pages seem much less extreme.

Again, I think I posted this a few times before:  we kinda have to read the book before we can really judge it.

[Harmonious]

Originally Posted by turtleback

That may be.  But it is exactly THAT 5% that got the book published and is what the publishers CHOSE to highlight in their releases of those excerpts.  And a pint of sewage in a barrel of wine turns the whole barrel into sewage.

And unless someone convincingly says that those excerpts are not in the book at all, then no, I won't read the book.

Of course you'll read the book at some time.  As a Tiger fan, why wouldn't you?  You can now pass over the 5% you detest, and just read the other 95%, much of which hopefully will have to do with how Tiger revamped his swing yet again. Seems like all golfers would be interested in that aspect if nothing else.

[brocks]

Of course you'll read the book at some time. As a Tiger fan, why wouldn't you?

Yeah, I'm going to read it, but I'm not going to buy it. Haney's already made millions from his association with Tiger, so he can do without my 30 bucks or whatever. I'll get it from the library.

[jhwmusic]

Yeah, I'm going to read it, but I'm not going to buy it. Haney's already made millions from his association with Tiger, so he can do without my 30 bucks or whatever. I'll get it from the library.

I hear you...I want to read it out of total curiosity. But I despise Hank Haney and he will not give him any of my money. Hank is a bigger Wh$re than the chicks Tiger was banging.

[meenman]

Originally Posted by jhwmusic

I hear you...I want to read it out of total curiosity. But I despise Hank Haney and he will not give him any of my money. Hank is a bigger Wh$re than the chicks Tiger was banging.

It cost about $13 for the kindle version, along with mailing me my free dvd - I doubt my money will be any more life changing to him than it is to me.

[mvmac]

Craig Carton from WFAN-New York's "Boomer and Carton" radio show called Hank Haney a "snake in the grass" -- among other things -- for writing a book about his former student Tiger Woods. The full interview is online here .Here are some highlights from Carton and Haney's exchanges, which grow increasingly heated and end with Haney hanging up after 23 minutes.

CARTON: You talk about his wife in the book.

HANEY: I talk about his wife only in areas where it pertains to his golf. The first time I talk about his wife is when she asked Tiger, "What are we going to do to celebrate?" And Tiger said, "We don't celebrate victories like this because..."

CARTON: Hank, you talked about the icy stares between the two of them after the accident when you saw him on the range outside of his house. What's that got to do with golf?

HANEY: Because Tiger was preparing for his first tournament back, which was the Masters. I was there preparing with him.

CARTON: Right.

HANEY: It was pertinent to his mindset at the time. When you're a golfer, obviously, it's a very mental game, and I thought that was pertinent to his...

CARTON: Let me ask you this:  Do you not...

HANEY: His preparation. So when I'm saying something like that in the book, one little comment about an icy stare, I don't think that's getting terribly personal.

CARTON: But it goes beyond golf. It goes beyond what happens inside the ropes.

HANEY: People have different opinions and I'm very aware that's going to be the case, but I'm not the first coach who's ever written a book...

CARTON: But it doesn't matter. Don't you think it's a violation?

HANEY: I don't feel like it was.

CARTON: You don't see that Tiger Woods allowed you into his world, obviously paid you I assume a decent amount of money to be his coach. Without Tiger Woods, you're not getting TV shows, you're not writing books. And you don't view it as a basic violation of the man's trust?

HANEY: Listen, I view it as my memories too. These weren't just his memories. He didn't have an exclusive on those memories. I wanted to share my observations, my thoughts, about his greatness, the complexities that make him up as a golfer, as a person. If I had all positive things in the book, it wouldn't have been an honest book. I wanted to write an honest book about working with Tiger Woods and the observations I made about his greatness and what it was like to coach him. And I realize people are going to have different opinions, but I'm not the first coach who's ever written a book. Phil Jackson wrote a book...

CARTON: It doesn't make it right though.

Then Carton says the book is egotistical.

CARTON: You come across a couple times in the book, in my opinion, almost like you want to be a martyr. "I did so much for Tiger. I was there for Tiger. I wanted to quit so many times but I didn't for Tiger." And the other thing you do, which is fascinating to me and shows me insight into you having never met you, is that you spend a chapter in the book when it's so important to you to compare Tiger Woods' win-loss percentage with you as his coach versus Butch Harmon as his coach. Which is such an egotistical play, I'm trying to figure that one out for myself.

HANEY: Well, like you said, you've never met me.

Later, Carton asks Haney how he would feel if a student wrote a "warts and all" book about him.

