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That is 100% factually correct. OSU is in the Big 10, Bama and FSU are not. ;)

Which means absolutely nothing :-D

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How do you know that? Wisconsin and OSU hasn't played either AL or FSU.

I'll bet you can tell me who would win if OSU were to play Syracuse......even though they haven't played yet. ;-)

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Which means absolutely nothing :-D

Hey, I agree. Let's say Bama was in the Big 12 ... Are we saying they would beat Texas Tech 100-25 instead of 63-25 (or whatever it was)? You can't make any good judgments between teams that are undefeated and have had virtually no trouble in winning all of their games. "There are 2 kinds of people in this world. Those that can extrapolate from incomplete data

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How do you know that? Wisconsin and OSU hasn't played either AL or FSU.


And Ohio State is not likely to be playing either one.   The chances of both losing are pretty slim and Baylor is going to jump Ohio State after next week.   It is set up to happen that way by virtue of both strength of schedule and the way the human polls are going to judge them.

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I'll bet you can tell me who would win if OSU were to play Syracuse......even though they haven't played yet. ;-)

So they shouldn't even play football right.

"A good conversation is not designed to win the argument. It is designed to enjoy the exchange."

Matt "Dough", P.E.
My Game Golf Profile -
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So they shouldn't even play football right.

Sorry, I don't understand the question. My point was that you don't always have to have seen two teams play each other to know who the better team is.

In David's bag....

Driver: Titleist 910 D-3;  9.5* Diamana Kai'li
3-Wood: Titleist 910F;  15* Diamana Kai'li
Hybrids: Titleist 910H 19* and 21* Diamana Kai'li
Irons: Titleist 695cb 5-Pw

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Really, that sounds stupid to do. How can you make a logical conclusion with out witnessing them play. Unless you like half assed assumptions and riding bandwagons.

"A good conversation is not designed to win the argument. It is designed to enjoy the exchange."

Matt "Dough", P.E.
My Game Golf Profile -
Click Here! (It's not a trap) fasdfa dfdsaf 

What's in My Bag
Driver: :callaway: GBB Epic,  3-Wood: 
:titleist: 917h3 ,  Hybrid:  :titleist: 915 2-Hybrid,  Irons: :srixon: (4-PW)
Wedges:
:edel: Trapper (52, 56, 60),  Putter: :edel:,  Ball: :snell: MTB,  Shoe: :true_linkswear:,  Rangfinder: :bushnell: Tour V2

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Really, that sounds stupid to do. How can you make a logical conclusion with out witnessing them play. Unless you like half assed assumptions and riding bandwagons.


Those kinds of conclusions are made each week.   Nothing new there.    The bottom line is, Ohio State is going to be on the outside looking in unless Alabama and FSU both lose.   Given the piss poor play of the Big 10 over the past few years, if Ohio State wants to be taken seriously, they need to stop scheduling cupcakes for their non-conference games.

My bet is, Ohio State plays in the Rose Bowl, where they lose to Oregon..

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Those kinds of conclusions are made each week.   Nothing new there.    The bottom line is, Ohio State is going to be on the outside looking in unless Alabama and FSU both lose.   Given the piss poor play of the Big 10 over the past few years, if Ohio State wants to be taken seriously, they need to stop scheduling cupcakes for their non-conference games.    My bet is, Ohio State plays in the Rose Bowl, where they lose to Oregon..

Agree. The Big-X seems to think ND is a tough OOC schedule.

Kevin

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Agree. The Big-X seems to think ND is a tough OOC schedule.

Yeah, but it's not like the SEC is playing the toughest non-conference opponents either.  They hang their hat on the fact that everybody says the SEC is the best conference, beat Chattanooga and Colorado State out of conference, then all only lose to each other in conference, but "Hey, what do you expect?  We're the toughest conference" and then pat themselves on the back and say that Alabama is "clearly" better than Ohio State.  That's BS.

