Are there too many rules in golf?

[disco111]

Through the years, the rule book in golf has become increasingly stout. Where you almost needs a law degree to interpret the party of the first part in correlation to the plaintiff and the aforementioned party of the second part and so on and so forth. Now looking back at the USGA rules committees, one can see were the legalize came from. Now from my perspective, a rule should be black and white, not open to interpretation or debate. In my opinion, just one or two simple rules are needed. 1) Play it as it lies. 2) Don't touch the ball until it's holed. Seems very simplistic and that's most likely the way folks played in the beginning. Anyone ever tried playing under this aspect? if not, give it a try and see what happens. Could be interesting.

[saevel25]

Through the years, the rule book in golf has become increasingly stout. Where you almost needs a law degree to interpret the party of the first part in correlation to the plaintiff and the aforementioned party of the second part and so on and so forth. Now looking back at the USGA rules committees, one can see were the legalize came from. Now from my perspective, a rule should be black and white, not open to interpretation or debate. In my opinion, just one or two simple rules are needed. 1) Play it as it lies. 2) Don't touch the ball until it's holed. Seems very simplistic and that's most likely the way folks played in the beginning. Anyone ever tried playing under this aspect? if not, give it a try and see what happens. Could be interesting.

They are pretty much black and white. There really is no debate in the rules. People just make a big stink about some situations because they think they get the short end of the stick.

[jlbos83]

That sounds nice, but...

You pretty much have to have a rule to cover OB, one to cover hazards, something to deal with unplayable lies, etc.  Almost all of the rules are there to deal with exceptions, it's just that in the real world exceptions happen a lot!

My conclusion is that there are not too many rules, and that they are constructed to support the principal of playing the course as you find it.

[jlbos83]

They are pretty much black and white. There really is no debate in the rules. People just make a big stink about some situations because they think they get the short end of the stick.

Which is a little silly, since there are an awful lot of cases where the rules can help the player!

[dkolo]

Through the years, the rule book in golf has become increasingly stout. Where you almost needs a law degree to interpret the party of the first part in correlation to the plaintiff and the aforementioned party of the second part and so on and so forth. Now looking back at the USGA rules committees, one can see were the legalize came from. Now from my perspective, a rule should be black and white, not open to interpretation or debate. In my opinion, just one or two simple rules are needed. 1) Play it as it lies. 2) Don't touch the ball until it's holed. Seems very simplistic and that's most likely the way folks played in the beginning. Anyone ever tried playing under this aspect? if not, give it a try and see what happens. Could be interesting.

I mean, we've had this exact thread / discussion a few times, but it's really not that simple. You've just eliminated all options for hazards, you have no idea whether you can move objects, you have no recourse if a hamster steals you ball, if it falls down a rabbit hole, etc. The rules aren't that simple, but they aren't that complicated and, for the most part, they're as simple as they can be to cover the unbelievable variety of situations that can come up on a course

[isukgolf]

I use to think so ... but I am changing my thoughts as I learn more about the game ... (still think there should be a recreational set of rules; however, but that is not the topic at hand) With that said I will get a bag of popcorn and sit back and read the different views ...

[Missouri Swede]

Your tee shot goes into the water hazard on your first tee shot.  Is the hole over for you?

I'm not trying to be snarky (okay, maybe a little).  But even in this common scenario, there's got to be some way to continue play.

What you state, of course, comes right from the Principles Behind the Rules of Golf.  Principle 1: Play the course as you find it.  Principle 2: Put your ball in play at the start of the hole, play only your ball, and do not touch it until you lift it from the hole.  From there, all the rules are derived.

It'll be interesting to see the discussion...

[DaveP043]

Maybe we should go back to the original 13 rules, legendarily set down in 1744:

Articles & Laws in Playing at Golf.

1. You must Tee your Ball within a Club's length of the Hole.

2. Your Tee must be upon the Ground.

3. You are not to change the Ball which you Strike off the Tee.

4. You are not to remove Stones, Bones or any Break Club, for the sake of playing your Ball, Except upon the fair Green and that only / within a Club's length of your Ball.

5. If your Ball comes among watter, or any wattery filth, you are at liberty to take out your Ball & bringing it behind the hazard and Teeing it, you may play it with any Club and allow your Adversary a Stroke for so getting out your Ball.

