"Line of Putt, Jordan."

[saevel25]

Just now, Buckeyebowman said:

OK, I'm going to vent! I've had enough. After reading a thread like this, is it any wonder that people are leaving golf in droves? And it's not just golf. With all the nit picky new rules, I find that watching an NFL contest comes closer to watching a legal proceeding rather than watching a sporting event, or "game"! It's becoming boring! I realize that governments around the world have been bent and distorted to benefit lawyers, but it distresses me to see games go the same way.

Totally unwarranted. Golf has always been a game of integrity based around self governance under a simple set of rules. 

Mostly my discussion has been on the interpretation of the rules and in this case it's application for Jordan. Golf isn't like football where an offensive lineman is out of the play so they don't call a holding call. Golf is an individual sport in which all golfers play by the same rules and must be penalized equally. For how much we like Jordan he doesn't get a free pass if he broke this rule. 

 

[turtleback]

On 4/11/2016 at 0:38 AM, JLeeWildcat9 said:

The proximity in which he entered the line was so early, and he was in no hurry to get off of it. A golfer was disqualified from a U.S. Open for wiping dew off in front of his ball, during a resume play situation. So I know the rules are extreme and they test your character. That's one of the vital reasons Golf is the greatest on Earth. It has been worth a good board discussion.

Actually he was not DQed.  In fact, that he was NOT DQed was one of the precedents for Tiger not getting DQed over the drop at augusta a few years back.  The player you are thinking of was not DQed but he was assessed a 2 stroke penalty - which caused him to miss the cut, NOT be DQed.  I know it is a very small difference but if you are going to get persnickety to the point of ridiculousness with the rules then I think holding you to a standard of accuracy is appropriate.  It was the 2001 US Open and the player was Lee Janzen, a 2 time champion.  Who, ironically, was DQed from a US Open qualifier years later for wearing metal spikes.

 

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/sports/golf/usopen01/2001-06-16-janzen2.htm

[JLeeWildcat9]

I was just making a general point on penalties and how "ridiculous" some rules can be, but that is also one of the reasons I love golf. Calm down with your character assassination attempt. I just was recalling the L.J. situation and I knew it was pretty extreme, didn't go look up that they reversed the dq to a 2 stroke penalty, which if he weren't a 2 time champion, do you think he would have gotten the same luxury? Oh wait that luxury was missing the cut. So....you're an idiot.

[DeadMan]

13 hours ago, Buckeyebowman said:

OK, I'm going to vent! I've had enough. After reading a thread like this, is it any wonder that people are leaving golf in droves? And it's not just golf. With all the nit picky new rules, I find that watching an NFL contest comes closer to watching a legal proceeding rather than watching a sporting event, or "game"! It's becoming boring! I realize that governments around the world have been bent and distorted to benefit lawyers, but it distresses me to see games go the same way.

No one cares if you are playing by yourself and not playing by the rules. No need for the hysterics. I don't think this was ever brought up on the telecast. I haven't seen any media talk about this. So, you've wandered into a thread about a rule and are now complaining about the rules of golf.

In my view, not stepping on the line of your putt is a obvious extension of playing the ball as it lies, which is the heart of the rules of golf. I am flabbergasted by people saying this is a ridiculous rule.

Seriously, if we're not playing for money, play golf however you want. Just don't damage the course or slow me down. Nobody is making you play by the strict rules.

[JLeeWildcat9]

I'm going to vent now (make sure I announce that everyone, so you know how important I am haha!) - Any "Golfers" on here who think the integrity of a golfer's putting line at Augusta National is no big deal, is a complete donkey. 

[turtleback]

23 minutes ago, JLeeWildcat9 said:

I was just making a general point on penalties and how "ridiculous" some rules can be, but that is also one of the reasons I love golf. Calm down with your character assassination attempt. I just was recalling the L.J. situation and I knew it was pretty extreme, didn't go look up that they reversed the dq to a 2 stroke penalty, which if he weren't a 2 time champion, do you think he would have gotten the same luxury? Oh wait that luxury was missing the cut. So....you're an idiot.

Really?  You object to my "character assassination" of you because you were flat out wrong about what you said, and now I am an idiot because I was exactly correct about what I said.  AND in the process attack the integrity of the USGA Rules officials who apparently, according to you, allowed a player's former performance affect a ruling.

Of course you completely missed the point.  

2 minutes ago, JLeeWildcat9 said:

I'm going to vent now (make sure I announce that everyone, so you know how important I am haha!) - Any "Golfers" on here who think the integrity of a golfer's putting line at Augusta National is no big deal, is a complete donkey. 

You have a great future here.

[boogielicious]

OK all, let's take it down a notch please.