Now, I realize you have to pick somebody, and I'd concur at this point that Alabama and FSU deserve those top two spots, but I object to the idea that they are "clearly" a notch above Ohio State and Baylor.  Alabama struggled with Ole Miss last weekend ... I wasn't very impressed with that one.  Baylor, on the other hand, ran circles around TT like they were a bunch of high schoolers.  Does anybody think that Alabama looked like they were in another league above Baylor this weekend?

Further, Florida State's non-conference schedule this year is Nevada, Bethune-Cookman, Idaho, and Florida.  Seriously?  And they're in the ACC.  Outside of Clemson, there isn't much there.

I think the Rose Bowl always goes out of their way to stick to the traditional Big-10/Pac-10 matchup so roper is probably right that OSU ends up against Oregon there, but boy would it be fun if they pulled some strings to get a "consolation" title game between OSU and Baylor.  (Obviously assuming all four still win out ... which I'm actually guessing will probably not happen)

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Either way, OSU is going to get rocked.  They are easily the most overrated team in college football.  They defense sucks, they have an overrated QB and an average run game.  Heck, they might not even make it past Michigan State in the B1G championship game.  In any event, I look forward to seeing Buckeye fans cry when their team gets exposed.

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Either way, OSU is going to get rocked.  They are easily the most overrated team in college football.  They defense sucks, they have an overrated QB and an average run game.  Heck, they might not even make it past Michigan State in the B1G championship game.  In any event, I look forward to seeing Buckeye fans cry when their team gets exposed.

Sorry, but this makes no sense.  "Over-rated" = rated too high.  You are suggesting that a team that is rated 3rd out of 4 unbeatens left in the AQ conferences (and will probably be fourth after next week) is rated too high?  This is also the team that, along with Baylor, some people are saying don't belong in the same "league" as Alabama and FSU.  Doesn't exactly sound like "overrated" to me.  Sounds like either they are rated exactly where they should be, or perhaps an argument could be made that they are underrated.

Will they win whatever bowl game they end up in?  I have no idea.  Will they most likely be underdogs if they end up pitted against Alabama, FSU, Baylor, or Oregon?  Probably.  But can an argument be made that they are currently overrated?  No way.  Unless, of course, you are a biased Badger.  Makes sense, seeing as how you guys beat them and all.  Oh wait ...

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Really, that sounds stupid to do. How can you make a logical conclusion with out witnessing them play. Unless you like half assed assumptions and riding bandwagons.

What do you mean?  I've watched OSU play a half dozen times this year.  They're good.....better than a lot of people give them credit for too, but.....

......I'm also smart enough, and know enough about football to be able to judge the relative abilities of two teams without having to see them play each other.

As to bandwagons, if you're talking the whole strength of schedule/conference thing, remember, I'm a diehard Big 10 guy too.  I just married into the ACC. :-D

In David's bag....

Driver: Titleist 910 D-3;  9.5* Diamana Kai'li
3-Wood: Titleist 910F;  15* Diamana Kai'li
Hybrids: Titleist 910H 19* and 21* Diamana Kai'li
Irons: Titleist 695cb 5-Pw

Wedges: Scratch 51-11 TNC grind, Vokey SM-5's;  56-14 F grind and 60-11 K grind
Putter: Scotty Cameron Kombi S
Ball: ProV1

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Sorry, but this makes no sense.  "Over-rated" = rated too high.  You are suggesting that a team that is rated 3rd out of 4 unbeatens left in the AQ conferences (and will probably be fourth after next week) is rated too high?  This is also the team that, along with Baylor, some people are saying don't belong in the same "league" as Alabama and FSU.  Doesn't exactly sound like "overrated" to me.  Sounds like either they are rated exactly where they should be, or perhaps an argument could be made that they are underrated.

Will they win whatever bowl game they end up in?  I have no idea.  Will they most likely be underdogs if they end up pitted against Alabama, FSU, Baylor, or Oregon?  Probably.  But can an argument be made that they are currently overrated?  No way.  Unless, of course, you are a biased Badger.  Makes sense, seeing as how you guys beat them and all.  Oh wait ...

