IGNORED

# Ball came to rest at the trunk of a tree - and a cart path

Note: This thread is 3478 days old. We appreciate that you found this thread instead of starting a new one, but if you plan to post here please make sure it's still relevant. If not, please start a new topic. Thank you!

## Recommended Posts

So here is a questionable ruling that came up in a recent round of golf (non-tournament round)... And I just want to see if the way our foursome played the shot was correct and get your feedback.

I hit a shot from ~ 145yds that came to rest at the base of a large tree (right of the green side).  The base of the tree was very large and my ball was nearer the left side of the tree.  If I took my stance from my normal playing side - hitting the ball right handed... I literally could barely place the club between the ball and the tree base.  There was no way I could swing right handed.

Now, if I went to the left side of the tree, and flipped my iron around to hit the shot left handed with a right handed club - I could take a swing with no interference with the tree.

Here comes the tricky part...

On both the normal right handed stance - and left handed stance... A cart path was at the base and my feet were standing on it.  The ball was not on the cart path - but basically dirt between the cart path and the tree base.  There was maybe 12 inches between the base of the tree and cart path.

When we first walked up to my ball, my buddies in the foursome were laughing and saying good luck hitting that shot.  Then I pointed out that I could get a free drop (one club length - no closer to the hole) due that the cart path was at my feet in my normal stance.

They agreed, and I took the free drop.  I just want to make sure that we used the correct ruling and the shot was played correctly.

##### Share on other sites

As the stroke with a LH stance was reasonable and as a result your stance was on the path then you were entitled to relief.

However the relief is not simply 1cl not nearer. You first have to determine the nearest point of full relief then drop within 1cl not nearer the hole.

##### Share on other sites

I should have added that you must determine the npr for the LH stroke (position of ball, swing and stance) using the club you would have used if the path had not been there.

You may use any club in your bag to determine the 1cl from there.

Once you have dropped the ball you may then make a RH stroke with any club.

If the path now interferes with the RH stroke, you may now take relief for the new situation.

##### Share on other sites

I think the above is correct---if it's a LH swing that's practical and you're interfered with by the cart path, it's a LH swing that you calculate the NPR for (this is being beaten to death in another thread right now).  If your stance for the RH swing is also interfered with by the cart path, you could also take relief with an RH swing.

One important note. Your NPR may well be inside the tree. You are entitled to relief from the cart path only .

##### Share on other sites

Originally Posted by zeg

I think the above is correct---if it's a LH swing that's practical and you're interfered with by the cart path, it's a LH swing that you calculate the NPR for (this is being beaten to death in another thread right now).

It is. See

##### Share on other sites

Thanks guys for the clarifications.  Let me ask this slightly different scenario...

What would the ruling be if a RH swing was not possible due to the location of the ball - and the tree, but there was no cart path interfering with my RH stance?  And I decided that in order to advance the ball - I would need to take a LH swing.  And only taking the LH swing, did I find myself standing on the cart path?

How would the ruling change under these slightly different layout of RH vs LH swing?  Could I still take the free drop at the NPR using the LH 1CL?  The only thing keeping me from making a RH swing was the tree.

##### Share on other sites

That is perfectly OK. See the parts in red in the Decision below.

## 24-2b/9.5

#### After Relief Taken from Obstruction for Stroke Towards Green, Obstruction Interferes with Stance for Necessary Sideways Stroke

Q. With regard to the diagram, Point X is the original position of the ball and Point A is the nearest point of relief from the obstruction (cart path). The player drops his ball within one club-length of Point A (within the shaded area) and it comes to rest on the cart path at Point B. He re-drops as required by Rule 20-2c , again dropping within one club-length of Point A and the ball comes to rest at Point C.

At Point C there is no interference by the cart path for a stroke towards the green. However, the player cannot play towards the green from Point C because of intervention by the tree. His only reasonable stroke is sideways to the fairway, and his stance for such a stroke would be on the cart path. Is the player now required to place the ball as near as possible to the spot where it first struck the ground when re-dropped in accordance with Rule 20-2c ?

A. No. The player is not entitled to place the ball because at Point C there is no interference by the cart path for a stroke towards the green, the intended direction of play when relief was taken. However, as a result of the tree, the player has a new situation. He is entitled to take relief under Rule 24-2b(i) for the sideways stroke since this is not an unnecessarily abnormal direction of play - see Exception under Rule 24-2b - and his nearest point of relief would be Point D. After the ball is dropped within one club-length of Point D (within the shaded area) and it comes to rest at Point E, the player may play in any direction he wishes.

##### Share on other sites

Rulesman, I need your cell phone number.  I'm going to 'phone a friend' when I come across some strange situation on the course in the future.

