Sergio Garcia states racial remark towards Tiger Woods

[topspin4hand]

Whether the comment was or was not racist is now just a matter of what label we want to put on the situation. To me, Sergio was trying to take a negative shot a Tiger based on part of Tiger's racial makeup.  I think that's pretty clear.  I don't need everyone to agree to label the comment "racist" for the comment to be considered unacceptable and despicable.

Originally Posted by Mr. Desmond

Yes, but Fuzzy was worse .... "or collared greens ... or whatever those people eat..."

It takes longer for some of us to mature ... it took me a long time. Sergio is learning his lessons the hard way. Was his statement racist? Well, it was a stereotype used in a negative manner ... but I give Sergio the benefit of the doubt. He is emotional and he was trying to get even with Tiger - that thirst for revenge overcame common sense or rational thought. His apology was offered immediately and in a sincere manner.

I just read that Sergio's Taylormade deal is worth $5 million per year!  No wonder he could hardly sleep!

[tristanhilton85]

Originally Posted by saturday

Exactly. Something Ernest still doesn't understand. You can't help it if someone perceives your comments the wrong way. Talk all you want Ernest about how it's racist... it isn't. Stereotype. Beating a dead horse.

I said it before, but once again, it is a stereotype based upon race... it is a racist stereotype.

[Mac62]

Originally Posted by tstrike34

A great example is that Euro Tour official referring to dark skinned folks as Coloured. Thats racist in its pure form in my view.

This is something I've always been curious about, and it's a 100% honest question:  In America, the current 'nom du jour' is "African-American".  What terminology do other countries use?  For example, do Canadians use "African-Canadian"?  How about the European countries?  "African-British"? "African-Spanish"?  I'm not familiar with the conventions elsewhere and am honestly curious about it.

[Stretch]

Most other countries just use "black" and "white". Incidentally, here in South Africa, there is a significant mixed-race group (about 10% of the population) that self identifies as "coloured" -- and the word carries no stigma.

[minitour]

Most other countries just use "black" and "white". Incidentally, here in South Africa, there is a significant mixed-race group (about 10% of the population) that self identifies as "coloured" -- and the word carries no stigma.

That's because y'all put that "u" in it...

[RonTheSavage]

Thought this was hilarious, thought I'd share. The best line to me was "Fried Chicken should unify us, but it continues to tear us apart!"

[HighlandLaird]

Originally Posted by Mr. Desmond

Sergio apologizes, but not to Tiger:

"Sergio Garcia is apologizing for saying he would “serve fried chicken” while making a joke about having Tiger Woods over for dinner.

The British newspaper The Guardian reports Garcia was asked in jest while on stage at the European Tour’s awards dinner Tuesday night if he would invite Woods to dinner during the U.S. Open.

The Guardian reports Garcia said: “We will have him round every night. We will serve fried chicken.”

The newspaper says Garcia released a statement through the European Tour: “I apologise for any offence that may have been caused by my comment on stage during The European Tour Players’ Awards dinner. I answered a question that was clearly made towards me as a joke with a silly remark, but in no way was the comment meant in a racist manner.” Garcia has acknowledged not getting along with Woods."

http://www.nhregister.com/articles/2013/05/21/sports/doc519c335a24b66077654176.txt

Sergio made a remark that is routinely aimed to make light of a certain race in a derogatory manner -- therefore, I'd call it a racist remark.

What on earth is "racist" about fried chicken?  You'll have to explain that to this simple Brit. What is special about fried chicken in the US?

This seems to me to be nonsense.  For my money, it would be a good thing if Woods disappeared from golf----all I ever see him doing is spit, swear and throw clubs, or congratulate himself if he hits a good shot,  all rather more reprehensible than referring to one kind of cooked chicken compared with another.  The reason I loved watching Snead, Hogan, Nelson, Cotton, Thomson, Locke, Casper, Palmer, Nicklaus, Trevino, Weiskopf, Player, Watson et al is that they were such sportsmen, modest in victory and dignified in defeat, completely unlike Woods.

[ElWagonne]

Originally Posted by HighlandLaird

What on earth is "racist" about fried chicken?  You'll have to explain that to this simple Brit. What is special about fried chicken in the US?

This seems to me to be nonsense.  For my money, it would be a good thing if Woods disappeared from golf----all I ever see him doing is spit, swear and throw clubs, or congratulate himself if he hits a good shot,  all rather more reprehensible than referring to one kind of cooked chicken compared with another.  The reason I loved watching Snead, Hogan, Nelson, Cotton, Thomson, Locke, Casper, Palmer, Nicklaus, Trevino, Weiskopf, Player, Watson et al is that they were such sportsmen, modest in victory and dignified in defeat, completely unlike Woods.

