Paper Books or eBooks? From the Publisher and Reader Perspective

[turtleback]

The graphics were one concern. Amazon or Apple taking a cut was another concern.

I know absolutely nothing about the economics of publishing, neither e-publishing nor paper.  So I am curious as to how the cut taken by amazon compares to the cut taken by the company that physically prints the book.

I also find it easier to "read myself to sleep" with hard copy books. Anytime after 10pm, I'll usually be knocked out cold within 20 minutes of reading a hard copy books. But if I bring a tablet into bed, I can easily spend an hour or more before I shut it off. I've, e- or paper. been told the light that emits off a screen has something to do with that, but I'm not entirely sure.

That is interesting, I have not noticed that myself, and I've read before going to sleep almost every night of my night.  I wonder if there would be a difference between,e.g., an ipad which is backlit, and a non-fire kindle, which is e-ink.

[isukgolf]

I prefer paper books by a landslide, but I will admit that my reasoning is a bit quirky. Ever since my son was born, I've been conscious of trying to minimize my screen time when around him. Whether that's on a phone, ipad or computer, the last thing I want is for him to grow up seeing daddy with his face buried in screen of some sort. Reading is reading, regardless of the medium, but I'd rather him get used to seeing his parents reading hard copy books. I also find it easier to "read myself to sleep" with hard copy books. Anytime after 10pm, I'll usually be knocked out cold within 20 minutes of reading a hard copy books. But if I bring a tablet into bed, I can easily spend an hour or more before I shut it off. I've been told the light that emits off a screen has something to do with that, but I'm not entirely sure.

I put my on the "night setting" and before I know it, the iPad is falling out my hands because I fell asleep ... My issue with paper books and reading in bed, which is were I do 90% of my book reading, was a a light source bright enough to read the print ... ebooks solved that for me. Actually at night, in a dark room, if I read with a white background I will get a headache eventually.

[iacas]

I know absolutely nothing about the economics of publishing, neither e-publishing nor paper.  So I am curious as to how the cut taken by amazon compares to the cut taken by the company that physically prints the book.

It's not just that - it's that they, for the pricing levels and types of things we wanted to do - get to SET your prices, too.

Apple doesn't. Which is why that lawsuit was ****ing ridiculous, the whole thing. But that's still 30% and I don't know that we could sell the book for $29.95 on an eBook version.

Because, in addition to people who say they want the book in electronic version for convenience… a lot of people just want to pay $9.99 or something for an eBook. The information in LSW is worth what we charge for it (or more), so we didn't really want to be splitting 70% of less than ten bucks.

[Braivo]

It's not just that - it's that they, for the pricing levels and types of things we wanted to do - get to SET your prices, too.

Apple doesn't. Which is why that lawsuit was ****ing ridiculous, the whole thing. But that's still 30% and I don't know that we could sell the book for $29.95 on an eBook version.

Because, in addition to people who say they want the book in electronic version for convenience… a lot of people just want to pay $9.99 or something for an eBook.  The information in LSW is worth what we charge for it (or more), so we didn't really want to be splitting 70% of less than ten bucks.

File this under "Posts not to take personally." I am venturing into self-publishing my own books and am carefully weighing the marketing options available to me. My tone here is one of learning from someone who has seemingly bucked the trend in self-publishing by going to complete opposite direction: no Amazon, no ebook, high sales price.

With all due respect to you and LSW (I gladly purchased it for $29.95 and have realized a big return on my investment), I have purchased many $9.99 ebooks that have provided similar or greater value to my life. Sure, you may feel the value of your book is far greater than $9.99, I am sure most authors feel the same way.

Most put years of hard work into their passion, I am sure $9.99 seems like an insult to most independent authors. I don't disagree with the assessment of the value of LSW, but simple economics will say it is only worth what people will pay for it, and very few people will pay more than $9.99 for an ebook, or any book for that matter, as sales of hardback books have cratered.

Also, after extensive research I see no indication that Amazon will take away my ability to set the price of my ebook as I see fit.

If you think you'll sell 1,000 books no matter what, then by all means charge $29.95 and keep most of your $30,000. But what if you'll sell 1,000 books at $29.95 in paperback or 10,000 books at $9.99 by going digital and posting to Amazon's massive audience. You could be leaving $40,000 on the table by not going digital / Amazon. So splitting 70% of ten bucks x a much larger number still nets you a larger payout for your work, even if you feel you are selling it below what it's worth. Plus, then you've reached 9,000 more people who may become familiar with your other offerings such as websites, seminars, etc.

For a book like LSW, with a loyal reader base ready to buy up copies, there might be an exception and it may sell relatively the same number of copies either way, in which case a high sales price is wise. You seem to have made the correct, well-informed decision.

The economics of independent publishing are fascinating to me and I am learning as much as I can as fast I can, and things still keep changing.