CARTON: Would you feel violated if someone did it to you?

HANEY: Would I feel violated if someone did it to me? I didn't do that. I kept everything in the book that was personal.

CARTON: It's a simple question: would you feel violated if someone did it to you?

HANEY: There are so many things I left out of this book that would have been going way beyond the line that I...

CARTON: Well, that's a cheap threat right there, c'mon.

HANEY: I felt like I did not cross the line.

CARTON: Why won't you answer my question then? We're men. I asked you a simple question

HANEY: I felt like I did not... No, I wouldn't. I feel like I did not cross the line because the book has to do with golf.

CARTON: So if a guy talked about your former wife and talked about the way you talked about it and a relationship with her and the kids and everything else, you wouldn't feel violated by that?

HANEY: I talked about that Tiger was a good father.

CARTON: You talk about their relationship.

HANEY: I did not.

CARTON: You talk about when they first got married things were great to the point where when Elin decides there's no TV at dinnertime it was a very icy, cold relationship, but no talking. You told secrets about a family man's life.

HANEY: That's a secret?

CARTON: Sure. I never knew that you couldn't watch TV in the Tiger Woods house. Nor do I give a damn. What's that got to do with golf?

HANEY: It pertained to his mental state

CARTON: So the fact that the Woods can't watch TV at dinnertime. So in other words, Tiger Woods going along with his wife -- and listen, we have the same policy but no one gives a damn -- the fact that they can't watch TV at dinnertime has what to do with winning the Masters?

HANEY: (silence)

CARTON: Nothing. It's a salacious book to make money.

HANEY: No, it's not a salacious book.

CARTON: What was your advance? How much?

HANEY: Guys, we're going to have to agree to disagree.

CARTON: How much money were you paid to write the book?

HANEY: That's totally irrelevant.

Then Carton's attacks on Haney get even more personal.

CARTON: Let's agree on one thing: That even now, how many years later since you've no longer been Tiger Woods' coach, you are still milking off the teat that is the Tiger Woods cow.

HANEY: That is not correct.

CARTON: No?

HANEY: But you just go ahead and have whatever opinion you want to have, OK? I wrote a book on my coaching Tiger Woods that detailed his greatness and the events that I partook in and you have your opinion and that's OK, but I think when people read the book, they will have a different opinion. The majority have. That's a fact. But you are entitled to your opinion.

CARTON: What do you think the general opinion is? Overall, outside of the guys who will kiss your ass like the guys who will kiss my ass and Boomer's ass and Tiger's ass, what do you think overall the perception of your book is, Hank?

HANEY: It's perception into the greatness that is Tiger Woods. That's the feedback that I am hearing

CARTON: Am I the first guy to give you a hard time about breaking that trust?

HANEY: You're definitely the most vocal and you're the only one who yelled and screamed and called me a coward.

And we're only at the 17-minute mark. Amazingly, Haney stays on for a full 23 minutes, signing off while Carton called him "scum of the earth."

CARTON: You probably got half a million up front to write the book and you probably pitched it as a tell-all book about the one guy who knew Tiger almost better than anybody, and it's guys like you, the scum of the earth, that abrogate a relationship and say things about men that only they know, which is so patently offensive to the trust that public figures on the level of Tiger Woods have to be careful about. It's disgusting.

I hope that every golfer in America is fearful of allowing you to be their swing coach because here's the reality of Hank Haney: Hank Haney's going to get to know you, and like a snake in the grass if he can make money off you one day in the future, he's going to do it. And I can't stand guys like you.

[The Recreational Golfer]

If what Haney wrote is all about selling books, then Carton's treatment of Haney is all about grabbing listeners. Talk about the pot calling the kettle black.

Doesn't Carton realize that interviews like this only pump up book sales?

[jhwmusic]

It cost about $13 for the kindle version, along with mailing me my free dvd - I doubt my money will be any more life changing to him than it is to me.

I know...I just think he is scumbag who is in the business for all the wrong reasons...especially since the split with Tiger. He saw how much he could bank from being associated with Tiger and proceeded to plaster his name and face on every product he could before nobody gave a sh#t about him anymore. I don't blame anyone for trying to make a buck and taking advantage of the hands you are dealt, but he has taken it to a whole new level. And from the rumors I have heard about how cheap he is my $13 might mean more to him than some would think. Just my opinion though. I could be way off but it's just what I see

[meenman]

I can see that Carton hasnt changed since his first time in NY - he already has the ratings due to lack of competition. I'm surprised that Boomer stays with him and doesnt worry about his national gig being tarnished.

