False sense of really getting to the 70's?

[LovinItAll]

I disagree with playing off womens and not shooting lower, I can't remember the last time I missed a green with a wedge, or at least severly missed a green with a wedge, whereas my 3 iron, a bad shot I can probably miss the green by 40 yards, securing my bogey at best. I haven't tried it but I do imagine I could play to scratch off women's tees. I think it depends on the strengths of your game, the OP is struggling from 180+ so ofcourse having less distance in would mean more GIR for him and a better score which he would get off women's tees and from a longer drive. I consider the strengths of my game my Driver aslong as it isn't a dogleg right :) and my wedge play from 110-140, I haven't played against many people that I wouldn't play for money if we just went around and dropped the ball at 135 yards and see who scored the best, so I'm not so sure about your women's tees argument :) especially when applied to OP

I'll even go further: If you 'can't remember the last time you missed a green' from 110-140, then either you're driving or putting has to be pretty weak to still be an 8. An 8 means you aren't breaking 80 very often. The next time you're in Vegas, you've got whatever bet you want that you can't shoot even par from the ladies tees. I knew this would happen....golfers who shoot in the 80's would say they could play low 70's golf from the front tees. Like I said, I'd have to see it with my own eyes, and I'd be willing to lose money watching.

[mdl]

Originally Posted by Maverick

I would say my chipping over the last year has really improved.  I'm confident that no matter where green-side, I'll be in the hole in two.  It's getting it even closer for that 1-putt.  I know this is not the ideal way to play, but for now it seems to be keeping me in the mid 80's.  I admit though, for the approaches that are 160 or less..it is without exception/excuse, that I HAVE to be on the green.

Are you saying you're confident no matter what you'll get up and down from a close green side leave?  Or are you saying you're confident you can get on the green to a reasonable spot where you can be confident you'll two putt, so home in three total?

If it's the first, then your stats say otherwise.  20% GIR means 3-4 GIR per round.  Assuming, since you're not very accurate with the full approach shots, you two putt those 3-4 GIRs, then your 34 putts means that at best you're getting up and down on 2 of 14 missed greens.  That's assuming no three putts, but even then 3/14 or 4/14 up and down is hardly automatic!

Like Rustyredcab said, as long as being a short hitter means you can drive it out to 220+ (and not 190-200) with your consistent drive swing, really what you need to do is work on your full iron and hybrid swings.  If you're playing the right tees, most courses have a decent number of par 4s in the 350-380, which means you're not super good from 130-160 even, and you say you're bad enough from 180+ that you lay up.  Close to 50% FW is fine if your misses aren't usually huge and put you in jail.  You need to develop a consistent stroke with your mid and long irons to take the next step I'd say.

[Maverick]

Originally Posted by LovinItAll

Depending on the rest of your game, if you can consistently hit it 220-230 off the tee and you're playing 6000-6300 yard courses/tees, not only can you consistently shoot in the 70's (and yes, they would be a legit 70's), that's long enough to approach scratch. Once you're there, moving back won't add many, if any, strokes to your score, even if you're still driving it the same distance, though you'll see more of those 180 yard approaches then. At that point, though, you'll be able to hit those shots with more confidence. Learning to score is different than learning to hit the ball. Lots of sweet swingers on the range that can't break 80, and lots of screwy looking range dudes that are scratch golfers.

At ~6300 yards, there are very few 400 yard par 4's and few 180 yard par 3's.Driving it 220-230, you should have mostly 6i or less into the fours, you can reach all the fives and scratch it around the green on all the threes. That's a formula for shooting in the 70's if your game is up to snuff.

The fact is that if you put a golfer that shoots mid 80's-90 on the ladies tees, they aren't going to score much better. I'm sure some mid-80's golfer might jump in and say they can shoot even par from the reds, but I'd have to see it to believe it. I've played from the reds with my wife many times for fun, and depending on the state of my game, the score just didn't change much (to my disappointment). I'm talking 5500 yards or so.

Driving it 220-230, you should have mostly 6i or less into the fours, you can reach all the fives and scratch it around the green on all the threes. That's a formula for shooting in the 70's if your game is up to snuff.

Yes, I've noticed that too..I'll usually be around 160-180 in and most of my approaches..and it's these times when I go for it and get a little sideways or off where I lose the strokes.  Looks like all the arrows point to going to the range and practicing the 5 and 6 iron for consistency/accuracy.

