Do Slow Players Know They're Slow?

[mvmac]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MS256

To me 4 hours is slow.

4 hours for a foursome isn't slow IMO. Generally around 5 hours would be considered slow.

Quote:

Originally Posted by boogielicious

To add to Mike's point above, I also see players take their time after their shot.  The take a minute to put their club in the bag and get into the cart at a snail's pace or they walk slowly off the green while chatting.  I see this in my league group.  I walk much faster than most of the guys.

Yes good point, they "hang out" too much after the shot.

Quote:

Originally Posted by arturo28mx

In contrast, japanese players in my area are gentlemen. Very polite. They always say please and thank you. Last month one japanese player accidentally hit another player with his shot and ran to him and got on his knees to apologize.

Off topic but my dad has played golf in Japan several times. In Japan (at least in the late 80's/early 90's) a round of golf was an all day event. There is a mandatory lunch break after the front nine that is typically an hour long and there are even breaks every 3-4 holes. Then after the round you take a hot bath.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Patch

Tiger Woods was getting accolades for growing the sport. Everyone associated with golf was making money. Even an $8 an hour worker had money to golf because everything else cost less. I honestly don't remember slow play being a topic of any interest during those high revenue years. In today's economic climate, there are just a lot of folks who do not have a fat enough wallet to play the game. Everything cost more today than it did 10 years ago. Loss of revenue is closing some courses, and increasing green fees on others. Hypothetically speaking, where there might have been 10 courses for the golfing masses to use, there might now only be 7. With the closure of 1/3 of the courses available, those folks  who lost their home courses now had to gravitate to the remaining 7 courses which probably over crowded those courses, which brought more slow play complaints. Increased use mean more maintenance which requires more revenue, which again goes back to one's wallet.

Slow play has always been, or at least been perceived as, a problem. Here's an article from July 1950 from the USGA Journal.

http://gsr.lib.msu.edu/1950s/1950/500719.pdf

Quote:

Originally Posted by luchnia

I keep seeing "ready golf" mentioned. Outside of getting quickly off the green, prepping for shot with club and practice swings, and not moving in a snail's pace, what are the basics of "ready golf" that we should adhere to?

http://dandefarmsgolf.com/how-to-play-ready-golf.html

Quote:

Ready Golf means BEING READY to play, not playing when you're ready. Here are some simple rules.

- Walk to your ball as soon as possible, so that you can choose your club and think about the shot in ADVANCE, not when it is your turn.

- When driving a cart, drop off your partner first, let your partner choose his or her club, and then drive to your own ball to get READY to play.

- When a ball is lost, hit your shot FIRST and then look for the lost ball.

- Walk down the SIDES of the fairway to reach your ball and then APPROACH it from the center. NEVER play in a caravan, moving in a group from ball to ball.

- When on the Green, line up your putt BEFORE it is your turn, and putt out immediately instead of marking, if you are not in someone else's line.

[MS256]

4 hours for a foursome isn't slow IMO. Generally around 5 hours would be considered slow.

And that's why I said being slow is relative.

BTW I am considered slow to the people in a daily 12:30 game at a local club. They think they are supposed to be done by 3:00 o'clock (2 1/2 hours) and aren't shy about expressing it. I always told them they were more interested in getting off of the course than they were at winning the game.

Our Saturday game starts at 10:00 o'clock and I must leave by 2:00 o'clock or I would have to quit. Never have had to quit yet but have come close a few times.

[Lihu]

"They aren't aware that a round of golf should be less than 6 hours ;-)"

Most slow players I have played behind, have no idea that they are slow. I overheard one talking to their companion "A round should take a full day". The ones that I pass are usually so slow that I can pass them in their carts just up walking by at a leisurely pace.

[Fourputt]

Quote:

Originally Posted by luchnia

I keep seeing "ready golf" mentioned. Outside of getting quickly off the green, prepping for shot with club and practice swings, and not moving in a snail's pace, what are the basics of "ready golf" that we should adhere to?

Ready golf by my definition is that if your ready to hit, even though your not out, go ahead and hit if nobody else is ready.

