good scramble score?

[Sandy Trap]

I don't understand the mentality of some people on this forum.  Why do you feel the need to pick apart the posts of other people?  I am allowed to make a statement about my personal opinion without you quoting every sentence and citing different rule books and experiences in an attempt to make me look foolish.  I didn't quote you and tell you that your opinions are stupid when I made my original statement, so please don't feel obligated to do it to me.

My opinion:  Allowing other people to purchase an advantage over other teams is silly.  Charity or not, it is still fun to be competitive.  I am competitive playing among friends and we have a blast.  At the end of the day, aren't you curious to know how your team shot compared to everyone else?  This is impossible to do when you add in rules to encourage cheating.

Like I said, I pay hundreds if not thousands into these charities and I am allowed to state my opinion about different rules.  Stop being a prick for no reason.

[Dave2512]

Says the guy that advised us to unbunch our panties. You are the only one getting wound up about it and I never said you are stupid. Having an opinion is one thing but you are trying to rage against rules that don't exist. There is no unfair advantage when it's been offered to the entire field of an unofficial event. As someone said earlier if you don't like the rules for that particular event and don't want to use mulligans enter one without those rules. I don't enter scrambles to play my A game. Nobody cares what you shoot in a scramble. It's a social event that happens to be on a golf course.

[Sandy Trap]

I said I think buying the right to cheat is stupid.  It is advertised as a tournament and they give out prizes, therefore it makes sense to have an even playing field.

I made one comment on an internet forum (not directed at anyone) and you feel the need to continuously try to break down my posts.  I am not running up to the event organizer to complain, I just said it's silly in a forum post.

And to the genius who so elegantly suggest that I don't enter.  That's a great idea.  I will strip a charity of money because I think mulligans are silly.  Thanks for the advice.

I should be free to make a statement that is not directed at you, or offensive to you, without you being an ******* in return.  Cut the crap.  You know that you are being a prick.

[Golfingdad]

Originally Posted by Sandy Trap

I said I think buying the right to cheat is stupid.  It is advertised as a tournament and they give out prizes, therefore it makes sense to have an even playing field.

I made one comment on an internet forum (not directed at anyone) and you feel the need to continuously try to break down my posts.  I am not running up to the event organizer to complain, I just said it's silly in a forum post.

And to the genius who so elegantly suggest that I don't enter.  That's a great idea.  I will strip a charity of money because I think mulligans are silly.  Thanks for the advice.

I should be free to make a statement that is not directed at you, or offensive to you, without you being an ******* in return.  Cut the crap.  You know that you are being a prick.

I don't understand your last two posts.  You have an opinion on a golf forum.  That's great.  Nobody is saying you can't.  But a lot of us are having different opinions, and yet it sounds like you are suggesting that we can't.  Isn't the whole point of the forum to discuss, agree, disagree, argue, learn, etc etc?

Nobody is being a prick or a ******** to you, nobody is being offensive to you (I think, I didn't go back and re-read all of the posts).  Nobody is dishing any "crap."  They (we) just have different opinions.  And we are just as entitled to them as you are.

[Sandy Trap]

Originally Posted by Golfingdad

I don't understand your last two posts.  You have an opinion on a golf forum.  That's great.  Nobody is saying you can't.  But a lot of us are having different opinions, and yet it sounds like you are suggesting that we can't.  Isn't the whole point of the forum to discuss, agree, disagree, argue, learn, etc etc?

Nobody is being a prick or a ******** to you, nobody is being offensive to you (I think, I didn't go back and re-read all of the posts).  Nobody is dishing any "crap."  They (we) just have different opinions.  And we are just as entitled to them as you are.

You are certainly allowed to have an opinion.

Dave feels the need to quote every post I make and break it down in an attempt to say I'm wrong.  I did not say anything directed to him or that could be seen as offensive.  I said I don't like mulligans.