[turtleback]

Quote:

Originally Posted by turtleback

I know absolutely nothing about the economics of publishing, neither e-publishing nor paper.  So I am curious as to how the cut taken by amazon compares to the cut taken by the company that physically prints the book.

It's not just that - it's that they, for the pricing levels and types of things we wanted to do - get to SET your prices, too.

Apple doesn't. Which is why that lawsuit was ****ing ridiculous, the whole thing. But that's still 30% and I don't know that we could sell the book for $29.95 on an eBook version.

Because, in addition to people who say they want the book in electronic version for convenience… a lot of people just want to pay $9.99 or something for an eBook.  The information in LSW is worth what we charge for it (or more), so we didn't really want to be splitting 70% of less than ten bucks.

I appreciate the answer, which makes perfect sense to me.  It certainly seems like a hard case to make that it would make any sense for you to e-publish.  There ARE some e-books that go for more than $9.99 but I know that is also a huge resistance point for a lot of buyers.

And for the record, I do not doubt in the slightest that the book is worth (at the very least) every penny of the $29.95.

[iacas]

My tone here is one of learning from someone who has seemingly bucked the trend in self-publishing by going to complete opposite direction: no Amazon, no ebook, high sales price.

We have bucked some trends, you're right. But we felt we knew our market, and I think it was the right decision for us.

Also, remember - at some point Medicus gets to sell the book, so we didn't want to make any decisions for them, either. For all we know they'll publish an eBook version.

With all due respect to you and LSW (I gladly purchased it for $29.95 and have realized a big return on my investment), I have purchased many $9.99 ebooks that have provided similar or greater value to my life. Sure, you may feel the value of your book is far greater than $9.99, I am sure most authors feel the same way.

You're entitled to that opinion, naturally.

But at $9.99 this would be a steal. This is golf - little training aids sell for $49.95. Golf instruction itself is a costly thing, and the information in the book is well worth the price of admission. So that's the market.

A book on disc golf, a notoriously "cheap" sport? Good luck selling many copies for $4.99. A book that appeals to fine wine collectors? You might be able to charge $299.

It's not the "value" of the book to us. It's what we think is simply a fair price, given the market. I've sold things all my life… The value of something is what someone will pay for it, and if enough someones will pay for it at a price that the math works out, cool. If not, adjust or don't bother making the thing.

Most put years of hard work into their passion, I am sure $9.99 seems like an insult to most independent authors. I don't disagree with the assessment of the value of LSW, but simple economics will say it is only worth what people will pay for it, and very few people will pay more than $9.99 for an ebook, or any book for that matter, as sales of hardback books have cratered.

I agree, but we've sold thousands and thousands of copies - with no ad budget outside of posting on Twitter at @LowScoreWins - and we feel we priced it properly. High enough to get decent revenue, low enough to make it a no-brainer for a lot of people. That was the goal. As I said, we're in golf - $29.95 is still relatively inexpensive. People have spent ten times that on training aids they've used one time…

You could put thirty years into a book that's not worth $1 to more than about twenty people, or thirty hours into something that's worth $99 to a lot of people.

Also, after extensive research I see no indication that Amazon will take away my ability to set the price of my ebook as I see fit.

I wasn't talking about eBooks. I was talking about physical books sold with or without Amazon Prime, Amazon shipping for us, etc.

If you think you'll sell 1,000 books no matter what, then by all means charge $29.95 and keep most of your $30,000. But what if you'll sell 1,000 books at $29.95 in paperback or 10,000 books at $9.99 by going digital and posting to Amazon's massive audience. You could be leaving $40,000 on the table by not going digital / Amazon. So splitting 70% of ten bucks x a much larger number still nets you a larger payout for your work, even if you feel you are selling it below what it's worth. Plus, then you've reached 9,000 more people who may become familiar with your other offerings such as websites, seminars, etc.

Your numbers (the actual math, that is) are fine of course, but they don't match our projections. Not only did we sell almost 1,000 of the books on PRE-ORDER when we had our Indiegogo campaign (before we'd even written the book), but we've since sold more than the other numbers in your post, and at the higher price. We've had pro shops buy hundreds of copies at the bulk prices on our site, which are still 50% more or so than $9.99.

I've studied this kind of stuff a fair amount, and at the end of the day it's just a sort of supply and demand curve.

To make up some round numbers, let's say we make $20 on the physical books and $7 on the eBooks. Simple math here: we'd need to sell about 3x as many eBooks to make the same amount of money. We don't see that as happening. We don't see 65% of likely customers saying "I'd pay $9.99, but $29.95 is way too much."

If your target market is 1000 people, 10 of them might pay $99.95, 100 of them might pay $49.95, and 900 of them will pay $9.99 (100 might pay $1.99, and 10 might not buy it at any price). The trick is figuring out what the middle 800 people would pay.

