Chipping by numbers

**ZappyAd** · February 19, 2016

I was thinking about how to improve my distance control when chipping with my sand wedge from around the green and I was wondering if anyone uses or advocates a power gauge / clock face approach similar to how Dave Pelz approaches pitching? Or do you just use 'feel' to get to the right distance?

By power gauge I mean having a range of distances for the back swing starting off with a small take away (e.g. '1') and progressively increasing in steps (2,3,4 etc) up to a maximum number, say 5. If you can repeat the takeaway each time for a given number then presumably the distance the chip will travel should also be similar, assuming you can be consistent with your stroke acceleration etc. I think I remember watching a video of Faldo chipping from the side of the green and he talked about thinking of a power number for shots but I can't remember if he actually knew distances for each number or if it was more of a feel thing - e.g. 'this looks to be about a 5'

Does anyone use this method for chips and if so do you map out the distances for each swing? Like for a power 2 sand wedge it goes 16' ? I can get a nice trajectory with only a little roll with my sand wedge but I struggle with distance so I was wondering if practicing this sort of method might help me lock down my distance control a bit more precisely. As I move down clubs to get a more rolling chip (say 8i 6i) I feel like I am more in putting territory and I seem to be able to judge those a bit more accurately. This is just for those times when you have to carry most of the distance to the pin and so a chip with a sand wedge and neutral hands is what is required.

**boogielicious** · February 19, 2016

44 minutes ago, ZappyAd said:

I was thinking about how to improve my distance control when chipping with my sand wedge from around the green and I was wondering if anyone uses or advocates a power gauge / clock face approach similar to how Dave Pelz approaches pitching? Or do you just use 'feel' to get to the right distance?

By power gauge I mean having a range of distances for the back swing starting off with a small take away (e.g. '1') and progressively increasing in steps (2,3,4 etc) up to a maximum number, say 5. If you can repeat the takeaway each time for a given number then presumably the distance the chip will travel should also be similar, assuming you can be consistent with your stroke acceleration etc. I think I remember watching a video of Faldo chipping from the side of the green and he talked about thinking of a power number for shots but I can't remember if he actually knew distances for each number or if it was more of a feel thing - e.g. 'this looks to be about a 5'

Does anyone use this method for chips and if so do you map out the distances for each swing? Like for a power 2 sand wedge it goes 16' ? I can get a nice trajectory with only a little roll with my sand wedge but I struggle with distance so I was wondering if practicing this sort of method might help me lock down my distance control a bit more precisely. As I move down clubs to get a more rolling chip (say 8i 6i) I feel like I am more in putting territory and I seem to be able to judge those a bit more accurately. This is just for those times when you have to carry most of the distance to the pin and so a chip with a sand wedge and neutral hands is what is required.

I am pretty analytical and used something like this in the past. But it became very complicated and I would overthink the shot. I changed to a different approach that Stan Utley describes in his The Art of the Short Game.

When you are shooting a basketball, you don't think about how much power you're adding your arms or how far back to take your hands. Same with tossing a ball. You only think about the target.

With pitching and chipping, I use the same approach. Utley prescribes picking a target about the size of a basketball hoop and try to land the ball in that area. The location of the target area is chosen depending on the slope of the green to the hole, the trajectory of your chip/pitch, etc.

I read the green like I do with putting. Then I pick my landing spot and chip/pitch to that spot. I only think about target and not the hole. When you practice, practice hitting to a spot on the green and watch how the ball rolls out after. You may chose to use only one club for all shots, like Utley, or a few different clubs. When I first get to a practice green, I pitch/chip to a ladder of landing areas; 5, 10, 15 feet, etc.to get my technique down.

I then play a green side game called "one ball". I toss the ball off the green and then chip/pitch to a hole and try to get up and down. You pick a different location and hole each time. Sometimes I just rotate around the practice green (around the world) to give myself uphill, side hill and downhill approaches. Each time, I think about the landing spot and chip to that spot.

This approach is less mechanical and way more fun to practice.

**Ernest Jones** · February 19, 2016

15 minutes ago, boogielicious said:

I am pretty analytical and used something like this in the past. But it became very complicated and I would overthink the shot. I changed to a different approach that Stan Utley describes in his The Art of the Short Game.

When you are shooting a basketball, you don't think about how much power you're adding your arms or how far back to take your hands. Same with tossing a ball. You only think about the target.

With pitching and chipping, I use the same approach. Utley prescribes picking a target about the size of a basketball hoop and try to land the ball in that area. The location of the target area is chosen depending on the slope of the green to the hole, the trajectory of your chip/pitch, etc.

I read the green like I do with putting. Then I pick my landing spot and chip/pitch to that spot. I only think about target and not the hole. When you practice, practice hitting to a spot on the green and watch how the ball rolls out after. You may chose to use only one club for all shots, like Utley, or a few different clubs. When I first get to a practice green, I pitch/chip to a ladder of landing areas; 5, 10, 15 feet, etc.to get my technique down.