6. If your Balls be found any where touching one another, You are to lift the first Ball, till you play the last.

7. At Holling, you are to play your Ball honestly for the Hole, and not to play upon your Adversary's Ball, not lying in your way to the Hole.

8. If you should lose your Ball, by it's being taken up, or any other way, you are to go back to the Spot, where you struck last, & drop another Ball, And allow your adversary a Stroke for the misfortune.

9. No man at Holling his Ball, is to be allowed, to mark his way to the Hole with his Club, or anything else.

10. If a Ball be stopp'd by any Person, Horse, Dog or anything else, The Ball so stop'd must be play'd where it lyes.

11. If you draw your Club in Order to Strike, & proceed so far in the Stroke as to be e Accounted a Stroke.

12. He whose Ball lyes farthest from the Hole is obliged to play first.

13. Neither Trench, Ditch or Dyke, made for the preservation of the Links, nor the Scholar's Holes, or the Soldier's Lines, Shall be accounted a Hazard; But the Ball is to be taken out teed /and play'd with any Iron Club.

[MrDC]

Too many rules? maybe, probably... too many uptight rules that need to be relaxed? absolutely, just watching what happened to Tiger in 2013 was all I needed to see to think so.

[DaveP043]

Too many rules? maybe, probably... too many uptight rules that need to be relaxed? absolutely, just watching what happened to Tiger in 2013 was all I needed to see to think so.

I'm assuming you're talking about the shot off the flagstick into the water at the Masters, and the ensuing debacle.  The problem was, as I remember it, that Tiger didn't quite understand the rule that required him to drop as close as possible to the spot he played his shot from.  He wanted a slightly longer yardage (by just a yard or two), and said so in an interview.  If he hadn't been trying to gain an advantage, i.e. a more preferable yardage, I doubt anyone would have had a big problem with it.  I'm sure that some would argue that he turned in a wrong score by not including the penalty, and should have been DQed, but considering that the Committee had already reviewed his drop and hadn't seen anything wrong, I think the end result was fair.

This situation was, in my opinion, not caused by having too many rules, or rules that are too complex.  It was instead caused by the player not knowing one of the very basic rules, or mixing up two of the options available for a ball in a water hazard.  This is also why we see so many players asking for a rules official on what seem to be simple questions.

[David in FL]

Through the years, the rule book in golf has become increasingly stout. Where you almost needs a law degree to interpret the party of the first part in correlation to the plaintiff and the aforementioned party of the second part and so on and so forth. Now looking back at the USGA rules committees, one can see were the legalize came from. Now from my perspective, a rule should be black and white, not open to interpretation or debate. In my opinion, just one or two simple rules are needed. 1) Play it as it lies. 2) Don't touch the ball until it's holed. Seems very simplistic and that's most likely the way folks played in the beginning. Anyone ever tried playing under this aspect? if not, give it a try and see what happens. Could be interesting.

As has been said, this is a question/complaint that comes up quite a bit. Several years ago, @iacas put forth a challenge to those that think that the rules could/should be shortened, to give it their best shot. [CONTENTEMBED=/t/47141/rules-of-golf-in-one-page-maybe-two-project layout=block][/CONTENTEMBED] There were no takers as I recall. The principles are fairly short and simple. The rules that are necessarily to actually implement those principles are, due to the complex nature of the environment in which the game is played, somewhat longer and more laborious. If you can shorten the rules, without changing the nature of the game itself, I'd love to see your efforts. I'm sure others would too! :beer:

[Fourputt]

Through the years, the rule book in golf has become increasingly stout. Where you almost needs a law degree to interpret the party of the first part in correlation to the plaintiff and the aforementioned party of the second part and so on and so forth. Now looking back at the USGA rules committees, one can see were the legalize came from. Now from my perspective, a rule should be black and white, not open to interpretation or debate. In my opinion, just one or two simple rules are needed. 1) Play it as it lies. 2) Don't touch the ball until it's holed. Seems very simplistic and that's most likely the way folks played in the beginning. Anyone ever tried playing under this aspect? if not, give it a try and see what happens. Could be interesting.