Overrated because they barely beat Wisconsin at home and barely beat Northwestern, a team that isnt even ranked anymore.  Look how many points they gave up to Illinois.  Like I said, I look forward to the Buckeyes getting exposed and seeing all their fans cry.

What even funnier is every day I have to listen to their fans whine about how they should be at least #2, if not #1 and how they would blow out Alabama and FSU.

Let me ask you this: was Notre Dame overrated last season?  Just because youre undefeated, doesnt always mean you are one of the best teams in college football.  The B1G is so soft right now, theres really only 3 or 4 decent teams and of those, the only one that they have beat thus far is Wisconsin, which they barely beat at the shoe.  When youre #4 and you barely beat a team that was ranked #24 at the time at home, you dont deserve to be in the discussion for a BCS national championship.

Whats in my :sunmountain: C-130 cart bag?

Woods: :mizuno: JPX 850 9.5*, :mizuno: JPX 850 15*, :mizuno: JPX-850 19*, :mizuno: JPX Fli-Hi #4, :mizuno: JPX 800 Pro 5-PW, :mizuno: MP T-4 50-06, 54-09 58-10, :cleveland: Smart Square Blade and :bridgestone: B330-S

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What do you mean?  I've watched OSU play a half dozen times this year.  They're good.....better than a lot of people give them credit for too, but.....

......I'm also smart enough, and know enough about football to be able to judge the relative abilities of two teams without having to see them play each other.

As to bandwagons, if you're talking the whole strength of schedule/conference thing, remember, I'm a diehard Big 10 guy too.  I just married into the ACC.

Hey, same here.  My fiance is a Maryland alum.

Whats in my :sunmountain: C-130 cart bag?

Woods: :mizuno: JPX 850 9.5*, :mizuno: JPX 850 15*, :mizuno: JPX-850 19*, :mizuno: JPX Fli-Hi #4, :mizuno: JPX 800 Pro 5-PW, :mizuno: MP T-4 50-06, 54-09 58-10, :cleveland: Smart Square Blade and :bridgestone: B330-S

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Overrated because they barely beat Wisconsin at home and barely beat Northwestern, a team that isnt even ranked anymore.  Look how many points they gave up to Illinois.  Like I said, I look forward to the Buckeyes getting exposed and seeing all their fans cry.

What even funnier is every day I have to listen to their fans whine about how they should be at least #2, if not #1 and how they would blow out Alabama and FSU.

But you're still misusing the word.  Just because their fans want them to be ranked higher doesn't mean that they are overrated.  What it actually means is that in those people eyes, they are underrated ... and in the eyes of people who disagree with them, they are correctly rated.  Only if you think they belong behind a bunch of teams with a loss (which would just make you look dumb) could you fairly argue that they are overrated.

And so what if they gave up a bunch of points to Illinois?  What does that mean?  They're all garbage time points, first of all, so they mean nothing.  However, if you want to talk about stuff like that, fine lets do it.  Explain how Alabama failed to score more points against MSU (I incorrectly said Ole Miss earlier) than Kentucky and Bowling Green.  (2 of MSU's 4 wins this year - the other two being Alcorn State and Troy).

We can talk about how Baylor gave up 42 points to 4-7 West Virginia, or 25 points to a team that lost to North Dakota State (yes, its a real school).

I don't have much to say about FSU, because they only gave up more than 17 points once this year, and that was 34 to BC, who isn't horrible.

Point is, if you want to cherry pick random stats for one team, you gotta do it for all of them.  Otherwise, just sit tight and wait until OSU loses and then have your fun.

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But you're still misusing the word.  Just because their fans want them to be ranked higher doesn't mean that they are overrated.  What it actually means is that in those people eyes, they are underrated ... and in the eyes of people who disagree with them, they are correctly rated.  Only if you think they belong behind a bunch of teams with a loss (which would just make you look dumb) could you fairly argue that they are overrated.