I then play a green side game called "one ball". I toss the ball off the green and then chip/pitch to a hole and try to get up and down. You pick a different location and hole each time. Sometimes I just rotate around the practice green (around the world) to give myself uphill, side hill and downhill approaches. Each time, I think about the landing spot and chip to that spot.

This approach is less mechanical and way more fun to practice.

What Boogie said.

Pitching is all visualization and feel for me. Chipping is as well, but when chipping I'll use a variety of clubs depending on the fly-to-roll ratio I need. To calculate this I use the Rule of 12. To use the Rule, you subtract the club number from 12 to get your approximate ratio. Example: chipping with a PW (10 iron) will give you approximately 2 feet of roll for every foot of carry. 12-10 (iron) = 2. For a 7 iron, it would be 12-7=5, so the ratio would be 5 feet of roll for every foot of carry. Experiment with your clubs to fine tune this as newer clubs with less loft will skew the rule a bit and your chipping stroke may also yield different results depending on your AoA and other factors, but once you figure out your matrix, it should be fairly constant. You also need to take into account the slope of the green and how that will affect the roll.

For the most part, I prefer to pitch it close and expect a foot or two of rollout (on a flattish landing spot), but sometimes a chip is the better play. When chipping, read the green from the landing spot onwards just as you would a putt, play the break and let the green's contour guide the ball home.

**saevel25** · February 19, 2016

I typically do not chip the ball. I pitch it. For me chipping I just feel it out more than having a specific distance and backswing length because it tends to be a much shorter shot. It would be difficult to break up that short of distance in the backswing length compared to something like pitching which could be anywhere from waist high to 3/4 swing length.

**9wood** · February 19, 2016

On chip shots I pick a spot on the green I want my ball to land and determine which club I need to use. If I have very little green to work with or if there is a down hill steep slope to deal with then I will use a club that produces higher lofts. If there is a more level green and the pin is a good distance away then I will use a club with less loft, usually a seven iron in order to allow my ball to roll up to the hole

**vangator** · February 19, 2016

I think the suggestions above are right on.

Definitely a feel thing for the length of my backswing. I generally chip with a 9i. I land the ball about 1/3 the way to the hole and let it roll. One big thing I suggest is to not try to nip the ball off the turf. That leads to adding unpredictable spin to the ball. I find it also very easy to over power the shot. I do a smooth swing, not too far back and pick the ball off the turf. I don't try to open the blade and introduce bounce unless I have to. If you do, it becomes a much more unpredictable shot. On longer chips, I'll drop down to an 8i. Swinging harder introduces the possibility of more spin. I'll take a more lofted club if I need to clear the fringe to land on the green. I very seldom attempt to fly the ball near the hole on a chip. Pitches yes. I let chips roll.

Edited February 19, 2016 by vangator

**DrvFrShow** · February 23, 2016

Things got real complicated real quick. I'm very right brained. The analytical approach doesn't work. I'm a feel player. I use my 55 degree wedge and judge the spot I want the ball to land based upon the slope and speed of the green, usually on a flat green about half-way between my ball position and the hole if the shot is under 20 yds. There may be other considerations and I may choose to chip with my 8 iron. Or I may loft it tighter with my 64. If I'm in the rough with a good lie on the edge of the fringe I'll putt. It depends upon how things feel that day.

300drive · February 23, 2016

I find that the harder I try at the short game, the more can go wrong. As long as you practice enough and have the shot in your wheelhouse, don't overthink. Just Do!

**vangator** · February 23, 2016

3 hours ago, DrvFrShow said:

Things got real complicated real quick. I'm very right brained. The analytical approach doesn't work. I'm a feel player. I use my 55 degree wedge and judge the spot I want the ball to land based upon the slope and speed of the green, usually on a flat green about half-way between my ball position and the hole if the shot is under 20 yds. There may be other considerations and I may choose to chip with my 8 iron. Or I may loft it tighter with my 64. If I'm in the rough with a good lie on the edge of the fringe I'll putt. It depends upon how things feel that day.

I'd recommend against a 55* wedge. Puts too much spin on the ball. That's why I use a 9 iron whenever possible. I only use higher lofted clubs when I need to clear the fringe and land the ball on the green. I think you'll have more consistency. Th euse of the 8 iron sounds good for longer chips. Just my 2 cents.

**9wood** · February 23, 2016

I highly recommend that you go into a putting stance with the ball in close to your feet to chip. You may have to choke down on your club grip to do this but this will allow your greater ball control and accuracy, then determine how much backswing you need to apply, depending on distance you desire the ball to land. One last thing - make your follow through to be equal to your backswing. If you backswing to the eight o'clock position then let your follow through be to the four o'clock position. An easy smooth stroke without any wrist action works nicely.

Edited February 23, 2016 by 9wood

**ppine** · February 23, 2016

I have been reading Pelz and Utley lately trying to improve the really short game.

Pelz makes the point about using 4 wedges with 3 swings for 12 different predictable distances.