Then what do you do when it is not possible to play the ball as it lies?  What do you do when the ball is lost?  Out of bounds? In a water hazard?  How do you treat those situations fairly in a stroke competition with 100 players in the field if there is no set procedure?

Your rules will work just fine in a match, because it only involves your side and your opponent's side.  Any decision you make only affects your match.  You simply cannot do that in a stroke play compeition.  You can't have a situation where a player in one group solves the problem one way, while a player in another group does it differently.  Because of the sheer variety of condtions faced in golf, there have to be rules to cover all of those conditions in a way that is both fair and equitable.  28 general rules just isn't that big a deal to cover the miriad of issues that a golfer can encounter.

[jlbos83]

If one is looking to simplify, the first obvious target is to make water hazards stroke and distance, just like OB.  No to differentiate red/yellow, no figuring out where to drop.  Probably not a popular idea!  Why not include unplayable in there, as well, it's simpler!

One possible good idea I have heard is making all violations worth the same number of strokes, one I think, so you don't have to remember when it is one versus two.

[rkim291968]

Rules can't be all black or white.  If they are, we wouldn't have lawyers, and judges ... and golf officials.

[David in FL]

If one is looking to simplify, the first obvious target is to make water hazards stroke and distance, just like OB. No to differentiate red/yellow, no figuring out where to drop.  Probably not a popular idea!  Why not include unplayable in there, as well, it's simpler! One possible good idea I have heard is making all violations worth the same number of strokes, one I think, so you don't have to remember when it is one versus two .

One of the basic tenets of the rules is that there should be a progression in penalty based on the relative seriousness of the infraction. Your recommendations discard that simple principle.

[Fourputt]

If one is looking to simplify, the first obvious target is to make water hazards stroke and distance, just like OB.  No to differentiate red/yellow, no figuring out where to drop.  Probably not a popular idea!  Why not include unplayable in there, as well, it's simpler!

One possible good idea I have heard is making all violations worth the same number of strokes, one I think, so you don't have to remember when it is one versus two.

The penalty heirarchy is graduated as it is in order to counteract any potential advantage that might be gained from the infraction.  The greater the potential advantage, the more severe is the penalty.  Without that there would be occasions where it might actually be more advantageous to deliberately play for a penalty rather than follow the principles of the game.  For example, a bad lie in 8 inch deep fescue.  Play it as it lies and risk leaving it in just as bad a lie for the next shot, or kick it 8 feet into shorter grass (heck, under your rules you could even pick it up and toss it to the fairway), take a one stroke penalty and have a normal shot to the green.  As it now stands that would be at least a 2 stroke penalty, and if the advantage gained is deemed significant by the committee, maybe a DQ.  There has to be some accountability to prevent such acts.

[rkim291968]

This thread reminds me of the following from Amadeus movie.


EMPEROR: Well, I mean occasionally it seems to have, how shall one say? [he stops in difficulty; turning to Orsini-Rosenberg] How shall one say, Director?
ORSINI-ROSENBERG : Too many notes, Your Majesty?
EMPEROR: Exactly. Very well put. Too many notes.
MOZART: I don't understand. There are just as many notes, Majesty, as are required. Neither more nor less.
EMPEROR: My dear fellow, there are in fact only so many notes the ear can hear in the course of an evening. I think I'm right in saying that, aren't I, Court Composer?
SALIERI: Yes! yes! er, on the whole, yes, Majesty.
MOZART: But this is absurd!
EMPEROR: My dear, young man, don't take it too hard. Your work is ingenious. It's quality work. And there are simply too many notes, that's all. Cut a few and it will be perfect.
MOZART: Which few did you have in mind, Majesty?
EMPEROR: Well. There it is.

[disco111]

http://www.usga.org/rules/rules-and-decisions.html#!rule-01

To date, there are 32 rules listed in a book that is 180 pages plus and many of those rules are further broken down into subsections. Now to me, that's over kill. But lets not forget, that the ruling bodies (USGA / R&A;) have meetings, to discuss existing rules or to add new rules and/or possible subsections. As Dave PO43 offered. there were originally 13 rules, that seemed to cover what needed to be covered and was simplistic (1 page), compared to what we have now. When folks have to have a discussion or debate on a ruling, because one of the sub-sections may be causing a complete understanding of what and why, then it's not as black and white as some think.