Paula Creamer wants a Women’s Masters at Augusta [SB Nation]

[Vinsk]

It's by definition not a free market if all parties don't have the same opportunities to use the resources available (ANGC won't let them hold the tournament there). Also, the men's game has had an institutional head start of about 50+ years. What the hell kind of answer is that? That would be like responding to an question about how to get more women into the sciences by saying they could make more money being models. That's not the problem we're trying to solve.

Yeah I agree with you there Dokolo. I think a possible problem would be what I mentioned in my earlier post. I like watching LPGA tournaments. But I was a bit irked to watch them grossly shorten the tees and soak the greens at the US OPEN last year. Augusta is a cherished venue to me and I just wouldn't care to see the course played with drastic manipulations. Furthermore, if the course wasn't manipulated other than shorter tees, I don't think too many would be interested watching the leader at +3. Just my opinion on the subject.

[dkolo]

So ANGC has to open itself to anyone who wants to use its' resources for it to be fair? That doesn't make any sense.

That's not what I said. They don't have to, but the lack of opportunity on the women's side to use that venue and the utility they'd get from it means it's not actually a level playing field, i.e., a truly free market, as was suggested in the post I was responding to.

Yeah I agree with you there Dokolo. I think a possible problem would be what I mentioned in my earlier post. I like watching LPGA tournaments. But I was a bit irked to watch them grossly shorten the tees and soak the greens at the US OPEN last year. Augusta is a cherished venue to me and I just wouldn't care to see the course played with drastic manipulations.

Furthermore, if the course wasn't manipulated other than shorter tees, I don't think too many would be interested watching the leader at +3. Just my opinion on the subject.

I really enjoyed watching the women's US Open at Pinehurst last year specifically because of the juxtaposition of the women's tournament with the men's one there the week before. That was really interesting for me. Replace Pinehurst with ANGC, and I think that's compelling television. To me, anyway.

[skydog]

What the hell kind of answer is that? That would be like responding to an question about how to get more women into the sciences by saying they could make more money being models.

No. Professional golfers are in the entertainment business- they get paid by people to entertain them. For various reasons, people don't find the LPGA entertaining...my suggestion related on how to improve that entertainment value while still letting the ladies do something they enjoy (play golf).

It's by definition not a free market if all parties don't have the same opportunities to use the resources available (ANGC won't let them hold the tournament there).

No. It woud, by definition, not be the free market if everyone had access to the same resources. Resources have to be earned (bought/paid for based on supply and demand), not given in the free market. Providing all parties equal access to resources would be more akin to socialism or at best, corporatism.

[iacas]

But they can't actually. It'd be cool if Augusta helped to legitimize the women's game, in much the way they're legitimizing the youth game. I get that there's logistical challenges and it's a pain in the ass for ANGC and its members. But let's try to figure something out. Get a 5 year rota of courses and have one be ANGC and the other 4 be various other well-known courses. They'll matter by association much the way all the Open courses matter more because they're hanging with St. Andrew's. Or hold the women's Masters every 2 years like the Ryder Cup. Whatever. Try to find a solution.

I agree it would be cool, but asking them to host the "Women's Masters" or something is going too far. It's asking too much.

So no thank you.

[dkolo]

No. Professional golfers are in the entertainment business- they get paid by people to entertain them. For various reasons, people don't find the LPGA entertaining...my suggestion related on how to improve that entertainment value while still letting the ladies do something they enjoy (play golf).

Your suggestion was demeaning. Moreover, your premise that people find the LPGA less entertaining is also reliant on institutional obstacles that the women's game has had for growth. When women weren't allowed to play the game in many places for many years and there isn't the same infrastructure available to them to get them into the game, it's misleading to say that the women's game isn't entertaining. Maybe it isn't, but it hasn't had the same chances to become entertaining. What I'm suggesting is that Golf (to the extent that it's an institution) try to give the women's game an opportunity to grow.

No. It woud, by definition, not be the free market if everyone had access to the same resources. Resources have to be earned (bought/paid for based on supply and demand), not given in the free market. Providing all parties equal access to resources would be more akin to socialism or at best, corporatism.

It's an artificial barrier to entry because there's been no suggestion that ANGC would be willing to entertain the idea if the women's game brought more to the table. While ANGC is perfectly within its prerogative to decline, I think it's somewhat hypocritical of them in light of what they say they're trying to do to grow the game.

I agree it would be cool, but asking them to host the "Women's Masters" or something is going too far. It's asking too much.

So no thank you.

Eh. I think forcing them to host it would be going too far. Asking seems reasonable. ANGC seems to value having a role as one of the stewards of the game globally, and I commend them for doing a tremendous amount of good. I just think they should add the women's game to their focus.

[DrvFrShow]

No thanks.

It's the free market...if Wie and Creamer want to play golf in their lingerie then I'm sure they'll get the revenue and ratings they crave. That's about the only way you're going to get  most guys (including this one) to ever watch the LPGA.

Agreed. I love Augusta as much as anyone but I would have no interest in watching this. All it would do is dilute the aura of the course and the Masters for me.

You gotta be kidding me. And here I thought this kind of thinking went out in the 1970s. No. Don't give me examples. Please.

[iacas]

Originally Posted by dkolo

What I'm suggesting is that Golf (to the extent that it's an institution) try to give the women's game an opportunity to grow.

The women's game has had and will continue to have the opportunity to grow.

It's an entirely different thing to say that Augusta National should take up the cause even more than they're doing already .

While ANGC is perfectly within its prerogative to decline, I think it's somewhat hypocritical of them in light of what they say they're trying to do to grow the game.

I disagree; they are growing the game. Do you not think so?