It's more than that.  It's getting yourself ready to play while your companions are hitting, if the ball positions allow for it.  It's always being ready to play immediately when it's your turn. or being ready to move immediately to your ball if you must wait.  It's playing your shot at the same time as your buddy on the other side of the fairway rather than standing and watching him.  Just doing these simple things can shave minutes off your round without any need to feel rushed.  If your entire fourball follows these simple principles, you can easily shave a good half hour off the typical round that I see played.

[legitimatebeef]

I have realized that playing fast is not easy nor is it for everyone. It takes experience as well as a decent level of stamina both physical and mental. If you are going to get across the finish line in under four hours, you need to be constantly pushing forward. Fast play doesn't just happen because you want it to--it takes a concentrated effort. Efficiency of movement, constant state of attention and readiness, thinking a couple steps ahead, etc. Personally I like this aspect of golf but I am starting to understand that many don't, and therefore slow play will always be a feature of recreational golf, especially at courses that--as another poster mentioned earlier--lack a distinct culture of fast play.

[legitimatebeef]

Plus think of all the dudes out there who are in no hurry to get back home. It's hopeless. This is why I now look forward to the frozen golf season.

[golf-noob-bruce]

I voted option 2. Slow players are like bad (car) drivers. Everyone complains about bad drivers, but no one ever admits to being one...

[Fourputt]

I have realized that playing fast is not easy nor is it for everyone. It takes experience as well as a decent level of stamina both physical and mental. If you are going to get across the finish line in under four hours, you need to be constantly pushing forward. Fast play doesn't just happen because you want it to--it takes a concentrated effort. Efficiency of movement, constant state of attention and readiness, thinking a couple steps ahead, etc. Personally I like this aspect of golf but I am starting to understand that many don't, and therefore slow play will always be a feature of recreational golf, especially at courses that--as another poster mentioned earlier--lack a distinct culture of fast play.

Nobody is talking about playing fast, we are talking about playing smart, about being ready to play when it's time to play, and about not wasting time screwing around.  It doesn't take a genius, or an Olympic athlete, it just requires that we all recognize that we are there to play golf, and while the social aspect of the game is important, that takes second seat to the game itself.

[No Mulligans]

I have played with a couple, who are neighbors and really close friends, that play brutally slow.  I guess I'll probably play with them again if they invite me (I'm not going to invite them though).  They are pretty much unaware in the sense that it wouldn't even occur to them to consider if they are slow or not.

As an aside, next time I play with them I'll no longer wave folks behind us through (4 groups last time).  That really doesn't help much when the course is full.  In the future I'm going to initiate that we skip holes when groups behind are waiting.  Maybe that will create enough of an inconvenience that they'll take to heart that they are slow players.  I just hope it doesn't happen when I'm shooting one of my lowest rounds.

[No Mulligans]

@mvmac , mvmac quoted this about playing ready golf:

Quote:

- Walk down the SIDES of the fairway to reach your ball and then APPROACH it from the center. NEVER play in a caravan, moving in a group from ball to ball.

Not sure I understand.  Walk down the sides of the fairway; I like that idea.  But if I do that how would I then; Approach the ball from the center?

[iacas]

Not sure I understand.  Walk down the sides of the fairway; I like that idea.  But if I do that how would I then; Approach the ball from the center?

He just means that if someone is at 170 and in the left center of the fairway you can be 30 yards ahead and 30 yards to the right if you want to be and you're both safe (relatively) and out of the way. So you can go to your ball while others are playing theirs.

[BuckeyeNut]

I would have voted "all of the above" in the poll if the option was given.

[InTheRough]

I would have voted "all of the above" in the poll if the option was given.

my thought exactly. i actually play in a group of slow players and each one of these options applies to one of them so well that it is almost comical.  I like to play fast.  The best round i've ever shot was when i walked 18 in about 2 hours 30 min and i actually had to slow my pace down around hole 12 because i caught up with a group and didnt want to be pushing them.  It drives me absolutely nuts when i play with these guys---which i do about every week since they are close friends-- because has been difficult to get them to understand that we need to go faster.  they do everything mentioned in every slow play thread...hit multiple balls when they didnt like what happened with the first, spend time looking for lost balls, taking WAY too many practice swings on every shot(like 5 or 6 at least...on EVERY shot) and spending time lining up even 2 foot tap-ins.  I'm painfully aware of how slow we go and it actually makes me play poorly because i have trouble getting into a rhythm when the pace is sloe but I've slowly been able to get them to speed up little by little but im not sure if our group will ever get a round done in 4 hours.  End of complaining.

