Joe vs pro

[Gunther]

I think it's going to be a close match. I'm disappointed that you're only doing it for 9 holes. Greg Norman used to play "worst ball" and he'd often shoot in the upper 70s. I think his best score ever was even par or something. Worst ball is TOUGH. The pro is a 3. He's only going to hit 4-5 greens himself (out of nine holes) playing one ball. Drop him down to 3 playing worst ball, maybe 2, and THEN realize he has to take his worst PUTTS, too (not a lot of separation there, but enough playing against someone who takes his BEST putt). FWIW, a guy playing best ball who shoots 90 (a bit better than this guy) is going to shoot about 80 or 81. A guy who shoots 70 (so, better than this 3 handicap pro) is going to shoot 76 or 77[URL=http://widgets.penguin.com/features/everyshotcounts/table-4-2.png].[/URL]

Yep, I'm with you except I'll go further to say that OP will win but it will be close. I used to play with about 4 or 5 different pros in my Sun group, regularly beat 1 or 2 of em and I wasn't any great shakes but might sneak in a 77 or so and clip em by a stroke or two. Teaching pros aren't touring pros. They often don't get a lot of opportunity to play so they'll struggle at times, which to them might be a 78 or 80. Playing his worst ball and he's a 3? Ya, you should win. Good luck!

[vangator]

If you are not getting strokes (which I assume), I think you are in for a tough match. If I were you, I would definitely play my first shot conservative and if it was good, then go for it. You can't afford your best drive being in the trees. I'd recommend the same for him. If he keeps his ball in play, like I said, it could get ugly. Good luck though. Definitely let us know how it turns out. Whatever the outcome, sounds like fun.

[VegasRenegade]

If you are not getting strokes (which I assume), I think you are in for a tough match. If I were you, I would definitely play my first shot conservative and if it was good, then go for it. You can't afford your best drive being in the trees. I'd recommend the same for him. If he keeps his ball in play, like I said, it could get ugly. Good luck though.

Definitely let us know how it turns out. Whatever the outcome, sounds like fun.

I am thinking about using my 4 hybrid of the T for the first shot. That will put be around 190 in the middle.giving up a lot of distance but seldom miss hit this club.

Then I can hit the driver. for my second shot. if I can keep it in play should be out there 240 250, Since the driver is where I struggle.

However the course is pretty open so even a pretty bad slice is OK many times If we play the same Ts course will be at 3300 yards

[dkolo]

I am thinking about using my 4 hybrid of the T for the first shot. That will put be around 190 in the middle.giving up a lot of distance but seldom miss hit this club.

Then I can hit the driver. for my second shot. if I can keep it in play should be out there 240 250, Since the driver is where I struggle.

However the course is pretty open so even a pretty bad slice is OK many times If we play the same Ts course will be at 3300 yards

It's not a terrible idea, but having two cracks at every shot, I'd think you should do it the other way around. Go for it with your first swing and just get it in play with the second if your first goes badly. If your first is good, you can really try to pipe one out there with your second. If you safe first, you give yourself at most one shot at a long drive. Since you mention it's wide open, that favors risk taking even more. You'll have two cracks at a recovery shot from the least bad shot, remember.

[VegasRenegade]

Quote:

Originally Posted by VegasRenegade

I am thinking about using my 4 hybrid of the T for the first shot. That will put be around 190 in the middle.giving up a lot of distance but seldom miss hit this club.

Then I can hit the driver. for my second shot. if I can keep it in play should be out there 240 250, Since the driver is where I struggle.

However the course is pretty open so even a pretty bad slice is OK many times If we play the same Ts course will be at 3300 yards

It's not a terrible idea, but having two cracks at every shot, I'd think you should do it the other way around. Go for it with your first swing and just get it in play with the second if your first goes badly. If your first is good, you can really try to pipe one out there with your second. If you safe first, you give yourself at most one shot at a long drive. Since you mention it's wide open, that favors risk taking even more. You'll have two cracks at a recovery shot from the least bad shot, remember.

Good Idea more strategy please

[rkim291968]

I hope Joe wins!

I played two match plays against much better player last year.  Guess what?   They were nervous about playing against me b/c they can't get it out of their head that they are giving me so many strokes (100% handicap event).    Bet something and make them think about their would be losses .   Good luck!

[Abu3baid]

I hope Joe wins!   I played two match plays against much better player last year.  Guess what?   They were nervous about playing against me b/c they can't get it out of their head that they are giving me so many strokes (100% handicap event).    Bet something and make them think about their would be losses :-) .   Good luck!