[Maverick]

Originally Posted by mdl

Are you saying you're confident no matter what you'll get up and down from a close green side leave?  Or are you saying you're confident you can get on the green to a reasonable spot where you can be confident you'll two putt, so home in three total?

If it's the first, then your stats say otherwise.  20% GIR means 3-4 GIR per round.  Assuming, since you're not very accurate with the full approach shots, you two putt those 3-4 GIRs, then your 34 putts means that at best you're getting up and down on 2 of 14 missed greens.  That's assuming no three putts, but even then 3/14 or 4/14 up and down is hardly automatic!

Like Rustyredcab said, as long as being a short hitter means you can drive it out to 220+ (and not 190-200) with your consistent drive swing, really what you need to do is work on your full iron and hybrid swings.  If you're playing the right tees, most courses have a decent number of par 4s in the 350-380, which means you're not super good from 130-160 even, and you say you're bad enough from 180+ that you lay up.  Close to 50% FW is fine if your misses aren't usually huge and put you in jail.  You need to develop a consistent stroke with your mid and long irons to take the next step I'd say.

Yes, the latter..that I am confident that once on the green I'll be in by 2 putts.

You need to develop a consistent stroke with your mid and long irons to take the next step I'd say.

..I absolutely agree.

[logman]

Maverick. it looks like you have a bit of a love affair with the Mizuno corp(mx 200). ........me too , haha but I've changed the 3 iron,4 iron and 5 iron for the CLK 23degree and 26 degree hybrids.......dirt cheap these days and great fun to hit . And, yes I'm a broken record but if your hitting the short irons that good then go for the super high loft driver. The thriver is AWESOME. On the fairway, Most of the time, and you can leave yourself 7,8,9 and pitch to the pin.......your strength.

Im amazed at the way that a short high loft driver changes golf

[Maverick]

Originally Posted by logman

Maverick. it looks like you have a bit of a love affair with the Mizuno corp(mx 200). ........me too , haha but I've changed the 3 iron,4 iron and 5 iron for the CLK 23degree and 26 degree hybrids.......dirt cheap these days and great fun to hit . And, yes I'm a broken record but if your hitting the short irons that good then go for the super high loft driver. The thriver is AWESOME. On the fairway, Most of the time, and you can leave yourself 7,8,9 and pitch to the pin.......your strength.

Im amazed at the way that a short high loft driver changes golf

Yea, I've been a fan/infatuated with Mizzy's since I started playing..I won't go into it as you and I know their quality and feel.  I just replaced my Mizzy 3W with a 17 deg. CLK also..you're right, I picked it up from Ebay for $29, shipped.  My 12 deg. JPX 800 is so much fun to play with..and usually straight and in the FW or just off it.  I highly recommend more loft for those of us who do not have the fastest swing speeds..or would rather swing in control and be just as far.  I play with a couple other buddies and they are using a 10.5 and 9.5..we're about the same index.  They look to be swinging pretty fast and actually seem like they blew by my ball..but in the end..we're in the same distance.  Another reason I opted for a higher lofted driver was that I tended to hit the driver very shallow and the ball was just not getting as high as I wanted..or expected.

[logman]

Originally Posted by Maverick

Yea, I've been a fan/infatuated with Mizzy's since I started playing..I won't go into it as you and I know their quality and feel.  I just replaced my Mizzy 3W with a 17 deg. CLK also..you're right, I picked it up from Ebay for $29, shipped.  My 12 deg. JPX 800 is so much fun to play with..and usually straight and in the FW or just off it.  I highly recommend more loft for those of us who do not have the fastest swing speeds..or would rather swing in control and be just as far.  I play with a couple other buddies and they are using a 10.5 and 9.5..we're about the same index.  They look to be swinging pretty fast and actually seem like they blew by my ball..but in the end..we're in the same distance.  Another reason I opted for a higher lofted driver was that I tended to hit the driver very shallow and the ball was just not getting as high as I wanted..or expected.

Sounds like you've got a good grasp of your game strengths. I love those clk's if they made a 30 degree, i'd leave my 6 iron out as well! good luck.

