Tobacco products on golf course

[NJpatbee]

The difference is that Carbon Monoxide poisoning doesn't have as many long term issues as tobacco smoke inhalation does. I do agree that it's overboard in some cases with it being outdoors (the golf course being one place), but that's like comparing drowning to smoking a cigar. The carbon monoxide displaces oxygen that is needed, but does not cause cancer. Breathing in levels of carbon monoxide similar to that of working in a mechanic's garage for years will give you some heart problems, but this is because it has to work harder to supply the necessary oxygen compared to someone out in the open air where the carbon monoxide can be dispersed.

On a golf course I don't mind if people smoke, but I have to stay upwind of them due to asthma concerns. Breathing the smoke for more than brief periods throughout a round usually causes a reaction resulting in me coughing uncontrollably. Not only is it detrimental to my golf game to be exposed to tobacco smoke for extended period of time, but it's just plain not fun. I don't mind though as long as people are considerate enough to do it downwind of me.

The long and short of it is that tobacco smoke causes cancer as opposed to "dry drowning" someone. The causes of death are very different, and it's not a great comparison.

I appreciate the fact that your sensitivity to smoke can cause you to cough and have discomfort and would hope that any smoker would have the courtesy to keep their distance when smoking.  I do understand the difference between carbon monoxide poisoning and the long term effects of smoking that could cause cancer but was trying to make the point that the amount of smoke inhaled by an occasional whiff of tobacco smoke is not likely to cause harm, yet many people live in areas where auto pollution is rampant but freak out if they smell a cigarette.

My understanding is that combustible engine exhaust includes the following (copied from another website):

Carbon Monoxide :

Colorless, odorless, tasteless, yet highly toxic. Automobile and industrial emissions may also contribute to the greenhouse effect and global warming. It occurs naturally in our atmosphere at around 0.1 parts per million, but car exhaust without a catalytic converter contains 7,000 parts per million.

Nitrogen dioxide:
Toxic by inhalation and can cause adverse health effects at low levels over a long period. It can contribute to acid rain and oxygen depletion of plant life in coastal waters.

Sulphur dioxide:
Can cause pulmonary and respiratory distress and acidification of waterways.

Particulate matter:
This is basically soot - it's most apparent effect is reducing visibility. It impacts on breathing and respiratory systems, damages lung tissues and causes cancer. Hundreds of thousands, if not millions of people and animals die prematurely each year due to the health effects of inhaling particulate matter.

Benzene:
A carcinogen to humans, benzene is also very toxic to aquatic life and can cause death in plants. It is a "precursor" component for formation of photochemical smog.

Formaldehyde:
Another known carcinogen to humans, with similar effects to many animals and birds. In an aquatic environment, formaldehyde has a half-life of between a day and ten days.

Polycyclic hydrocarbons :
One of the most widespread organic pollutants, they are formed by incomplete combustion of carbon-containing fuels.
The U.S. Department of Health and Human Services states that some polycyclic hydrocarbons may be carcinogens to humans and animals and can cause harmful effects of the skin and the immune system.

Some recent studies have also found car exhaust can create hydrocarbon-based free radicals which can linger indefinitely. These free radicals are believed to cause lung cancer and cardiovascular diseases. Even with the use of catalytic converters to help break down pollutants that cause smog, exhaust may be creating conditions for these free radicals to form.

Now I smoked cigarettes for 35 years and it may wind up killing me.  I have not had a cigarette in over 9 years but will smoke 5-6 cigars per week.   I know it is harmful and understand the effects of second hand smoke in enclosed areas.  But in open outside areas such as golf courses or Central Park I believe it can be irritating or annoying so common courtesy should be used, but the health impact does not come near the danger of some of the polluted environments we live in (e.g. the streets of Manhattan).

[boogielicious]

Purely a matter of personal opinion.  I don't like the smell of cigar smoke, didn't even like it back when I was still smoking.  I also don't drink coffee, and don't much care for that odor either.  I can't even walk into a Starbucks.

Starbucks is actually a front for Dr. Evil's crime organization.  Wise choice.

[Lihu]

Starbucks is actually a front for Dr. Evil's crime organization.  Wise choice.