Eh. I think forcing them to host it would be going too far. Asking seems reasonable. ANGC seems to value having a role as one of the stewards of the game globally, and I commend them for doing a tremendous amount of good. I just think they should add the women's game to their focus.

I'd bet quite a bit that it's not gonna happen. Nor should it, nor should they feel bad about that.

[jbishop15]

I think they should have a Women's Masters. It's good for the game, and it'd be entertaining. I don't see any downside.

No. Professional golfers are in the entertainment business- they get paid by people to entertain them. For various reasons, people don't find the LPGA entertaining...my suggestion related on how to improve that entertainment value while still letting the ladies do something they enjoy (play golf).

No. It woud, by definition, not be the free market if everyone had access to the same resources. Resources have to be earned (bought/paid for based on supply and demand), not given in the free market. Providing all parties equal access to resources would be more akin to socialism or at best, corporatism.

The free market works best when all parties are able to participate; that's what drives the improvement of product instead of using things like marketing to get ahead. If all parties are on the same footing, only the thing they are presenting will stand out, instead of other crap that doesn't have anything to do with it. So, let the public actually decide, instead of allowing PR teams to control what actually gets bought and sold.

[dkolo]

The women's game has had and will continue to have the opportunity to grow.

It's an entirely different thing to say that Augusta National should take up the cause even more than they're doing already.

I disagree; they are growing the game. Do you not think so?

I'd bet quite a bit that it's not gonna happen. Nor should it, nor should they feel bad about that.

They are growing the game, no question. They're doing a lot for the youth game and internationally in Latin America and Asia. If they're doing much for the women's game, though, I honestly haven't heard about it. In light of the fact that they only recently added female members, putting more emphasis towards women's golf would seem to be a logical progression for them.

[Vinsk]

Well if this were to happen...when could they do it? The club is open Ocfober-May. All the preparations for the Masters would prevent the event happening prior to the men's. The grounds take a beating from the Masters so further "repairs" are needed...crowd trampling grass..etc. Closing the club for two more weeks for a possible low revenue? So....October is about the only time...and...that's baseball playoffs and football....good luck. I don't see it happening.

[iacas]

In light of the fact that they only recently added female members, putting more emphasis towards women's golf would seem to be a logical progression for them.

I think it's unreasonable to ask them to do it.

[jbishop15]

Well if this were to happen...when could they do it? The club is open Ocfober-May. All the preparations for the Masters would prevent the event happening prior to the men's. The grounds take a beating from the Masters so further "repairs" are needed...crowd trampling grass..etc.

Closing the club for two more weeks for a possible low revenue?

So....October is about the only time...and...that's baseball playoffs and football....good luck. I don't see it happening.

They could do it in May; with the amount of money and infrastructure they have, it wouldn't be that hard to get the course ready a month later. They could do it, if they wanted to, I think.

[Phil McGleno]

They could do it in May; with the amount of money and infrastructure they have, it wouldn't be that hard to get the course ready a month later. They could do it, if they wanted to, I think.

They have no reason to want to!-It would just minimize the Masters.

[jbishop15]

They have no reason to want to!-It would just minimize the Masters.

Yeah, I guess. Loss of mystique because you see it twice. I get it. But I think overall, it'd be beneficial. I think it's worth maybe losing some of the mystique of the place so that the women's game can get a boost.

[dkolo]

They have no reason to want to!-It would just minimize the Masters.

I think putting the two tournaments back to back would actually increase the stature of the Masters as the biggest showcase of golf to the world. Drive / Chip / Putt Championship, The Masters, and the Women's Masters (The Mistresses?) back to back to back would be incredible. But the problem is that I think that puts the biggest burden on the membership of the club logistically. That's where I'm trying to catch myself to be mindful that it's their course and I'm not them.

Which is kind of why I kind of go back to my idea of doing the women's event on a less-than-annual basis, at least with respect to how often it were held at ANGC. Maybe off cycle with the Olympics? I'm spitballing. I'd love for something like this to happen in some form or another.

[acerimusdux]

Well if this were to happen...when could they do it? The club is open Ocfober-May. All the preparations for the Masters would prevent the event happening prior to the men's. The grounds take a beating from the Masters so further "repairs" are needed...crowd trampling grass..etc.

Closing the club for two more weeks for a possible low revenue?

So....October is about the only time...and...that's baseball playoffs and football....good luck. I don't see it happening.

I think November would be perfect. There would still be 5 months then to get the course ready for the Masters, it wouldn't interfere in any way.

[Scotsclaff]

Careful guys....some mighty free speech liberties you're taking.....

Haha.

If one tells the truth one's a liberty taker.Hilarious.

[newtogolf]

Payne provides a very logical and honest answer as to why they won't host another tournament.  The LPGA needs to find another course (maybe an exclusive Trump course) that they can make their Augusta and call their "Masters" if they deem that critical to their future growth.

Quote:

"We have a very short member season at Augusta National, it’s seven months only," Payne said during his annual state-of-Augusta press conference. "The time that we dedicate to the preparation and conduct of the tournament is already extensive. I don’t think that we would ever host another tournament here."

Whan, who has not been shy about making the same request Creamer tweeted about, recognizes the issues involved with staging another mega-event on the iconic course that closes from late May through early October. He also believes that continued talking about his vision of realizing such a dream may not be the best way to attain it.

"I don’t know how you become a member of Augusta but I’m pretty sure you don't become a member by telling people you want to become a member. I’m not exactly sure how you get a women’s event at Augusta, but probably continuing to talk about it may not be my stronger strategy," Whan told SB Nation earlier this year.

My home course hosted a US Open qualifier last summer and while we were honored to be selected a number of the members were not happy that the course was not available to them.