And so what if they gave up a bunch of points to Illinois?  What does that mean?  They're all garbage time points, first of all, so they mean nothing.  However, if you want to talk about stuff like that, fine lets do it.  Explain how Alabama failed to score more points against MSU (I incorrectly said Ole Miss earlier) than Kentucky and Bowling Green.  (2 of MSU's 4 wins this year - the other two being Alcorn State and Troy).

We can talk about how Baylor gave up 42 points to 4-7 West Virginia, or 25 points to a team that lost to North Dakota State (yes, its a real school).

I don't have much to say about FSU, because they only gave up more than 17 points once this year, and that was 34 to BC, who isn't horrible.

Point is, if you want to cherry pick random stats for one team, you gotta do it for all of them.  Otherwise, just sit tight and wait until OSU loses and then have your fun.

Isn't that the key right there. Wouldn't over-rate be when when a consensus is made that they are ranked higher then they are. I mean everyone knows the Big Ten is down over the past 10 years. They are not getting any love from ESPN, CBS, FOX Sports, or the AP pollsters. Look at over the weekend, the BCS is just waiting for another chance to get Baylor over OSU. The only thing saving OSU is the computer rankings right now. That is going to change fast. So, you saying they are over-rated is absurd. Heck they might be underrated, depending on how they do in a bowl game.

"A good conversation is not designed to win the argument. It is designed to enjoy the exchange."

Matt "Dough", P.E.
My Game Golf Profile -
Click Here! (It's not a trap) fasdfa dfdsaf 

What's in My Bag
Driver: :callaway: GBB Epic,  3-Wood: 
:titleist: 917h3 ,  Hybrid:  :titleist: 915 2-Hybrid,  Irons: :srixon: (4-PW)
Wedges:
:edel: Trapper (52, 56, 60),  Putter: :edel:,  Ball: :snell: MTB,  Shoe: :true_linkswear:,  Rangfinder: :bushnell: Tour V2

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Yeah, but it's not like the SEC is playing the toughest non-conference opponents either.  They hang their hat on the fact that everybody says the SEC is the best conference, beat Chattanooga and Colorado State out of conference, then all only lose to each other in conference, but "Hey, what do you expect?  We're the toughest conference" and then pat themselves on the back and say that Alabama is "clearly" better than Ohio State.  That's BS.

Just looked at the top-5 teams from the Big-X and SEC.  In each case, 4/5 teams had one major conference team (if you count ND as a major conference team) on the OOC schedule.  Ohio State's problem is that their "major" OOC game this year was Cal, who happens to be 1-10.

So I'll agree that the OOC schedules are equally squishy.

I also agree that ranking and SoS calculations are circular, a point I've made before.  SEC gets an artificial boost because everyone assumes that the SEC is so tough, so their SoS gets a boost, and their rankings get a boost, so their SoS gets a boost....

I haven't watched Ohio State much this year, so I'll admit that I'm basing my opinion primarily on gut--the Big-X has sucked for a while, and OSU is just doing what they have done so many times before.  Likewise I think the Big-12 is down this year, so I don't necessarily think Baylor is all that good relative to FSU.

I think the ACC is the only conference that's really proven themselves this year, with Clemson and Miami racking big wins over Florida and GA (and probably SC in a few weeks, but obviously not yet).  FSU has pummeled both Clemson and Miami, so I think FSU has really "earned" it's spot.  If Clemson beats SC then I'll probably agree that ACC is the best conference overall this year (at least comparing the top teams--but I think that the middle teams are stronger in the SEC).

Bama has earned the #1 spot by not really being challenged and not losing a game for as long as anyone can remember.  What have they lost twice this decade?  Looking at the SEC as a conference, you could argue that they've lost to the ACC in big matchups--but I still think Bama deserves to be #1 until someone beats them.

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Kevin

Titleist 910 D3 9.5* with ahina 72 X flex
Titleist 910F 13.5* with ahina 72 X flex
Adams Idea A12 Pro hybrid 18*; 23* with RIP S flex
Titleist 712 AP2 4-9 iron with KBS C-Taper, S+ flex
Titleist Vokey SM wedges 48*, 52*, 58*
Odyssey White Hot 2-ball mallet, center shaft, 34"

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