I just knew there was a reason they are sprouting up everywhere. ;-)

[Slice of Life]

Are you sure that's not because other courses in the region are no longer in operation?

Fourteen 18-hole courses opened in the U.S. in 2013, while more than 150 closed up shop. It was the eighth consecutive year that more courses closed than opened, and last year the ratio was more than 10 to 1.

Golf participation numbers are way, way down from their peak in the late '90s. That's not an anecdotal observation – it's fact.

Sure, a lot of courses all around the country are doing just fine, but many are benefiting from a reduced pool of options.

Maybe, but I can't think of any that have closed down that would have competed with these courses anyway. Maybe NE Ohio is just a good golf location since we can only play like 3 months a year, so it's always lined up lol

[Shorty]

I also don't drink coffee, and don't much care for that odor either.  I can't even walk into a Starbucks.

In all seriousness , you are not going to get a genuine coffee aroma at a Starbucks.You can get almost anything there except proper coffee, which is why they have failed in serious coffee drinking countries. Coffee flavoured caramel milkshakes are not coffee.

This is a coffee......

[boogielicious]

In all seriousness , you are not going to get a genuine coffee aroma at a Starbucks.You can get almost anything there except proper coffee, which is why they have failed in serious coffee drinking countries. Coffee flavoured caramel milkshakes are not coffee.

This is a coffee......

LOL!  I've been to Australia once.  I flew into Sydney and walked around the city the first day trying to get acclimated to the new time zone.  By 2PM, I was fading.  I was in Darling Harbor and needed coffee.  I am not a fan of Starbucks, but they were right there.  So I ordered just a regular coffee.  It took 15 minutes for the "barista" to pour me a dang cup of coffee.  At a diner or Dunkin Donuts in the US, it would have taken 47 seconds including payment.  As usual, it smelled like they burnt the beans.

[Fourputt]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fourputt

I also don't drink coffee, and don't much care for that odor either.  I can't even walk into a Starbucks.

In all seriousness , you are not going to get a genuine coffee aroma at a Starbucks.You can get almost anything there except proper coffee, which is why they have failed in serious coffee drinking countries. Coffee flavoured caramel milkshakes are not coffee.

This is a coffee......

I'll still take orange juice and 20 ounces of cold water for my morning libation.  Or afternoon, or evening (toss in beer now and then).  I'm not really a fan of any hot beverages (maybe a rare hot chocolate, but my body also doesn't like lactose ).

[mcanadiens]

I drink coffee from 6 a.m. to 5 p.m. Beer from 5 p.m. to 10 p.m. and smoke through the whole day. I am the poster child.

[Lihu]

I am reading all this while I sip my morning coffee (pretty much what @Shorty showed, but with honey and ice because it's summer), I like the aroma of Italian mixes made fresh with our office Seaco espresso maker that grinds the beans for each cup.

Only three people smoke in our company, but they need to smoke downstairs near the parking area.

Definitely no ban on either of these products even in our company.

[ditchparrot19]

Maybe NE Ohio is just a good golf location since we can only play like 3 months a year, so it's always lined up lol

Yeah, that could be, too. A guy I play with out here is originally from Ohio and we were talking one day while warming up for a skins game at 7:30 on a January morning.

"Bet you didn't play much golf in January in Ohio," I said to him.

"None," he replied. "We didn't play much golf in October. Only the diehards were still out there by then."

As a lifelong Californian, that was kind of hard for me to comprehend.

[InTheRough]

So I have a membership card for the municipal courses here in Charlotte and so I am on their email blast list. Yesterday I received an email with a survey attached from them asking about what your feelings would be if they decided to ban all tobacco products from all 4 of their golf courses. Questions like, do you use tobacco products, if so what, and do you support banning them on the courses and how would it affect your playing habits at the courses. Thought it was interesting. What are ya'll thoughts on this? Is it a violation of people's rights? Would it help/hurt the golf course revenue? Is it funny that if they do ban them they will have to push it as being safer for the non tobacco users that are on the course but the survey would lead me to believe that they want to know if they would lose revenue and how much if they were to instill the ban before deciding?