[dalybog]

Maverick,

After reading all of the recommendations, it seems funny that only one person has suggested working on your short game.  If your putting average is 34 per round, you really aren't getting up and down as often as you should.  Your FIR average is good, but you are missing a lot of greens and not getting up and down enough.  If you want to play and practice at the same time, you should find a good par 3 course.  A good par 3 course will have various length par 3's to play.  If it only has 100 yarders or 150 yarders it may not be worth it.  A lot of these courses are usually not very crowded, and should allow you to practice iron shots of varying length in a real setting instead of at a driving range.

I started playing one more often last year because my wife finally decided to learn the game ( No jokes please, it is very frustrating for me).  I figured the best place for her to start was on a par 3 course, and to my surprise, I started playing much better with my irons and around the greens.  Unfortunately, my handicap is still hovering in the mid 8's but that is due to poor driving this year.  My FIR have dropped on average from 8 or 9 a round to 6 to 7, but my short game and GIR have improved.

This is just my two cents worth, but I did notice an improvement, when I did not expect one.

[Maverick]

Originally Posted by dalybog

Maverick,

After reading all of the recommendations, it seems funny that only one person has suggested working on your short game.  If your putting average is 34 per round, you really aren't getting up and down as often as you should.  Your FIR average is good, but you are missing a lot of greens and not getting up and down enough.  If you want to play and practice at the same time, you should find a good par 3 course.  A good par 3 course will have various length par 3's to play.  If it only has 100 yarders or 150 yarders it may not be worth it.  A lot of these courses are usually not very crowded, and should allow you to practice iron shots of varying length in a real setting instead of at a driving range.

I started playing one more often last year because my wife finally decided to learn the game ( No jokes please, it is very frustrating for me).  I figured the best place for her to start was on a par 3 course, and to my surprise, I started playing much better with my irons and around the greens.  Unfortunately, my handicap is still hovering in the mid 8's but that is due to poor driving this year.  My FIR have dropped on average from 8 or 9 a round to 6 to 7, but my short game and GIR have improved.

This is just my two cents worth, but I did notice an improvement, when I did not expect one.

Yeah, my up and downs are not that great..I'm not really tracking those yet as I am not getting the GIRs as much as I'd like..perhaps I should though.  I'm not worried too much about the short game as I'm confident that I will get in the hole, when I'm on, in 2 putts or less.

[LovinItAll]

Maverick, After reading all of the recommendations, it seems funny that only one person has suggested working on your short game.

The OP's question wasn't, "How do I lower my scores?", it was, "Can I consistently shoot in the 70's with my current scrambling game?" "Improve your shot game", "Hit more G.I.R's", "Drive the ball more consistently" are all excellent points, just not what the OP asked.

[rustyredcab]

Originally Posted by Maverick

Yeah, my up and downs are not that great..I'm not really tracking those yet as I am not getting the GIRs as much as I'd like..perhaps I should though.  I'm not worried too much about the short game as I'm confident that I will get in the hole, when I'm on, in 2 putts or less.

People who consistently break 80, do better than getting up and down in three. A "good round" will find you getting up and down in two 50% of the time you are within 40 yards or so of the green.

[dalybog]

Yeah.  I guess I didn't get my point across as well as I thought?  Having a good short game in my opinion is the foundation to improving and consistently shooting better scores, like low 80's and 70's.  If you watched the PGA this weekend, Rory didn't hit every green nor every fairway, but he got up and down a lot.  This is not to mention the terrible break he got on Saturday when he drove his ball in the tree and had to take the unplayable penalty.  I wonder how he would have done if he didn't get up and down and save par?  What kind of thoughts do you think he would have had going through his mind if he misses the putt or misses the green after his drop?  I think that up and down for par propelled him to victory.

And to answer the question posed to start this thread, yes I believe it is possible to get to the 70's consistently.  It will take work, The more you put into it, the more you'll get out of it.  My suggestion was to put more work into your short game to get there.

[Maverick]

I feel like I'm getting closer (to a the 70's)..let's get to the ugly stuff, first.

I hit 2 balls into the water (tried to go for flag..dummy), one triple (tried to cut the corner on a dogleg left..dummy) and a 3-putt (it was a brain fart..a tap in that went left..gotta count it..and dumb), but still managed to finish with an 88.  At one streak in the round, I got a birdie and followed that by 3 pars..but then hit a double, double, and triple.

I feel if I hit a few more GIRS and reduce the doubles to bogeys (I had 5..perhaps these were the GIR's I needed to hit..lol) I should be able to break 80.  My last three rounds have been 85, 87, 88.  This has been the longest stretch of where I've been hitting in the 80's