Also i think a 4th option of "no and they dont care" could be thrown in there as well

[flopster]

I think options 1 and 3 kind of lump together since this falls under the entirely once or twice a year player who are out there for the social enviroment only, the second option could be the more regular player who just has a slow routine and is entirely unaware of it. I personally don't consider myself fast but I do know how to move along when I have to, I think 18 holes by myself in 1:45 to be moving along fairly well and a lot of fun to boot.

[bste]

I voted # 3. One playing partner will rent a cart, go with each player to their ball, watch them hit. When it's his turn he'll sit in his cart, look toward the green, get out of the cart drop his cigarette, look at the green, select a club move to his ball, to his credit he doesn't take a practice swing, but he might adjust his ball to a better lie. Love the guy, but come on.

Rant over.

[GoodGuyGreg45]

I voted the second option because I do not think many players have ever been shown how to play efficiently.

Last weekend I played with some guys I have played with before, but they are not my "regular group". We arrived at the tee box at 11:20. As the marshal was getting all of our names on his player's sheet, I noticed there was not another scheduled tee time until 11:50. On hole #6 a twosome pulled up to the tee box as we were hitting our approach shots to the green. On hole #7 said twosome was in the fairway as we were walking off of the green and another twosome I could see was waiting back on the tee. The slowest player in our group makes maybe the funniest remark I've ever heard him make, "Man, this must be one of those places that really stacks 'em back-to-back-to-back. I bet they send a group off every six or seven minutes." Said course, in fact, schedules tee times every 10 minutes. I couldn't help but think to myself that this guy must be delusional if he thinks its anyone else's fault but ours for the back up on the front nine.

[chasm]

my thought exactly. i actually play in a group of slow players and each one of these options applies to one of them so well that it is almost comical.  I like to play fast.  The best round i've ever shot was when i walked 18 in about 2 hours 30 min and i actually had to slow my pace down around hole 12 because i caught up with a group and didnt want to be pushing them.  It drives me absolutely nuts when i play with these guys---which i do about every week since they are close friends-- because has been difficult to get them to understand that we need to go faster.  they do everything mentioned in every slow play thread...hit multiple balls when they didnt like what happened with the first, spend time looking for lost balls, taking WAY too many practice swings on every shot(like 5 or 6 at least...on EVERY shot) and spending time lining up even 2 foot tap-ins.  I'm painfully aware of how slow we go and it actually makes me play poorly because i have trouble getting into a rhythm when the pace is sloe but I've slowly been able to get them to speed up little by little but im not sure if our group will ever get a round done in 4 hours.  End of complaining.

I simply couldn't play with those guys, it would ruin my game. If I had a bunch of friends like that, I'd see them socially off the golf course but tell them I couldn't stand to play golf with them.

[Lihu]

I voted the second option because I do not think many players have ever been shown how to play efficiently. Last weekend I played with some guys I have played with before, but they are not my "regular group". We arrived at the tee box at 11:20. As the marshal was getting all of our names on his player's sheet, I noticed there was not another scheduled tee time until 11:50. On hole #6 a twosome pulled up to the tee box as we were hitting our approach shots to the green. On hole #7 said twosome was in the fairway as we were walking off of the green and another twosome I could see was waiting back on the tee. The slowest player in our group makes maybe the funniest remark I've ever heard him make, "Man, this must be one of those places that really stacks 'em back-to-back-to-back. I bet they send a group off every six or seven minutes." Said course, in fact, schedules tee times every 10 minutes. I couldn't help but think to myself that this guy must be delusional if he thinks its anyone else's fault but ours for the back up on the front nine.

Most people don't think they're slow. I played one hole one golfer who took forever to setup every shot and setup his putts. Although he did barely par the first hole, he took up most of the time for our foursome. Another player and I decided to split off because it looked wide open on another tee box. We finished up 14 holes and were coming back to the clubhouse, and noticed that the group we split from was still on hole 7. 7 holes versus 15? The two of us weren't even moving that fast. :-D That's why I voted some people are completely oblivious to their pace of play.