Colorado Man Goes on Shooting Spree in Movie Theater

[David in FL]

Searching Google or whatever for news is pointless. You'll find plenty of examples to support your case either way. NEITHER side should take that approach.

No google search here. Real situation that happened locally just a few days ago. Old guys rock!

[x129]

There are no real stats. The numbers are made up by both sides and often they are talking at cross points  with different values.  If a guy walking down with the street feels threatened, puts his hand on his gun and isn't mugged, did that gun prevent a crime? According to the progun people, you bet. If a teenage gets his dad's gun and blows his brains out after getting a D in math, is that death a result of gun violence? The gun control people sure think so.

So we end up with these anecdotal stories. Has the rise of concealed weapons resulted in a reduction in crime? Nope. The places where the laws stayed the same dropped by the same amount. Did it result in bloodbaths in the streets? Nope. A couple of highly publicized "Self-defense" cases might make it seem that way but that isn't reality either. Of coure the percentage of people with concealed weapons right now is very small so maybe it isn't high enough to change the numbers. Maybe if 50% of adults carried we would see something.

Originally Posted by iacas

And without any actual numbers or facts, it's all just guessing, which remains pointless.

[iacas]

Originally Posted by x129

There are no real stats.

That's incorrect. Buy and read "Armed" by Gary Kleck and Don Kates. Plenty of stats in there, specifically regarding gun ownership and gun use in the commission of violent crimes by the victims. He's one of many criminologists who start out "hating" guns and who later come to conclude something quite different. There are plenty of stats out there.

I think it's sad how every tragedy like this becomes a gun control debate. I think our thoughts and wishes should be with the families of the deceased, and the injured and their families, rather than trying to score cheap emotional points in an endless (or at least ongoing) debate.

[x129]

I have read it (and more guns, less crime for a similiar work). I have also read the rebuttals and the rebuttals of those rebuttals. The good news about the stats out there is that there are so many you can find a set to match your personal beliefs. There was one earlier that said owning  a gun makes it 4.5 times more likely someone in the house will die of a homicide.  That doesn't mean that Kleck is wrong or that the new study is wrong. It means they are measuring different things.

Originally Posted by iacas

That's incorrect. Buy and read "Armed" by Gary Kleck and Don Kates. Plenty of stats in there, specifically regarding gun ownership and gun use in the commission of violent crimes by the victims. He's one of many criminologists who start out "hating" guns and who later come to conclude something quite different. There are plenty of stats out there.

I think it's sad how every tragedy like this becomes a gun control debate. I think our thoughts and wishes should be with the families of the deceased, and the injured and their families, rather than trying to score cheap emotional points in an endless (or at least ongoing) debate.

[jshots]

There is a huge difference between this and an old guy stopping some thugs. Thugs may not have morals but at least they have some sense of sanity in their heads.

To expect that with legal guns there would have been someone in the movie theater well enough trained with their gun that they could shoot a guy who had bulletproof armor on in a dark theater is completely ridiculous.

You can't apply that guns deter your average thug it here. This guy was insane, its an anomaly and quite frankly I'm not sure there is anything you can do about these types of shootings. What if everyone in there had a gun.... maybe he would've bombed the place. I'm not saying whether or not guns help or hurt our society in general, but it's quite clear to me that it doesn't even matter in this situation and I'm honestly not sure there is a damn thing you can do about it as horrible as these kinds of things are.

Originally Posted by iacas

That's incorrect. Buy and read "Armed" by Gary Kleck and Don Kates. Plenty of stats in there, specifically regarding gun ownership and gun use in the commission of violent crimes by the victims. He's one of many criminologists who start out "hating" guns and who later come to conclude something quite different. There are plenty of stats out there.

I think it's sad how every tragedy like this becomes a gun control debate. I think our thoughts and wishes should be with the families of the deceased, and the injured and their families, rather than trying to score cheap emotional points in an endless (or at least ongoing) debate.