Did you win?

[Big C]

Good Idea more strategy please

Since I assume that you will be telling him which shot to play, the main piece of advice I can offer would come on the putting green. You're much better off giving your opponent a shorter/trickier putt as opposed to a long straightforward one. Outside of 10 feet, he is very unlikely to 1 putt anything, so you want to maximize the chances that he 3 putts whenever possible. If I'm looking at a 30 footer straight uphill vs a 12 footer downhill with a delicate left to right break, I'd make him putt the 12 footer and not think twice about it. His worst effort is much likelier to be farther from the hole in the latter scenario than the former.

The only other thing I would keep in mind is that par is a good score, but bogey won't kill you. In other words, if you find yourself in trouble, keep your composure - your opponent is going to make his fair share of bogies also.

[Lihu]

Quote:

Originally Posted by VegasRenegade

"Joe" me is playing my "pro" in a 9 hole match play. My handicap is 20 pro is currently a 3.

The game is I play two best ball including putts. Pro plays two worse ball including putts.

What chance to you give me.  I made the game rules.

I'm guessing that on average the Pro's worst ball is better than the 20's best ball. You'll still have the better shot in some cases, but not enough of them and overall I think you lose.

Best of luck anyway!

Can you make more rules? A 3 handicap is a really good player.

I am hoping that the putting will make the difference. It is pretty hard to make two 5 ft. puts in a row. But I should be able to make one of them. I might also ask for distance though on this course not that big of deal.

He plays the tips at 7200 yards and you get to play the children's tees at 5000 yards. That would definitely even things up between a 20 and a 3.

[iacas]

You're much better off giving your opponent a shorter/trickier putt as opposed to a long straightforward one. ... If I'm looking at a 30 footer straight uphill vs a 12 footer downhill with a delicate left to right break, I'd make him putt the 12 footer and not think twice about it.

That would be the wrong advice. Make him putt the longer ones. If they're similar distance and one is very downhill, fine. Give him the downhill one. I'd have to think about it at 27 versus 30. And still might take the "easy" 30 if the 27 wasn't rudiculous. Longer putts are, the vast majority of the time, more difficult. And that's not really an opinion.

[rkim291968]

Quote:

Originally Posted by rkim291968

I hope Joe wins!

I played two match plays against much better player last year.  Guess what?   They were nervous about playing against me b/c they can't get it out of their head that they are giving me so many strokes (100% handicap event).    Bet something and make them think about their would be losses .   Good luck!

Did you win?

Won one, and lost the next round (quarter final) to a single handicap player (5 ish).   Both scores were 2 & 1, and nail biters.   When match was tight, they kept "complaining" about all the strokes they are giving up to me.   LOL.

[Lihu]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Abu3baid

Quote:

Originally Posted by rkim291968

I hope Joe wins!

I played two match plays against much better player last year.  Guess what?   They were nervous about playing against me b/c they can't get it out of their head that they are giving me so many strokes (100% handicap event).    Bet something and make them think about their would be losses .   Good luck!

Did you win?

Won one, and lost the next round (quarter final) to a single handicap player (5 ish).   Both scores were 2 & 1, and nail biters.   When match was tight, they kept "complaining" about all the strokes they are giving up to me.   LOL.

Okay, so now I get why you went from a 12HC to a >19HC. . .

[iacas]

Okay, so now I get why you went from a 12HC to a >19HC. . .;-)

:offtopic:

[Fourputt]

Quote:

Originally Posted by VegasRenegade

I am thinking about using my 4 hybrid of the T for the first shot. That will put be around 190 in the middle.giving up a lot of distance but seldom miss hit this club.

Then I can hit the driver. for my second shot. if I can keep it in play should be out there 240 250, Since the driver is where I struggle.

However the course is pretty open so even a pretty bad slice is OK many times If we play the same Ts course will be at 3300 yards

It's not a terrible idea, but having two cracks at every shot, I'd think you should do it the other way around. Go for it with your first swing and just get it in play with the second if your first goes badly. If your first is good, you can really try to pipe one out there with your second. If you safe first, you give yourself at most one shot at a long drive. Since you mention it's wide open, that favors risk taking even more. You'll have two cracks at a recovery shot from the least bad shot, remember.

The negative aspect of this philosophy is that you then are putting more pressure on what should be the "safe" shot.