I didnt think he was that bad during his time on the *Sports Guys* - but no one heard him then either.

I look forward to when Haney does an interview with Rome. He was on before the book came out and it was weak since he couldnt say anything until it was released.

Originally Posted by mvmac

Craig Carton from WFAN-New York's "Boomer and Carton" radio show called Hank Haney a "snake in the grass" -- among other things -- for writing a book about his former student Tiger Woods. The full interview is online here.Here are some highlights from Carton and Haney's exchanges, which grow increasingly heated and end with Haney hanging up after 23 minutes.

CARTON: You talk about his wife in the book.

HANEY: I talk about his wife only in areas where it pertains to his golf. The first time I talk about his wife is when she asked Tiger, "What are we going to do to celebrate?" And Tiger said, "We don't celebrate victories like this because..."

CARTON: Hank, you talked about the icy stares between the two of them after the accident when you saw him on the range outside of his house. What's that got to do with golf?

HANEY: Because Tiger was preparing for his first tournament back, which was the Masters. I was there preparing with him.

CARTON: Right.

HANEY: It was pertinent to his mindset at the time. When you're a golfer, obviously, it's a very mental game, and I thought that was pertinent to his...

CARTON: Let me ask you this:  Do you not...

HANEY: His preparation. So when I'm saying something like that in the book, one little comment about an icy stare, I don't think that's getting terribly personal.

CARTON: But it goes beyond golf. It goes beyond what happens inside the ropes.

HANEY: People have different opinions and I'm very aware that's going to be the case, but I'm not the first coach who's ever written a book...

CARTON: But it doesn't matter. Don't you think it's a violation?

HANEY: I don't feel like it was.

CARTON: You don't see that Tiger Woods allowed you into his world, obviously paid you I assume a decent amount of money to be his coach. Without Tiger Woods, you're not getting TV shows, you're not writing books. And you don't view it as a basic violation of the man's trust?

HANEY: Listen, I view it as my memories too. These weren't just his memories. He didn't have an exclusive on those memories. I wanted to share my observations, my thoughts, about his greatness, the complexities that make him up as a golfer, as a person. If I had all positive things in the book, it wouldn't have been an honest book. I wanted to write an honest book about working with Tiger Woods and the observations I made about his greatness and what it was like to coach him. And I realize people are going to have different opinions, but I'm not the first coach who's ever written a book. Phil Jackson wrote a book...

CARTON: It doesn't make it right though.

Then Carton says the book is egotistical.

CARTON: You come across a couple times in the book, in my opinion, almost like you want to be a martyr. "I did so much for Tiger. I was there for Tiger. I wanted to quit so many times but I didn't for Tiger." And the other thing you do, which is fascinating to me and shows me insight into you having never met you, is that you spend a chapter in the book when it's so important to you to compare Tiger Woods' win-loss percentage with you as his coach versus Butch Harmon as his coach. Which is such an egotistical play, I'm trying to figure that one out for myself.

HANEY: Well, like you said, you've never met me.

Later, Carton asks Haney how he would feel if a student wrote a "warts and all" book about him.

CARTON: Would you feel violated if someone did it to you?

HANEY: Would I feel violated if someone did it to me? I didn't do that. I kept everything in the book that was personal.

CARTON: It's a simple question: would you feel violated if someone did it to you?

HANEY: There are so many things I left out of this book that would have been going way beyond the line that I...

CARTON: Well, that's a cheap threat right there, c'mon.

HANEY: I felt like I did not cross the line.

CARTON: Why won't you answer my question then? We're men. I asked you a simple question

HANEY: I felt like I did not... No, I wouldn't. I feel like I did not cross the line because the book has to do with golf.

CARTON: So if a guy talked about your former wife and talked about the way you talked about it and a relationship with her and the kids and everything else, you wouldn't feel violated by that?

HANEY: I talked about that Tiger was a good father.

CARTON: You talk about their relationship.

HANEY: I did not.

CARTON: You talk about when they first got married things were great to the point where when Elin decides there's no TV at dinnertime it was a very icy, cold relationship, but no talking. You told secrets about a family man's life.

HANEY: That's a secret?

CARTON: Sure. I never knew that you couldn't watch TV in the Tiger Woods house. Nor do I give a damn. What's that got to do with golf?

HANEY: It pertained to his mental state

CARTON: So the fact that the Woods can't watch TV at dinnertime. So in other words, Tiger Woods going along with his wife -- and listen, we have the same policy but no one gives a damn -- the fact that they can't watch TV at dinnertime has what to do with winning the Masters?

HANEY: (silence)

CARTON: Nothing. It's a salacious book to make money.