We think we chose a good price. We know how many copies of golf books will sell - even best-sellers. And we've sold a lot of books…

Besides, again:

• Converting the graphics would be a pain. There's a time cost there, and a user experience cost too.
• We didn't want to sell the book in eBook format; that's Medicus's decision.
• I wanted to make a physical product.

Please don't ignore that we had other, non-$ reasons for going the route we went.

---

That reminds me of another issue: that of having two versions available at the same time. Let's say someone comes to the site and is interested in buying LSW. They see two options: $9.99 on Kindle/iBooks or $29.95 for a paperback. Which one are people going to buy? The problem with offering two versions is that you're cannibalizing your own market. People who were willing to pay $29.95 will opt to pay less because it's available to them. In other words… if we did make an eBook version that "competed" with our physical books, we'd probably have to price the eBook at about $25 (profit is $17.50) just to come close… and unless we sold 15% more books (which at $25 versus $30 is not too likely), we'd actually lose a bit on that proposition.

ALSO… sometimes there are customers you don't really care to have. I don't care about bargain basement hunters. Those guys can buy a used copy from someone if they want. They can try to glean what they can from this forum, or tweets we make, or whatever. They still see us as "good/smart guys" who "wrote a book." If someone's not willing to pay $30 for a book that some have called the best golf book ever written, they're not going to spend money on "our other offerings." They're not going to travel and take a clinic. They're not going to sign up for evolvr. They're cheap. They're not desirable customers. Appealing with cheap pricing to a "broad" audience has resulted in the downfall of many. Appeal to cheap customers and what do you end up with? Cheap customers.

Now, yes, that's a generalization… but look around and you'll find plenty of examples of companies who went out of business chasing the low end and plenty of successful companies that avoid the low end.

For a book like LSW, with a loyal reader base ready to buy up copies, there might be an exception and it may sell relatively the same number of copies either way, in which case a high sales price is wise. You seem to have made the correct, well-informed decision.

That's it in a nutshell.

If you're going to go with the "either-or" model, you need to sell 3x as many copies at $9.99 (ignoring whether you want to make a digital book at all) as you will at $29.95. We didn't feel that was even remotely possible.

If you're going to go with the "both options" model, you're really probably just cannibalizing yourself.

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If your book isn't in the golf market, then it's completely different. If it's going to cover something with mass appeal and a lot of cheap people, then yeah, 10k * $7 > 1k * $30. Maybe the math works for you.

We didn't feel it was anywhere close to that for us.

Heck, you're talking to two guys who sell (and do fairly well) software for analyzing video for nearly $400… in a day and age when you can buy fully featured games on your iPad for $4.99. Supply and demand. It's a curve, and you maximize profits when you price your products where the curves meet.

[newtogolf]

I think it was a great strategy and follows the paradigm described in "Crossing the Chasm".  Limit distribution and sell to early adopters at a high but fair price.  As the book gets older and you've saturated the early adopters then identify other forms of distribution (in your case Medicus) to reach the masses.  This worked for you because you and Dave and known in the industry and have platforms to market it from.

As for pricing, I've bought books that have cost more and less than LSW, people who golf typically have more disposable income than average so you probably could have charged more but $29.95 was a price that made it a no brainer, especially for those here on the site and that know you and Dave.

The average self publisher is better off going the ebook route because they can get the book out to masses of people that the author typically wouldn't have access to on their own.  A friend of mine published an e-book (on getting out of debt) and was very disappointed with the sales numbers.  Unless the book you are writing is in a small niche or you're relatively well known in the field it can get lost amongst all the rest in the category.

[Braivo]

We have bucked some trends, you're right. But we felt we knew our market, and I think it was the right decision for us.

Also, remember - at some point Medicus gets to sell the book, so we didn't want to make any decisions for them, either. For all we know they'll publish an eBook version.

First of all, if you haven't already, you should consider writing an ebook titled "How We Self-Published and Sold 10,000+ Copies of Our First Book." That type of ebook would have mass appeal at the $6-$10 range. Very few people have done what you've done, and you've done it unconventionally, which means your book wouldn't just be noise in a crowded market. You already have the outline for such a book with this post here alone. This information is gold to thousands and thousands of people like myself looking to self-publish their work. I'm not kidding around, you have an incredible opportunity here to market your success story.

Or, hell, sell a paperback for $30 with the same title, it may just work...

Secondly, thank you for this thorough and insightful post. My series of books that I am writing is not golf related and is 100% text driven without charts or graphs. However, it is in a niche market of psychology that people typically pay thousands of dollars to counselors for help. This may give me a marketing opportunity for a higher price point, something I hadn't considered before your post. I consider it a premium product.