I can't believe he needs to post five replies citing his experience and rule books to disagree with the fact that I don't like mulligans.  It seems a bit too much.

[Sandy Trap]

I don't like mulligans.

How does the above statement warrant being berated with a dozen posts?  Doesn't seem like a very controversial statement to me.

[Dave2512]

I don't like mulligans in stroke play or any other format where the ROG must be observed. I don't care about mulligans in a scramble because there is no recognized standard for scramble play. Honestly I don't care. I just don't see how it can be considered cheating when a) it's offered to the entire field and b) it's almost always part of the fundraising. This isn't about opinions. I get that you think it's silly. Personally I think that's the intent of the organizers that put these types of event on, it's supposed to be silly and fun. Scrambles aren't about being fair. We don't use handicaps in scrambles. There's no reason to adhere to a nonexistant standard in an unofficial event with rules that are dictated by the sponsor. I'm not citing rules or trying to be pedant. In fact it's the opposite, I'm saying there aren't any rules.

[GolfGhost]

Too much hostility here.

I played one today.  Had a great time and we shot a 4 under.  We had the mulligan thing, the string thing, and one "red bomb" apiece (ladies tees).  I use it to practice more than anything since the 3 others I played with are better than I am, so my ball is not often chosen.  Money went to a good cause and thats all that matters IMO.

[Sandy Trap]

By the responses here you would think I posted something about abortion, not mulligans.

[Paradox]

Originally Posted by bplewis24

Is there any additional language to the "two putt max" rule?  I would assume it means 2 actual putt attempts, and you make the third.  It seems ridiculous to automatically give every group a 2-putt.  The pros don't even 2-putt every green.

I'd like to know about the club length rule myself.  It would appear to be one club length, no closer to the hole.  Therefore there aren't many circumstances where placing it from fringe-to-green would be further from the hole.

there wasn't anything else said other than "we have a 2 putt max on every hole" so our group decided...you're on the green and you're guaranteed a two putt.  We tried  to ask but were shipped off before we could get a clarification because we initially thought a 2 putt max rule was like you said..hit two putts and the third is in.  This is the reason why I hate that rule being in play.

You could technically place a ball on the green from the fringe and be further from the hole.  Would just have to depend on where you are in relation to the hole.  I have always played it that if you are on the fringe, the ball must stay on the fringe.  What if you're less than a clublength off the fairway?  How do you play that one.  Stay in the rough or move to the fairway?

[Dave2512]

The two putt rule tournaments I've played stated if you miss the 1st putt the second is a gimme. In 4 man usually someone gets it close enough to tap in anyway. I've never played any where the one club rule allowed for the ball to be moved to a different surface, out of bunkers, on to greens or fairways etc. Usually it's not necessary because someone hits a good shot. If the best shot a group has to chose from in a scramble is a bunker shot or the like they're having a bad day .

[teamroper60]

This thread is getting to be just like the long putter & dress code threads......    Everyone has a different opinion on them and there is very little tolerance for anyone with a differing view......

That said, my opinion is, the whole concept of players picking up their ball and placing it in a location that is more advantageous than where it landed is against the ROG.  Since the ROG don't cover scrambles, the only rules that matter during one are those created for that particular tournament.   If mulligans/strings/etc.. are allowed under the rules of the tournament, choosing whether to use them or not is a personal preference but personal preference is not the basis for a claim of cheating.   Violating the rules of the tournament is.

My $.02

[bplewis24]

Originally Posted by Sandy Trap

A scramble is an even playing field.  Some teams using mulligans and others not is where it gets ridiculous.  I'm sorry you guys are so upset that I don't like mulligans.  Feel free to un-bunch your panties at any time.

Originally Posted by Sandy Trap

I don't understand the mentality of some people on this forum.  Why do you feel the need to pick apart the posts of other people?  I am allowed to make a statement about my personal opinion without you quoting every sentence and citing different rule books and experiences in an attempt to make me look foolish.  I didn't quote you and tell you that your opinions are stupid when I made my original statement, so please don't feel obligated to do it to me.