[Joe from MD]

Didn't take long for the haters to get on Spieth after what happened at the Masters. 

[colin007]

All I'm gonna say is that Speef stepped on his line AWFULLY quickly from the get-go, like he almost had to change his direction to ensure that he'd step on  it.

[JLeeWildcat9]

Turtleback, this post is about Jordan Spieth walking all over his line, and on top of that, he was on the clock. I'm sure it affected Rory. Oh and yes, I'm in Sergio's court on the opinion that certain players get "lead way" and "rules bent" based on who they are. That mud is on the USGA, and I don't agree with them all the time. Moving on, do you have anything else to say about Jordan and the "smothering" of his putting line on the 18th green on Saturday, after his 6 hour round was about to conclude?!

 

[pumaAttack]

Its pretty clear he walked in his line to get a better read.

[JLeeWildcat9]

Watch everyone. This guy will come back with some b.s. like..."Actually his round was 4 hours and 48 minutes." and give me some stupid link that has the exact time haha!!

[Golfingdad]

44 minutes ago, pumaAttack said:

Its pretty clear he walked in his line to get a better read.

Wouldn't you think that would be illogical considering the risk of putting spike marks in your own line?  I'm failing to see the advantage gained by walking in your own line intentionally.  It just doesn't add up.

"Yay, I have a slightly better idea which way it'll curve when I get up there, (which I could have never figured out by standing close to my line and leaning over a bit. /s).  The only problem is that now I don't know which way it'll bounce off the marks I just made with my feet."

[JLeeWildcat9]

If they are going to let him blatantly cheat, on Saturday at The Masters, for ratings so the good ole' boy from Texas wins, at least get him to speed up his pace of play. If I was Rory I would have yelled across at him to pick up the pace. If I took that much time, over every shot, I could go to my club and put up a 67-68 on the card. I'm sure many of you could shave 5-6 shots off each round if you took 75 seconds to upwards of 3 minutes to study every shot. 

[BallStriker]

1 hour ago, Golfingdad said:

 I'm failing to see the advantage gained by walking in your own line intentionally.  It just doesn't add up.

Not an invalid point from a practical perspective....however, a breach of the Rules of Golf is not necessarily conditioned on the gaining of an advantage

 

[No Mulligans]

There are several rules I disagree with, including this stepping on the line of putt rule, but that seems off topic to this thread.

Did he break a rule by stepping on the line of his putt?  I think he did.  If he breaks a rule should he be penalized?  I think he should (even though I don't like that particular rule).  

(FWIW, I'm a Spieth fan and that is irrelevant to this thread and to my opinion.  Just saying so someone doesn't troll by calling me a Spieth hater).

[JLeeWildcat9]

Reading the slope, degree, for starters...

[Golfingdad]

36 minutes ago, BallStriker said:

Not an invalid point from a practical perspective....however, a breach of the Rules of Golf is not necessarily conditioned on the gaining of an advantage

Right, and as I look back at the decision quoted previously, that's true about this one as well.  The decision states that for it to be a violation he would have had to do it intentionally OR he would have had improved his line.

Quote

16-1a/12 - Player Walks on Line of Putt

Q.A player walked on his line of putt. Did he incur a penalty for a breach of Rule 16-1a?

A.Yes, if he did so intentionally. No, if he did so accidentally and the act did not improve the line.

Can we all agree that stepping on your own line in a pair of shoes that look like this:

at Augusta National (or probably just about anywhere) is not going to improve you line?  And if we can agree on that, couldn't we also agree that Jordan would agree?  Which would bring me back to the original question - why would he step on his line on purpose?  (Answer, I don't believe he ever would)

Or, let's look at it another way.  Let's say, hypothetically, that this rule doesn't exist at all.  You are allowed to step in your own line BUT you are also wearing those same shoes (no Eccos or Trues allowed for this experiment).  Would you do it?  I sure as heck wouldn't.  If I wanted to cheat and repair a spike mark, there are much easier ways to do it.  Just pull out a tee and repair it like its a ball mark, and tamp it down with the bottom of your flat putter.  Nobody would even bat an eye or question him - those guys do that all of the time. Not saying they necessarily repair spike marks all of the time, but they frequently will repair 2, 3, 4 or more "pitch" marks that are in their line before a make-able putt.  FCs NEVER question each other over whether the marks in question actually pitch marks or not.

I'm just following the logic here.  I say there is no way that stepping on your line with spiked shoes could improve it, and I think that every golfer on the planet including Jordan Spieth knows that, and therefore, there's no way that he did that intentionally.  And since I think everybody would reasonably agree that it certainly wouldn't improve his line, that leads me to the conclusion that the answer to the question in 16-1a/12 in this case is "no."