##### Share on other sites

It's all there somewhere

##### Share on other sites

Is there a good iPhone app for rules? It would be a conundrum if you used an iPhone to check the rules since iPhones are sort of banned -- but not really always banned... that's another thread.

Seriously, is there an app? The few I found searching the App store seemed questionable and neither was free.

##### Share on other sites

Originally Posted by rustyredcab

Is there a good iPhone app for rules? It would be a conundrum if you used an iPhone to check the rules since iPhones are sort of banned -- but not really always banned... that's another thread.

Seriously, is there an app? The few I found searching the App store seemed questionable and neither was free.

I have one the USGA made.

http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/the-rules-of-golf/id347349889?mt=8

##### Share on other sites

Originally Posted by iacas

I have one the USGA made.

http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/the-rules-of-golf/id347349889?mt=8

Does it have Decisions offline, i.e. installed on the phone? R&A; has a Rules app as well but no Decisions.

##### Share on other sites

Originally Posted by rustyredcab

Is there a good iPhone app for rules? It would be a conundrum if you used an iPhone to check the rules since iPhones are sort of banned -- but not really always banned... that's another thread.

You may always use your iPhone (or any other mobile phone) for checking the Rules from a Rules app. Just checked it from R&A.;

##### Share on other sites

Originally Posted by Ignorant

You may always use your iPhone (or any other mobile phone) for checking the Rules from a Rules app. Just checked it from R&A.;

Providing you are not using it as a DMD AND it has non-conforming apps on it.

##### Share on other sites

Originally Posted by Ignorant

Does it have Decisions offline, i.e. installed on the phone? R&A; has a Rules app as well but no Decisions.

Yep.

##### Share on other sites

Note: This thread is 3478 days old. We appreciate that you found this thread instead of starting a new one, but if you plan to post here please make sure it's still relevant. If not, please start a new topic. Thank you!

## Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
• ### Topics Being Discussed Right Now on The Sand Trap

By KevinBlake, in Instruction and Playing Tips

• 4 replies
• 43 views
• #### TST Takes on Sand Valley, WI (July 18-23, 2021) 1 2 3 4 24

By cipher, in Member Outings & Meetups

• 415 replies
• 20,904 views
• #### Cleveland Guardians 1 2 3 4

By iacas, in Sports

• 67 replies
• 1,461 views
• #### Common Rules Violations (That Are Hard to Call)

By reidsou, in Rules of Golf

• 7 replies
• 166 views
• #### What'd You Shoot Today? 1 2 3 4 1025

By iacas, in Golf Talk

• 18,446 replies
• 616,795 views

• Want to join this community?

We'd love to have you!

• ## Support TST Affiliates

Use the code "iacas" for 10% off Mevo and the code "iacasjun21" for 10% off SuperSpeed.
• ### Posts

• @KevinBlakeHave you read this post? It may help.
• I shot 80 on the second day at SV, then 80 and 81 at Lawsonia, which were my 3 lowest scores of the year. Some highlights: 60 yard sand shot to 5 feet for birdie on MD. 3 birdies in a row from 10-12 on SV on day 2. Had a combined 30-35 feet of eagle putts on 10 and 12 (I hit two 5 irons to about 15 and 20 feet, respectively), and stuffed an approach from about 115 to 4 feet on 11.  Making par from the driving range on 9 on SV. Hit a completely blind 70 yard shot to 15 feet. I had to turn on my GPS to get some guess at the yardage because I couldn't see the flag to hit with my laser. I had a great lie, though. 🤣 Hitting the green twice at 7 at Lawsonia, playing it in a combined -1.
• I filmed @DeadMan@iacasand @GolfLug all with great shots on the the final hole of the Sandbox, number 17. Erik and Vishal nearly ace it. Gotta love the drunk guy yelling in the background. 😂
• No, It does impact lie angle at address. Hand position can effect lie angle at impact to.  just because you present no toe up at address doesn’t mean you present that same position at impact. Your hand position can be different at impact than at address, and the dynamics of the golf club will change the lie angle as well. you could have very low hands at address and then swing where they end up much higher. If you change the lie angle of the club because it looks a lot toe up at address, then you could induce the toe to be down at impact. impact is what matters. When fitting, they have you hit a lie angle board, impact. Not measure lie at address.
• So it's not the position of your hands that affect how much your toe should be up at address, it's just your swing speed and the material the shaft is made from?   I had seen it mentioned that hand position was the most important thing for this but maybe it's wrong
• ### Today's Birthdays

1. andreanewman
(29 years old)
2. Erg
(54 years old)
3. Hacker James
(79 years old)
4. irishmike27
(42 years old)

×
×
• Create New...

## Important Information

Welcome to TST! Signing up is free, and you'll see fewer ads and can talk with fellow golf enthusiasts! By using TST, you agree to our Terms of Use, our Privacy Policy, and our Guidelines.

The popup will be closed in 10 seconds...