That being said, my faithful audience is fairly small at the moment, so initial sales would probably be 100 books or so. I would need to move up in Amazon's algorithms to really get substantial sales and make my books a good business proposition. I may need to go the "traditional" route of relying on my loyal readers to buy and post reviews, hence pushing me up the charts and leading to more sales.

ALSO… sometimes there are customers you don't really care to have. I don't care about bargain basement hunters. Those guys can buy a used copy from someone if they want. They can try to glean what they can from this forum, or tweets we make, or whatever. They still see us as "good/smart guys" who "wrote a book." If someone's not willing to pay $30 for a book that some have called the best golf book ever written, they're not going to spend money on "our other offerings." They're not going to travel and take a clinic. They're not going to sign up for evolvr. They're cheap. They're not desirable customers. Appealing with cheap pricing to a "broad" audience has resulted in the downfall of many. Appeal to cheap customers and what do you end up with? Cheap customers.

I think this is an underrated point you make here. With self-publishing things are steering more and more toward small niches versus large, mass market targets. You have to be willing to let go of big chunks of your audience and focus on those that will drive your business. They say an author only needs a thousand loyal readers to sustain a career, I believe that is true. These thousand loyal readers will pay good money for your work and suggest it to their friends and family. I could soften my message a bit and appeal to a wider audience, but I would lose my most faithful readers.

Originally Posted by newtogolf

The average self publisher is better off going the ebook route because they can get the book out to masses of people that the author typically wouldn't have access to on their own.  A friend of mine published an e-book (on getting out of debt) and was very disappointed with the sales numbers.  Unless the book you are writing is in a small niche or you're relatively well known in the field it can get lost amongst all the rest in the category.

This, exactly. I almost went a similar route, publishing my work for mass appeal, crossing my fingers hoping Amazon's algorithms would be favorable. I have instead switched my focus to building a loyal audience via my blog and my numbers are growing daily. Once I cross a certain threshold I should be able to sell my book and convert 10% or more of my readers into sales immediately, if not more if they are a truly loyal group.

Originally Posted by iacas

If you're going to go with the "either-or" model, you need to sell 3x as many copies at $9.99 (ignoring whether you want to make a digital book at all) as you will at $29.95. We didn't feel that was even remotely possible.

As your book has been described as possibly the best golf book ever written (I agree with this), the closest comparison I can find is to what I consider the best weightlifting book ever written. This weightlifting book has changed my physical health as much as your book has changed my golf game. The value cannot be understated. Of course I don't know the sales numbers for this particular book, but everyone I encounter in the gym has purchased the physical copy for more than double the price of the ebook version. I have the hunch that offering an ebook version has done little (positively or negatively) to impact the sales of the print version. This is a book that you want in print. You want it with you in the gym, you want to look at the graphs and pictures, you want to share it with your buddies. I think yours is exactly the same. Starting Strength has stood the test of time and sells considerably well many years after its initial release. I hope the same is true for LSW.

If anything I bet he gets a few sales at $9.99 from people that would not have bought it at $20 either way, that's about it. Offering the ebook is unnecessary in this case, I can't imagine a book so reliant on images and graphs being any good in digital format. You are offering a subpar product at this point.

[iacas]

First of all, if you haven't already, you should consider writing an ebook titled "How We Self-Published and Sold 10,000+ Copies of Our First Book."

It's not our area of expertise, nor do we have any time or interest in doing so. I know you were mostly kidding, but… I'm not. :)

This may give me a marketing opportunity for a higher price point, something I hadn't considered before your post. I consider it a premium product.

There's a reason people pay thousands of dollars to see some people speak, and won't pay that crazy person on the street $1 to hear him speak about the coming of the end of days (or whatever).

Things are worth what people will pay for them. One of the tricks to doing something well is not leaving money on the table that's there for the taking.

That being said, my faithful audience is fairly small at the moment, so initial sales would probably be 100 books or so. I would need to move up in Amazon's algorithms to really get substantial sales and make my books a good business proposition. I may need to go the "traditional" route of relying on my loyal readers to buy and post reviews, hence pushing me up the charts and leading to more sales.

You could incentivize people who buy your book to provide word-of-mouth style advertising. If you're not planning to have a Twitter account or a little blog (perhaps with some protected content, ahem), you might consider it.

I think yours is exactly the same. Starting Strength has stood the test of time and sells considerably well many years after its initial release. I hope the same is true for LSW.

We'll see. Note that it is a "third edition." LSW is in its first edition.

We haven't found much to update, yet, either. Though it's just been barely a year, so…

Good luck.

[turtleback]

Wow, great exchange, @iacas and @Braivo .  Thanks, I learned a lot.

One little factoid you might be interested in.  I use a used book site called abebooks which taps into the inventory of hundreds (thousands?) of used bookstores throughout the US and internationally.  As of 2 minutes ago there were precisely 0 used copies of LSW available among their inventories.  Must be a keeper.