HANEY: No, it's not a salacious book.

CARTON: What was your advance? How much?

HANEY: Guys, we're going to have to agree to disagree.

CARTON: How much money were you paid to write the book?

HANEY: That's totally irrelevant.

Then Carton's attacks on Haney get even more personal.

CARTON: Let's agree on one thing: That even now, how many years later since you've no longer been Tiger Woods' coach, you are still milking off the teat that is the Tiger Woods cow.

HANEY: That is not correct.

CARTON: No?

HANEY: But you just go ahead and have whatever opinion you want to have, OK? I wrote a book on my coaching Tiger Woods that detailed his greatness and the events that I partook in and you have your opinion and that's OK, but I think when people read the book, they will have a different opinion. The majority have. That's a fact. But you are entitled to your opinion.

CARTON: What do you think the general opinion is? Overall, outside of the guys who will kiss your ass like the guys who will kiss my ass and Boomer's ass and Tiger's ass, what do you think overall the perception of your book is, Hank?

HANEY: It's perception into the greatness that is Tiger Woods. That's the feedback that I am hearing

CARTON: Am I the first guy to give you a hard time about breaking that trust?

HANEY: You're definitely the most vocal and you're the only one who yelled and screamed and called me a coward.

And we're only at the 17-minute mark. Amazingly, Haney stays on for a full 23 minutes, signing off while Carton called him "scum of the earth."

CARTON: You probably got half a million up front to write the book and you probably pitched it as a tell-all book about the one guy who knew Tiger almost better than anybody, and it's guys like you, the scum of the earth, that abrogate a relationship and say things about men that only they know, which is so patently offensive to the trust that public figures on the level of Tiger Woods have to be careful about. It's disgusting.

I hope that every golfer in America is fearful of allowing you to be their swing coach because here's the reality of Hank Haney: Hank Haney's going to get to know you, and like a snake in the grass if he can make money off you one day in the future, he's going to do it. And I can't stand guys like you.

[newtogolf]

Carton is the first interviewer I'm aware of that didn't kiss Haney's butt and asked similar questions to what I'd have asked him.  Carton is right, Haney owes Tiger everything he has now, the Haney Project television show, all the product endorsements and the book deal are all due to his relationship with Tiger.

If  Haney wanted to share his memories, he could have written a book about his own life during the Tiger years.  The book could have been what it was like to be Tigers coach and been written completely from his perspective without violating Tigers trust.  He didn't write that book because he knows no one really cares about Haney and he wouldn't have gotten a nice big fat advance check for it.

I'm glad Haney got taken down a notch on air, he needs a few lessons in humility and loyalty.

Originally Posted by meenman

I can see that Carton hasnt changed since his first time in NY - he already has the ratings due to lack of competition. I'm surprised that Boomer stays with him and doesnt worry about his national gig being tarnished.

I didnt think he was that bad during his time on the *Sports Guys* - but no one heard him then either.

I look forward to when Haney does an interview with Rome. He was on before the book came out and it was weak since he couldnt say anything until it was released.

[meenman]

Originally Posted by newtogolf

Carton is the first interviewer I'm aware of that didn't kiss Haney's butt and asked similar questions to what I'd have asked him.  Carton is right, Haney owes Tiger everything he has now, the Haney Project television show, all the product endorsements and the book deal are all due to his relationship with Tiger.

If  Haney wanted to share his memories, he could have written a book about his own life during the Tiger years.  The book could have been what it was like to be Tigers coach and been written completely from his perspective without violating Tigers trust.  He didn't write that book because he knows no one really cares about Haney and he wouldn't have gotten a nice big fat advance check for it.

I'm glad Haney got taken down a notch on air, he needs a few lessons in humility and loyalty.

I am guessing that you havent listened to many interviews - more have been critical of Haney than not, also those that have been critical have admittedly not read the book

[newtogolf]

I heard one on the PGA Channel on XM, and one with Murray on MDR channel on XM.  In both cases they asked if Haney felt he betrayed a trust and when Haney said no they pretty much dropped it.  They also said he was pretty fair in the book to Tiger and that the most negative content was released in the excerpts.  If others have been critical then I must have just heard the wrong ones.  Thanks.

Originally Posted by meenman

I am guessing that you havent listened to many interviews - more have been critical of Haney than not, also those that have been critical have admittedly not read the book

[bodmanza]

Read the book. Didn't find it to have an agenda nor be anywhere near as slanderous as early excerpts made it seem.

The Carton accusations regarding the "icy" stares are quite over the top in my opinion.