If you play the hybrid first and put in good shape, then pressure is off with the driver and you can swing away without the confidence of knowing that you have a fall back position.  If your first shot with the hybrid is off, you still get a second chance with the easier club, and you already just had a practice shot with that club.

If you play driver first and put it in trouble, now you are in a position where you really need to hit a good one with the hybrid, which you probably haven't swung since the previous tee.  The only advantage I can see with going this way is if you hit the first one with the driver well, then you can really let it all hang out with the next swing.  But you can do that anyway with a good hybrid shot in play.

Different ways of looking at it.

[dkolo]

The negative aspect of this philosophy is that you then are putting more pressure on what should be the "safe" shot.

If you play the hybrid first and put in good shape, then pressure is off with the driver and you can swing away without the confidence of knowing that you have a fall back position.  If your first shot with the hybrid is off, you still get a second chance with the easier club, and you already just had a practice shot with that club.

If you play driver first and put it in trouble, now you are in a position where you really need to hit a good one with the hybrid, which you probably haven't swung since the previous tee.  The only advantage I can see with going this way is if you hit the first one with the driver well, then you can really let it all hang out with the next swing.  But you can do that anyway with a good hybrid shot in play.

Different ways of looking at it.

I don't know, I think it's a matter of percentages. You're choosing the hybrid as a safe option because you're much more confident with it. If you only feel marginally safer with it, then I'd argue you should just take your chances with the driver / a longer club or drop down to whatever you do feel safe with and can still play the hole reasonably. So whatever the safe club is, it should be one you feel you can safely put in play with a high percentage and without too much effort. I don't think your way is without its merits, I just suspect you'll average a better tee shot trying driver first. I would perhaps consider your method if I were sitting on a lead and trying to close out the match being happy taking halves.

The key for me is that even if you have two bad drives, you're more likely to have a spectacular recovery because you can take a chance with at least one ball, so the penalty for a bad tee shot is minimized. Assuming it's at least playable, obviously.

[Golfingdad]

The negative aspect of this philosophy is that you then are putting more pressure on what should be the "safe" shot.

If you play the hybrid first and put in good shape, then pressure is off with the driver and you can swing away without the confidence of knowing that you have a fall back position.  If your first shot with the hybrid is off, you still get a second chance with the easier club, and you already just had a practice shot with that club.

If you play driver first and put it in trouble, now you are in a position where you really need to hit a good one with the hybrid, which you probably haven't swung since the previous tee.  The only advantage I can see with going this way is if you hit the first one with the driver well, then you can really let it all hang out with the next swing.  But you can do that anyway with a good hybrid shot in play.

Different ways of looking at it.

Yeah, if you are going to play one "safe" shot and one "bold" shot, I'm like you and would prefer to hit the safe one first.  But in thinking about it some more, I don't think that is the right strategy - or at least not the one I'd take if it was me.

I would figure out the best strategy to the hole were I playing it normally, and then just do that twice.  If you're playing two identical hands of blackjack and you have 16 against a dealer 7, you're not better off staying on one and hitting on the other.  There is one correct move and you should do it both times.

Of course, if you do it perfectly the first time, then go right ahead and get reckless the second time.  Short par 4 of 290 with a huge hazard in front of the green?  Hit your 5 iron.  But if you put it in position, then there's no upside to repeating that, and there's no downside to trying to bomb one up by the green.  Go nuts!  Par 3's and approaches, if you hit the green with your first, by all means, go flag hunting with the second.

But don't short change yourself ahead of time by hitting a hybrid when the shot calls for a driver.

[NJpatbee]

Sounds like fun, but as an 18 HCP I would not take that bet against a 3 HCP.  The pro is playing several tiers above you and the chance of 2 bad shots in a row are very low.  I can just go by my own skill level, but if I hit a bad drive I am about 50/50 hitting a good drive on my next swing.  And no doubt the 3 handicap's lesser of 2 drives will probably be way past your best of 2.   Same for the rest of the game.  Now, perhaps you know that your pro tends to choke in matches which may give you a chance of winning a couple of holes, but as an 18 myself I know that a 3 HCP's game is on a different planet than mine.   Good luck and let us know how it goes.

[mvmac]

I think the 3 handicap wins but I agree with @iacas that it will be close, especially if it's 9 holes.

That would be the wrong advice. Make him putt the longer ones.

If they're similar distance and one is very downhill, fine. Give him the downhill one.

Yep, take the longer putt regardless of the trickiness.