Paula Creamer wants a Women’s Masters at Augusta [SB Nation]

[saturday]

While watching Swinging Skirts yesterday couldn't help but think the way they present it could be a lot more interesting and upbeat. Listening to Jerry Foltz and Tom Abbott whispering monotone doesn't do much to reel you in. Not a lot of stats presented and I didn't see any Pro Tracer. The PGA doesn't do much better but at least the people calling it are somewhat recognizable.

Listening to Tom Abbott ranks up there with getting kicked in the sack for me. Cannot handle it.

[Golfingdad]

Listening to Tom Abbott ranks up there with getting kicked in the sack for me. Cannot handle it.

LOL ... I don't mind him that much on the LPGA telecasts.  I just can't stand him and his hyperbole on the Big Break shows.  "Oh my goodness - what a huuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuge mistake there by Justin."

And it's mainly the fact that he reacts to them as if they were easily avoidable mental mistakes - as if there is a hint of implication that Justin didn't actually know that hitting your ball over houses onto a different property was a bad idea.  Like he's perplexed as to WHY he would do that. ;)  Dummy, he didn't do it on purpose!

[Lastpick]

I watched the LPGA yesterday.  Only about the last 45 minutes of the broadcast and here is what I came away with.  The average driving distance of the LPGA player is about 250 yards.  This would dictate that at Augusta National, few if any would attempt to reach 13 or 15 in two shots.  The risk/reward would just not pay off against the rest of the field.  IMO this would take most of the excitement of the course design out of play.

[Vinsk]

Well, they'd just move the tees up to where they could. Just not the same for me.

[acerimusdux]

Well, they'd just move the tees up to where they could. Just not the same for me.

Again, no need to move any tees. The member's tees already play shorter than any course the LPGA has played this year.  And at 455 and 475 for 13 and 15, there would be girls going for those greens in two.  But of course they wouldn't want it to be the same. There'd be no point in it if it would be the same. The point of holding a tournament for the LPGA at Augusta would be that it would be different.

[Vinsk]

Average 3w on LPGA is 195yds. Only half a handful of "girls" would be trying that 475yds in two. Watching the awesome display of short game as well as booming drives and cutting corners are part of the excitement for me at the Masters. Neither of those would exist with the LPGA at Augusta.

[acerimusdux]

Average 3w on LPGA is 195yds. Only half a handful of "girls" would be trying that 475yds in two. Watching the awesome display of short game as well as booming drives and cutting corners are part of the excitement for me at the Masters. Neither of those would exist with the LPGA at Augusta.

Well it's less a challenge if they all can do it. Most would be going for it on 13, and the big hitters would be able to go for 15. The 17th at Tiburon was 485 last year and I remember Carlota Ciganda hitting that green in two (and ending up on the back fringe).

It sounds like you just aren't a fan of women's golf, though. I think watching ladies like Carlota Ciganda, Brittany Lincicum,  Mirim Lee, Ariya Jutanugarn, Yani Tseng, Jessica Korda, Gerina Piller, Lexi Thompson etc. go for that in two would be pretty exciting. And then you would probaly have golfers like Lydia Ko,  Stacy Lewis, Inbee Park, Christie Kerr,  Jenny Shin, and Julieta Grenada laying up and still making birdie. I think the variety makes it more exiting.

[Vinsk]

No I am a fan of women's golf in the sense that they are astronomically better than me. I'm quite obsessed with golf in any capacity. However I'm also a big fan of THE MASTERS alone as well. Variety is actually what I see missing from the LPGA though. The field is actually quite shallow in talent and most of the playing consists of slow and easy, short and conservative. Just not my style of interest at Augusta. But I think you've made some good points.

[Perfect Slicer]

Again, no need to move any tees. The member's tees already play shorter than any course the LPGA has played this year.  And at 455 and 475 for 13 and 15, there would be girls going for those greens in two.  But of course they wouldn't want it to be the same. There'd be no point in it if it would be the same. The point of holding a tournament for the LPGA at Augusta would be that it would be different.

No point in the women playing at Augusta if they play from the members tees.

Lets say a miracle happens and they play there. They should play from the professional tees and let the score be what it is. I don't care if the women can't go for 13 and 15 in 2. Zach Johnson won the Masters by laying up on every par 5 for 4 days. Maybe this gives some big hitters a chance to separate themselves. Maybe it shows who manages pressure better, or who manages the course better.

It's been stated on this forum by many respected members that par is just a number. So what if the women are 9 over. The Lowest Score Wins, right? I want to see how they tackle the MASTERS course, not just watch them play from the members tees at a pretty course.

I wouldn't watch to laugh at high scores. I would watch to see how they handle the challenge. Just like any other tourney.

[Vinsk]

I absolutely love this! Splendid post! But that's the conundrum. Even though everybody knows the PGA is simply much more talented...nobody wants to hear that. If you mention that you'll get all kinds of whistle blowers coming out of the woodwork. They would never let the LPGA embarrass themselves on television. I think it would be awesome to see how the ladies do on Augusta as is. Unfortunately, knowing how much better the men really are has to remain in Pandoras Box.

[neophyte]

There will not be a Women's Masters at Augusta.

Reasons

1.  The LPGA will not be able to guarantee the same cash profit for the club.

2.  The LPGA will not allow the world to see a full comparison of the LPGA women's game is that of the PGA players.

3.   I remember when most LPGA players and officials objected to amateur Michelle almost qualifying to play in the Masters.

4.   What do you think would happen if the Masters gave an invitation to the top LPGA player to play along side the Men from the same T in the Masters?

PS:  It is only a matter of time till some woman shows up that can play shoulder to shoulder with the PGA.  Will she play on the PGA or the LPGA?