My opinion:  Allowing other people to purchase an advantage over other teams is silly.  Charity or not, it is still fun to be competitive.  I am competitive playing among friends and we have a blast.  At the end of the day, aren't you curious to know how your team shot compared to everyone else?  This is impossible to do when you add in rules to encourage cheating.

Like I said, I pay hundreds if not thousands into these charities and I am allowed to state my opinion about different rules.  Stop being a prick for no reason.

Originally Posted by Sandy Trap

I don't like mulligans.

How does the above statement warrant being berated with a dozen posts?  Doesn't seem like a very controversial statement to me.

Why do I feel like I'm in a parallel universe after reading these?  I guess I just don't see what you're seeing.

Originally Posted by Paradox

You could technically place a ball on the green from the fringe and be further from the hole.  Would just have to depend on where you are in relation to the hole.  I have always played it that if you are on the fringe, the ball must stay on the fringe.  What if you're less than a clublength off the fairway?  How do you play that one.  Stay in the rough or move to the fairway?

Quote:

Originally Posted by teamroper60

That said, my opinion is, the whole concept of players picking up their ball and placing it in a location that is more advantageous than where it landed is against the ROG.  Since the ROG don't cover scrambles, the only rules that matter during one are those created for that particular tournament.   If mulligans/strings/etc.. are allowed under the rules of the tournament, choosing whether to use them or not is a personal preference but personal preference is not the basis for a claim of cheating.   Violating the rules of the tournament is.

My $.02

I agree.

[Sandy Trap]

I feel like I'm surrounded by kids from the short bus.  I'm done responding to you guys about mulligans.

[dlance]

I didn't read all 4 pages of this so the topic may have changed from the original, but i wanted to put in my thoughts anyways about what is a pretty good score:

I have played these scrambles in 2 man and 4 man teams (never with anything special - take the best score, @ 80% of your handicaps - no mulligans, string things, or ladies tees)

I typically play these with my father we both jump between 3-6 handicaps through the year...Which for most scrambles is too low to compete. Our strategy for these is to pick harder qualifier courses so that being the better players makes up for the difference in strokes that most the other players get.

In a two man even this year at San Juan Oaks GC in California, we shot a -12 in 1 round. (however at the finals for this held at Spyglass GC in CA we only managed a -3 and were pretty close to the bottom of the group - it was my first time there...i want another shot at it...)

As a 4 man team at Poppy Ridge GC in Livermore, CA we shot a -22 with 3 of the 4 people having below a 10 handicap.

These types of scores are what i normally see take the top spot, but i did play a different 4 man team this year at Monarch Bay GC in san Leandro, CA where we got 2nd place with only a -8... so a good score really only depends on who you are playing against that day...

(these were all NCGA regulated tournaments)

[bplewis24]

Originally Posted by Sandy Trap

I feel like I'm surrounded by kids from the short bus.  I'm done responding to you guys about mulligans.

Is that what irony feels like?

[Sandy Trap]

Originally Posted by bplewis24

Is that what irony feels like?

Apparently.  I guess not liking mulligans makes me retarded in your opinion.  Such irony.

[Dave2512]

Not liking mulligans and considering mulligans cheating in a game without official rules are two different things. That's what folks are trying point out. It's okay to not like mulligans, as I mentioned I don't them either in play where the ROG should be observed. But a scramble is anything goes and the rules are made by the host of the event. It's still okay not to like mulligans but it's not cheating, it doesn't ruin the game and it doesn't lead to an unfair advantage because the rules apply to the entire field. As someone pointed out earlier picking up the ball and moving it to a better spot already takes the format so far from the ROG a do-over shouldn't be cause for concern. Trying to apply the ROG to a scramble with the intent of preserving the integrity of golf in general is akin going to a bar to play foosball and treating it like it's the World Cup.