Never been a user of tobacco products, though i have had the occasional cigar before (once or twice a year) and i have to say that i would be very against a ban on tobacco products on a golf course and really against any ban from any government organization that takes choices away from us.   Having said that, i do understand the reasoning behind banning smoking in public places like bars and restaurants because it is an enclosed space and there is no escaping the smoke--having a smoking section in a restaurant is like having a pissing section in a pool---but banning smoking on a course where there are no more than 4 people outside with nobody else around them for a hundred yards is a little over the top and gives them the leeway to ban anything and everything they want for "public health concerns"  Imagine if this was a ban on drinking on a golf course; would you still play that course or move on to another one where you can enjoy a beer at the turn?  Asking a smoker to stand downwind from you or not spitting tobacco juice anywhere near greens or tee boxes are just parts of golf etiquette like not talking in a back-swing or stepping in your putting line.

[mcanadiens]

Yeah, that could be, too. A guy I play with out here is originally from Ohio and we were talking one day while warming up for a skins game at 7:30 on a January morning.

"Bet you didn't play much golf in January in Ohio," I said to him.

"None," he replied. "We didn't play much golf in October. Only the diehards were still out there by then."

As a lifelong Californian, that was kind of hard for me to comprehend.

There's a bit of difference between northeast Ohio and the rest of the state. You have some of that lake effect stuff coming off Lake Erie. Maybe I'm a diehard, but I love fall golf here in the SE corner. January is definitely pretty tough. Can't say I've never done it, but it's rarely even possible.

[saevel25]

Maybe, but I can't think of any that have closed down that would have competed with these courses anyway. Maybe NE Ohio is just a good golf location since we can only play like 3 months a year, so it's always lined up lol

Seriously? You can play golf in March (sometimes), April, May, June, July, August, September, October, and November (sometimes). You got 7 legit months to play golf, with 2 other months that can be warm enough to play. Ohio isn't that bad for golf, not like @Ernest Jones in Canada

On topic about Tobacco products. To those who go to the driving range, DO NOT FRICKEN SMOKE WHEN YOU ARE AT THE RANGE. Honestly, I had this guy about 10 yards away from me yesterday, I was downwind. He lite up a cigarette. Talk about an inconsiderate A** HOLE!!

[Slice of Life]

Seriously? You can play golf in March (sometimes), April, May, June, July, August, September, October, and November (sometimes). You got 7 legit months to play golf, with 2 other months that can be warm enough to play. Ohio isn't that bad for golf, not like @Ernest Jones in Canada

On topic about Tobacco products. To those who go to the driving range, DO NOT FRICKEN SMOKE WHEN YOU ARE AT THE RANGE. Honestly, I had this guy about 10 yards away from me yesterday, I was downwind. He lite up a cigarette. Talk about an inconsiderate A** HOLE!!

Good luck playing up in Cleveland in March and April. May was dicey this year. You hit a perfect drive down the middle and can't find your ball because it's plugged 3 inches deep.

So you really get 4 quality months...June, July, August, and September. And this year so far, it's rained 4 days a week, so even June sucked...

[CR McDivot]

...

On topic about Tobacco products. To those who go to the driving range, DO NOT FRICKEN SMOKE WHEN YOU ARE AT THE RANGE. Honestly, I had this guy about 10 yards away from me yesterday, I was downwind. He lite up a cigarette. Talk about an inconsiderate A** HOLE!!

OMG...Thirty feet away, outdoors. Whiner or weenie, I'd of told you to suck it up.

[CR McDivot]

OMG...Thirty feet away, outdoors. Whiner or weenie, I'd of told you to suck it up.

Actually, when confronted with a similar situation a while back, I graciously moved as far downwind of the complainant as possible. I behaved as a gentleman... and he as a c**t!

[Hammer 4]

My range has a smoking, and no smoking sections. Wind blows down range 99.99% of the time. I often see guys hitting balls with a cig in their mouth, both in the non smoking and smoking section. Seriously, have a little consideration.

And I started smoking again, after stopping for almost a year...

[boogielicious]

Actually, when confronted with a similar situation a while back, I graciously moved as far downwind of the complainant as possible. I behaved as a gentleman... and he as a c**t!

Please watch the attacks against other posters.  Your last comment was not appropriate.