Many people have too much backswing for short shots and decelerate the club on the downswing which does not work well under pressure.

You can use Pelz to get the right motion for your shot length. Utley has great technique for the really short feely shots around the green from say less than 20-30 yards.

**ZappyAd** · February 23, 2016

On 19/02/2016 at 0:50 PM, Ernest Jones said:

To calculate this I use the Rule of 12

I've seen something similar in a book by Scott Mahlberg - you figure out which is your 50:50 club (i.e. it travels 50% in the air and then 50% on the ground) and then every club longer changes the ratio by 10%. So if PW is 50:50 then 9I is 60:40, 8I is 70:30 etc you just pick your landing spot, figure out the ratio of roll to flight and then just aim for the landing spot with the appropriate club.

9 hours ago, vangator said:

Th euse of the 8 iron sounds good for longer chips. Just my 2 cents.

36 minutes ago, 9wood said:

I highly recommend that you go into a putting stance with the ball in close to your feet to chip.

I use these tips already for along the ground 8i shots and it seems to work quite consistently.

The problem shot for me is when I am sub 20 yds and have to fly the ball most of the way to the pin. The lies around our greens at the moment are quite patchy with mud so I have had a few 20 yd shots that I need to get up and over something from a tight or uneven lie and it has been a real struggle getting the distance dialed in correctly.

**DaveP043** · February 23, 2016

4 minutes ago, ZappyAd said:

I've seen something similar in a book by Scott Mahlberg - you figure out which is your 50:50 club (i.e. it travels 50% in the air and then 50% on the ground) and then every club longer changes the ratio by 10%. So if PW is 50:50 then 9I is 60:40, 8I is 70:30 etc you just pick your landing spot, figure out the ratio of roll to flight and then just aim for the landing spot with the appropriate club.

Oy, I don't go to the golf course to get my my mental math exercises in!

I'll admit, I'm a feel player. Based on my experience, I try to visualize a shot, through the air and rolling out, that fits the challenges I'm looking at. This starts as I'm walking up to the green, so that generally I have a plan by the time I get to my ball. That plan will lead me to select my club and visualize the exact intended landing area. Then my practice swings, taken one after the other pretty quickly, until I have a couple that feel just right to get the ball to the landing spot. I then address the ball, focus on the landing spot, no thinking, no delays, and try to repeat my last practice swing.

To be honest, what I'm doing is not much different from many of the more analytical methods. I just do the analytics through experience and visualization, rather than doing the math.

**ev780** · February 23, 2016

This is timely for me.

I used the 12 system for a long time but a few years ago switched to a two club feel system. 58* for the lob/finese/touchy shots and my sand iron 54* (12 club) to pitch and run the 50:50 thing. I switched in an attempt to unclutter and just get good at two different shots. Turns out there are more factors to consider than just math and it may be MORE cluttered with many different swings. {shrug} Also gets old either carrying 4 clubs up to the green (90% cart golf) or running back to the cart because you misjudged the club/shot combination from the cart parking area. (Yeah I know walking solves that but not the topic here.)

I think I was better around the greens with the Rule 12 method and I am considering going back to it. Sometimes simple is not what it seems. Anybody gone back and forth?

**vangator** · February 23, 2016

3 hours ago, ZappyAd said:

I've seen something similar in a book by Scott Mahlberg - you figure out which is your 50:50 club (i.e. it travels 50% in the air and then 50% on the ground) and then every club longer changes the ratio by 10%. So if PW is 50:50 then 9I is 60:40, 8I is 70:30 etc you just pick your landing spot, figure out the ratio of roll to flight and then just aim for the landing spot with the appropriate club.

I use these tips already for along the ground 8i shots and it seems to work quite consistently.

The problem shot for me is when I am sub 20 yds and have to fly the ball most of the way to the pin. The lies around our greens at the moment are quite patchy with mud so I have had a few 20 yd shots that I need to get up and over something from a tight or uneven lie and it has been a real struggle getting the distance dialed in correctly.

If I need to fly the ball halfway to the hole, I use a SW or LW if the distance is not too far. If the distance is farther requiring a firmer blow, I have to plan on more spin and will fly it more to the hole. You'll have to practice to get a feel for what the ball will do.

When I had wedges with deeper grooves. I could fly the ball just short of the hole with a hop and stop. Newer wedges will roll more.

If you play firmer / non urethane balls, the ball will roll no matter what. Less spin.

**Ernest Jones** · February 23, 2016

Just a general comment here, while I do choose a landing spot, I mostly do that to get an idea of how the ball will react once on the surface. When making the stroke, all my focus is on the target, which may be the hole or an alternate aimpoint, but I'm never aiming for the landing spot.

**DrvFrShow** · February 24, 2016

But chipping to a tight pin? Out comes the 64.

**vangator** · February 24, 2016

32 minutes ago, DrvFrShow said:

But chipping to a tight pin? Out comes the 64.

I go for my 68.

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