[Gunther]

No point in the women playing at Augusta if they play from the members tees. Lets say a miracle happens and they play there. They should play from the professional tees and let the score be what it is. I don't care if the women can't go for 13 and 15 in 2. Zach Johnson won the Masters by laying up on every par 5 for 4 days. Maybe this gives some big hitters a chance to separate themselves. Maybe it shows who manages pressure better, or who manages the course better.  It's been stated on this forum by many respected members that par is just a number. So what if the women are 9 over. The Lowest Score Wins, right? I want to see how they tackle the MASTERS course, not just watch them play from the members tees at a pretty course.  I wouldn't watch to laugh at high scores. I would watch to see how they handle the challenge. Just like any other tourney.

I feel just the opposite, I want to see how it plays from there cuz that's where I'd play it from.

[Perfect Slicer]

I feel just the opposite, I want to see how it plays from there cuz that's where I'd play it from.

I don't look at it that way, because no matter who is playing on TV, they are so much better than me that a comparison would just make me want to quit. The kids at pitch, putt, and drive would blow me away. I certainly couldn't play up to the standards of the LPGA.

But that's the same with any course. I wouldn't want to watch the Pro's play from the short tees at Pebble Beach because that's where I'd play from.

I don't want to see the pro's play at anything short of a pro course. I don't want to compare the Pro Women of the LPGA to the CEO of IBM or whoever plays off of the members tees.

[Gunther]

I don't look at it that way, because no matter who is playing on TV, they are so much better than me that a comparison would just make me want to quit. The kids at pitch, putt, and drive would blow me away. I certainly couldn't play up to the standards of the LPGA. But that's the same with any course. I wouldn't want to watch the Pro's play from the short tees at Pebble Beach because that's where I'd play from.  I don't want to see the pro's play at anything short of a pro course. I don't want to compare the Pro Women of the LPGA to the CEO of IBM or whoever plays off of the members tees.

I hear you and the ladies are much, much better than me as well. But, in terms of distance, I'm right there with them, I'd probably be in the top 10 or 20%, so I think it would be interesting to see their club choices, etc. It's really why I watch them now. I learn more from an LPGA event typically, than I do from the PGA.

[Golfingdad]

No point in the women playing at Augusta if they play from the members tees.

Lets say a miracle happens and they play there. They should play from the professional tees and let the score be what it is. I don't care if the women can't go for 13 and 15 in 2. Zach Johnson won the Masters by laying up on every par 5 for 4 days. Maybe this gives some big hitters a chance to separate themselves. Maybe it shows who manages pressure better, or who manages the course better.

It's been stated on this forum by many respected members that par is just a number. So what if the women are 9 over. The Lowest Score Wins, right? I want to see how they tackle the MASTERS course, not just watch them play from the members tees at a pretty course.

I wouldn't watch to laugh at high scores. I would watch to see how they handle the challenge. Just like any other tourney.

But that's not "just like any other tourney."  The women don't play from 7400 yards ... EVER.  They play from 6200-6600 week in and week out.

[Perfect Slicer]

But that's not "just like any other tourney."  The women don't play from 7400 yards ... EVER.  They play from 6200-6600 week in and week out.

Fair point in that context, but I was making a general statement about watching golf in general- to see how they handle the course, not to laugh at the guys who are above par.

I'm not proposing that the women need to play from the longer Men's tees at every tourney. I think ANGC is a special case, built around the Masters setup for tourney play, and I'd like to see how the Women handle it. Just plain old curiosity.

[newtogolf]

The LPGA is like minor league baseball and hockey.  People who don't want to drive to the pro stadiums, deal with all the crowds and costs of a pro event may opt for a nice day out watching their sport of preference but no one confuses it with watching the pro's.  I watch the LPGA when the PGA Tour isn't on.  I'd probably watch the first tournament the LPGA played at Augusta because of the historical significance but wouldn't watch future tournaments there over the PGA Tour.

I'm sure the Web.com tour would like to play there, maybe the Champions Tour too, so let's just takeover AGNC for a month and make everyone happy.

@Dave2512 was dead on, the masses want to see the caliber of golf the PGA Tour plays, they may accept a lower quality product if the timing and price are right but it's typically not the first choice.  IMO women's tennis gained in popularity in the US when the Williams sisters came on scene because they played a game closer to the men and they are American.   The LPGA would struggle in ratings if they had to compete for airtime with the Web.com tour so I don't think the courses are their problem, it's the overall quality of the play.

[turtleback]

PS:  It is only a matter of time till some woman shows up that can play shoulder to shoulder with the PGA.  Will she play on the PGA or the LPGA?

I seriously doubt it.  In what sport involving significant physical effort have you found that to be the case?

Fair point in that context, but I was making a general statement about watching golf in general- to see how they handle the course, not to laugh at the guys who are above par.

I'm not proposing that the women need to play from the longer Men's tees at every tourney. I think ANGC is a special case, built around the Masters setup for tourney play, and I'd like to see how the Women handle it. Just plain old curiosity.

While I think the whole idea of Paula's is silly, if they DID do something along those lines I do not think either existing set of tees should be used.  I'd much rather have them use the tees that were used at the Masters in, say, 1950 or 1960.  I'd guess they would be somewhere in the 6800 yard vicinity (I might be off there).  The members tees seem too short and the current tournament tees would be absurd.  So I would go back in history and use tees that have historical significance in that they once were the tournament tees, but are more in line with the ladies' current length.  Of course in some cases prior redesigns could make some of the old tournament tees unplayable, but they can just move them a little in those cases.

But I still oppose the whole notion.