Can I call BS on this.  If not I will anyway.    Is Woods a saint......NO.  But you have managed to make the old guard seem like deities (despite their own issues) and show your own misguided beliefs or flat out denial of the issue shown to the board.  This takes a special talent, one which I want no part of.

[Golfingdad]

Originally Posted by walk18

Just because comments might piss people off, that doesn't automatically mean those comments are racist.

Ernest, not quite sure why you "surrendered" to this comment.  It's correct.  See my previous example of making sincere small talk with a pregnant slightly pudgy lady.  There, at the very least, has to be knowledge that the term could be considered racist (see our side discussion in some random thread a few weeks back about the word "spaz"), and there also has to be intent.

There really is no way to know if Sergio intended to be disparaging (I'm going to take him at his word in his apology because I don't know him and have no reason not to), and there is also no way to know that he even knows of the stereotype.  He said he was caught off guard by the question, and for all we know, he could have just been quickly trying to come up with some food that was stereotypically American ... as opposed to stereotypically black.  Had he quickly said hamburgers or pizza, we wouldn't have batted an eye.

Originally Posted by Mr. Desmond

Yes, but Fuzzy was worse .... "or collared greens ... or whatever those people eat..."

Yeah, everybody's first reaction was probably a gasp and a "he said what?!?!?!?!" after hearing Sergio's comment.  And, specifically because it made us all think of Fuzzy's comments.  Not until Des here posted this did I remember that 'fried chicken' was, far and away, the least racist portion of Fuzzy's comments.  He left no question as to his intentions when he threw in "those people."  And, Sergio has also admitted he didn't know of the Fuzzy incident, and I believe that because he was 17 and in Spain at the time.  It was huge news here, but I doubt it made its way overseas.

To me, it is perfectly plausible that he meant no offense by what he said because he didn't even know what he said was offensive.  And since there is really no way to know for sure, I'm going to withhold judgement. :)

[RonTheSavage]

Originally Posted by HighlandLaird

What on earth is "racist" about fried chicken?  You'll have to explain that to this simple Brit. What is special about fried chicken in the US?

This seems to me to be nonsense.  For my money, it would be a good thing if Woods disappeared from golf----all I ever see him doing is spit, swear and throw clubs, or congratulate himself if he hits a good shot,  all rather more reprehensible than referring to one kind of cooked chicken compared with another.  The reason I loved watching Snead, Hogan, Nelson, Cotton, Thomson, Locke, Casper, Palmer, Nicklaus, Trevino, Weiskopf, Player, Watson et al is that they were such sportsmen, modest in victory and dignified in defeat, completely unlike Woods.

Since the American Civil War , traditional slave foods like fried chicken, watermelon , and chitterlings have suffered a strong association with African American stereotypes and blackface minstrelsy. This was commercialized for the first half of the 20th century by restaurants like Sambo's and Coon Chicken Inn , which selected exaggerated depictions of blacks as mascots , implying quality by their association with the stereotype. Although also being acknowledged positively as " soul food " today, the affinity that African American culture has for fried chicken has been considered a delicate, often pejorative issue. While the perception of fried chicken as an ethnic dish has been fading for several decades, with the ubiquity of fried chicken dishes in the US, it persists as a racial stereotype.

[Ernest Jones]

Originally Posted by Golfingdad

Ernest, not quite sure why you "surrendered" to this comment.  It's correct.  See my previous example of making sincere small talk with a pregnant slightly pudgy lady.  There, at the very least, has to be knowledge that the term could be considered racist (see our side discussion in some random thread a few weeks back about the word "spaz"), and there also has to be intent.

There really is no way to know if Sergio intended to be disparaging (I'm going to take him at his word in his apology because I don't know him and have no reason not to), and there is also no way to know that he even knows of the stereotype.  He said he was caught off guard by the question, and for all we know, he could have just been quickly trying to come up with some food that was stereotypically American ... as opposed to stereotypically black.  Had he quickly said hamburgers or pizza, we wouldn't have batted an eye.

Yeah, everybody's first reaction was probably a gasp and a "he said what?!?!?!?!" after hearing Sergio's comment.  And, specifically because it made us all think of Fuzzy's comments.  Not until Des here posted this did I remember that 'fried chicken' was, far and away, the least racist portion of Fuzzy's comments.  He left no question as to his intentions when he threw in "those people."  And, Sergio has also admitted he didn't know of the Fuzzy incident, and I believe that because he was 17 and in Spain at the time.  It was huge news here, but I doubt it made its way overseas.