I don't think it's really sad. People want this kind of thing to stop, people care that it happens, and it scares them and people want to figure out the best way to stop it. But like I just wrote, I don't think that this type of shooting is really preventable, but that is just my opinion.

[Mattplusness]

So that Batman movie I hear really is to die for

[iacas]

Originally Posted by Mattplusness

So that Batman movie I hear really is to die for

That you think that's appropriate befuddles probably everyone.

[David in FL]

Originally Posted by jshots

There is a huge difference between this and an old guy stopping some thugs. Thugs may not have morals but at least they have some sense of sanity in their heads.

To expect that with legal guns there would have been someone in the movie theater well enough trained with their gun that they could shoot a guy who had bulletproof armor on in a dark theater is completely ridiculous.

You can't apply that guns deter your average thug it here. This guy was insane, its an anomaly and quite frankly I'm not sure there is anything you can do about these types of shootings. What if everyone in there had a gun.... maybe he would've bombed the place. I'm not saying whether or not guns help or hurt our society in general, but it's quite clear to me that it doesn't even matter in this situation and I'm honestly not sure there is a damn thing you can do about it as horrible as these kinds of things are.

I don't think it's really sad. People want this kind of thing to stop, people care that it happens, and it scares them and people want to figure out the best way to stop it. But like I just wrote, I don't think that this type of shooting is really preventable, but that is just my opinion.

Interestingly, I'm reading right now about the number of servicemen that were actually in the theater.....some of whom tragically also lost their lives.

Note, no one ever said that it could have been prevented.  An active response from one or more patrons certainly might have limited the casualties to fewer than there were though.

[Motley01]

Originally Posted by Mattplusness

So that Batman movie I hear really is to die for

Grow up man, that was just stupidist comment I can hear right now, it's not funny. How old are you 12?

[granitegolf]

I say ban this person for life from this site. That is so disrespectful I can only imagine how old you are! And if you are beyond 18 then all the more reason to ban you ! Period!

[granitegolf]

Originally Posted by Mattplusness

So that Batman movie I hear really is to die for

This one!!

[Mattplusness]

Lol mad.

"Stupidest"

[newtogolf]

How about low class and insensitive.

Originally Posted by Mattplusness

Lol mad.

"Stupidest"

[Gresh24]

First of all, that may have been the most insensitive, ignorant, and immature post I've seen.

Second, I am all for gun rights, but it is pointless to debate whether this guy would have been stopped because it IS legal in Colorado to carry.

[RonTheSavage]

My thoughts and prayers go out to the victims. I purchased an advance ticket about a week before the movie opened. I had thoughts to skip the movie all together, but I went anyway figuring my theater would have crazy security...........it didn't. It was business as usual. From what I read alot of people didn't realize someone was shooting in the theater because the gunfire in the movie itself was so loud and I can vouch for that. I dont wanna come across as insensitive or anything but I have to agree with the poster above when he asked who takes a 3 month old out to a movie at midnight?

[Motley01]

Originally Posted by Mattplusness

Lol mad.

"Stupidest"

You're mommy needs to slap you upside the face.

[Motley01]

Originally Posted by RonTheSavage

My thoughts and prayers go out to the victims. I purchased an advance ticket about a week before the movie opened. I had thoughts to skip the movie all together, but I went anyway figuring my theater would have crazy security...........it didn't. It was business as usual. From what I read alot of people didn't realize someone was shooting in the theater because the gunfire in the movie itself was so loud and I can vouch for that. I dont wanna come across as insensitive or anything but I have to agree with the poster above when he asked who takes a 3 month old out to a movie at midnight?

Did you see the parents of that child, in the interview. That explains everything.

[RonTheSavage]

Originally Posted by Motley01

Did you see the parents of that child, in the interview. That explains everything.

Yeah and to add to that the father apparently ran out of the theatre and left his girlfriend and kids behind when the shooting started. The lady and kids were rescued by a 19 year old kid who was shot in the leg in the process. The dad has since propsed to the mom and she said yes.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2909285/posts