To me, it is perfectly plausible that he meant no offense by what he said because he didn't even know what he said was offensive.  And since there is really no way to know for sure, I'm going to withhold judgement. :)

I'm not surrendering my position I'm just not wasting anymore of my time trying to sway people to my position.

My opinion remains unchanged, the comment was absolutely and unequivably racist, it was a stereotype based on race. That is what racist means. The comment does not need to suggest superiority or even hate to be racist ie: saying that you love the way black people dance is just as racist as saying you hate the way they're always stealing hubcaps. One may be percieved as a little less hurtful but they are both racist comments. They are both blanket statements applied to a group of people because of the colour (or color in 'Murican) of their skin.

I have also gone on record as believing that Sergio is not a racist, he is just an idiot who eff'd up trying to be too cute (kinda like on the 17th at the Players ). I don't think Sergio has a problem with black people (but I could be wrong) and I don't think he believes they all sit around in shacks eating fried chicken. You don't have to be a racist to make a racist comment and making a racist comment does not make you a racist, that is where the whole intent and/or belief thing comes into play BUT whether or not the person making the comment is or is not in fact a racist does not change the fact that the comment is racist by its very nature.

And as for the whole, "Sergio had never heard the Zoeller comments" arguement...that is totally unbelievable to me. Yes he was 17, yes he lived in Spain but he also lives and breaths golf and to expect me to believe he wasn't aware of the controversy that occured at an obscure little event like the Masters is a bit of a whopper. Might need an extra large and refreshing Sprite to wash that one down.

In anycase I stated WAY back in the thread that I wasn't going to be revisiting this thread and that was good instinct that I should have followed but sadly didn't.

So there!

[Paradox]

My only conclusion is that my family has deep southern roots and also "poor" roots and fried chicken is awesomely delicious.  You don't speak in regards to a black person and refer to feeding them fried chicken without some racist connotation...to try and explain otherwise is just silly.  EVERYONE knows the stereotype, so continuing it is a racist thing.
That said...I wish the golf world would move on, really.  Feeding the fire doesn't do any good.

[Ernest Jones]

Try to guess what I am having for dinner tonight.

[tmac20]

Try to guess what I am having for dinner tonight. O:)

Pizza?

[Ernest Jones]

Originally Posted by tmac20

Pizza?

Easy there Chachi, I happen to be 1/4 Italian.

[colin007]

Originally Posted by RonTheSavage

Thought this was hilarious, thought I'd share. The best line to me was "Fried Chicken should unify us, but it continues to tear us apart!"

"You have a job...How can you eat Church's fried chicken when you got a job?!?!"

[colin007]

Originally Posted by Paradox

My only conclusion is that my family has deep southern roots and also "poor" roots and fried chicken is awesomely delicious.  You don't speak in regards to a black person and refer to feeding them fried chicken without some racist connotation...to try and explain otherwise is just silly.  EVERYONE knows the stereotype, so continuing it is a racist thing.

That said...I wish the golf world would move on, really.  Feeding the fire doesn't do any good.

yeah, this is pretty much it.  its just something you know.

[Golfingdad]

Originally Posted by HighlandLaird

What on earth is "racist" about fried chicken?  You'll have to explain that to this simple Brit. What is special about fried chicken in the US?

This seems to me to be nonsense.  For my money, it would be a good thing if Woods disappeared from golf----all I ever see him doing is spit, swear and throw clubs, or congratulate himself if he hits a good shot,  all rather more reprehensible than referring to one kind of cooked chicken compared with another.  The reason I loved watching Snead, Hogan, Nelson, Cotton, Thomson, Locke, Casper, Palmer, Nicklaus, Trevino, Weiskopf, Player, Watson et al is that they were such sportsmen, modest in victory and dignified in defeat, completely unlike Woods.

Originally Posted by Paradox

You don't speak in regards to a black person and refer to feeding them fried chicken without some racist connotation...to try and explain otherwise is just silly.  EVERYONE knows the stereotype, so continuing it is a racist thing.

No, they don't.  Heck, I only had to scroll up 5 posts in this very thread to find somebody who doesn't know the stereotype.  To suggest that EVERYBODY knows the stereotype is a little ethnocentric.

And if you read back through the rest of the thread, you will find more.  Further, one common denominator of the majority of people who don't know it are not from the US.  Neither is Sergio.  Is it likely that he doesn't know of historic racist sterotypes in this country?  I don't know.  But it is certainly plausible.

Here's another example.  Bill Gates "offended" everybody in South Korea because he casually shook hands with their President with his other hand in his pocket.  It was offensive to them as it was against their custom, but him not being familiar with their customs, he had no idea.  He was just being what he thought was polite.  Everybody in America does (or should know) of these sterotypes, but there is no reason to think that people from across the globe know them as well.