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Can someone please explain to me the cult-like following that Mike Austin has ? Sure, the guy was a big hitter (some of that probably exaggerated) but never won a PGA or other professional tournament that I can find ? And maybe he did hit a 515-yard drive downwind on rock hard fairways. 

What is the attraction with his mechanics ? 

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Sorry, no. Like many things in golf… people are always seeking the "secret" or the quick and easy way to solve things. They latch onto things. They get persuaded into thinking "I've finally found

You make a fair point about how an instructor doesn't have to have won a PGA Tour event to be a good instructor. It is not a prerequisite. The trouble everyone has, is folks claiming to have a secret.

I have no stake in this debate and admittedly know less about the golf swing than most of the members here, but you make a comment that you're going to debate this in a "civil way" and immediately res

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9 minutes ago, War Eagle said:

Can someone please explain to me the cult-like following that Mike Austin has?

What is the attraction with his mechanics ? 

Sorry, no.

Like many things in golf… people are always seeking the "secret" or the quick and easy way to solve things. They latch onto things. They get persuaded into thinking "I've finally found it!" Some get stuck in that phase longer than others.

Whether it's Ben Hogan followers, Mike Austinites, etc. there are pockets of these people all over golf.

I, obviously, prefer 5 Simple Keys®. No "secrets," and it encompasses all the things EVERY good player actually DID, not what one player thinks they did, or others say they did.

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Mike Austin was like a circus sideshow guy-a carnival barker! No reason to listen to much that guy had to say imo.  

Edited by Jack Watson
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About 9 mos ago I bought and have been using Mike Austin's lessons ($20).  Of all the teachers I've had or studied in the last 40 years his techniques are the most effective.  In the last 4 years I've gone from a handicap of 6 to not being able to break 90. Now I'm shooting low to mid 80s most of the time. 70s are next.

I'm old and have physical problems but drive an average 265 yards.  I had to recalculate all of my clubs because I'm  hitting so much further and my accuracy has greatly improved.  All of this with no pain during or after the round and I play 3 to 5 times a week.  

What Austin teaches is the classic golf swing that is not taught today.  Look at the past greats (Byron Nelson for one) and compare their swing with today's greats with the exception of Dustin Johnson.  They're all on Youtube.  Johnson's swing is the closest to Austin's and if you'll notice, Dustin is the longest and most accurate on tour.  I believe he's #1 as well.  Might there be something to this?

Look at Rory McIlroy's swing.  Nearly as long as Dustin's but, Rory is already having back problems due to the modern swing, Dustin isn't.  Tiger has just undergone spinal fusion. Another victim of the modern swing.  

Before offering an opinion please do some research. You might learn something that will help make you a better golfer longer.

Edited by MRugroden
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19 minutes ago, MRugroden said:

What Austin teaches is the classic golf swing that is not taught today.  

What do you mean, specifically?

What are the differences between DJ and Rory's swings? 

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38 minutes ago, MRugroden said:

What Austin teaches is the classic golf swing that is not taught today.  Look at the past greats (Byron Nelson for one) and compare their swing with today's greats with the exception of Dustin Johnson.  They're all on Youtube.  Johnson's swing is the closest to Austin's and if you'll notice, Dustin is the longest and most accurate on tour.  I believe he's #1 as well.  Might there be something to this?

How? In what ways?

It seems to me someone could easily say Dustin is a great example of the modern golf swing given that he's a very modern athlete and works out and uses his Trackman religiously and so on.

Mike Austin never even won a PGA Tour event. Co-opting a good player and saying "they use our swing" is such a marketing gag.

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51 minutes ago, MRugroden said:

Johnson's swing is the closest to Austin's and if you'll notice, Dustin is the longest and most accurate on tour.  I believe he's #1 as well.  Might there be something to this?

I'm fairly certain DJ's swing is nothing like Mike Austin's other than the obvious commonalities in all good swings. Mike Austin's swing methodology is all about release and throwing the clubhead, DJ's hand action is about the complete opposite.

Mike Austin had the gift of speed, but his swing was fairly conventional. His secret IMO is how he managed to make a lot of money convincing people that he had one.

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22 hours ago, Hardspoon said:

What do you mean, specifically?

What are the differences between DJ and Rory's swings? 

I'm sure you know how to use YouTube.  Do the same thing I did and look at the difference in swings.  They even have slow motion on both of them.  

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1 hour ago, MRugroden said:

I'm sure you know how to use YouTube.  Do the same thing I did and look at the difference in swings.  They even have slow motion on both of them.  

With all due respect, I've studied the golf swing a ton. I have seen thousands and thousands of swings of PGA Tour pros. I disagree, having done so, that Dustin Johnson's swing is a "Mike Austin" model and quite different than Rory McIlroy, John Rahm, Jordan Spieth, Tiger Woods, etc.

So if you want to put out something like "Johnson's swing is the closest to Austin's and if you'll notice, Dustin is the longest and most accurate on tour.  I believe he's #1 as well.  Might there be something to this?," then dude… it's on you to back it up and explain yourself a bit.

It's not on us.

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On 5/28/2017 at 3:12 PM, iacas said:

How? In what ways?

It seems to me someone could easily say Dustin is a great example of the modern golf swing given that he's a very modern athlete and works out and uses his Trackman religiously and so on.

Mike Austin never even won a PGA Tour event. Co-opting a good player and saying "they use our swing" is such a marketing gag.

Since you are a "pro" here's one way where Johnson and Austin are similar.  Both straighten the right leg in the backswing and the hips slide to the right providing a post to swing the left hip around like on a gate.  The left heel comes up on Austin, but with Johnson's flexibility it appears the left foot stays flat with the left knee pointed behind the ball as with Austin.  Austin bows the left wrist in the take away and then there's Dustin.  

Austin initiates the forward swing with the left leg.  As the left leg leads, the hips slide toward the front to the straight left leg.  The right hip starts to swing around the straight left leg like around a post.  The arms can't help but be on plane and sling the club through the ball.  Follow thru end on the left side in balance so the the shaft of the club about level with ears behind the head. 

Modern instruction usually says restrict the hips against the lower back during the turn.  Don't slide the hips, don't straighten the legs. Get in this and that position.  

BTW, I took lessons from Haney and was told there was no other way to  play golf other than the modern method. I almost quit golf until I found Austin.  The pain was too bad.

 

Now that I've backed it up why don't you back up your statements in post #2.  Pretty easy to toss something like that out there and then expect everyone to accept it because you are an administrator.  Why is Hogan's method better?  Why does his swing not reflect his teachings?  Have you examined Austin's swing and all of his teachings before you declared them worthless?  If you want to have a discussion then let's put it all out there.  For you to declare Austin's  a scam show us where what he teaches doesn't work.  

 

 

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1 hour ago, MRugroden said:

Since you are a "pro" here's one way where Johnson and Austin are similar.

There's no need to put "pro" in quotes. I am. I'm one of Golf Digest's "Best Young Teachers" for 2016-17. I've trained a few hundred instructors. I've written a book and software used by several of the top 10 players in the world or their instructors. The list goes on. I'm a pro. One of the best.

1 hour ago, MRugroden said:

Both straighten the right leg in the backswing

So does almost every other PGA Tour player:

Extending the trail knee is hardly something unique to Mike Austin's swing.

1 hour ago, MRugroden said:

…and the hips slide to the right providing a post to swing the left hip around like on a gate.  The left heel comes up on Austin, but with Johnson's flexibility it appears the left foot stays flat with the left knee pointed behind the ball as with Austin.  Austin bows the left wrist in the take away and then there's Dustin.

Really? I don't see that at all.

Dustin.jpg

The video moves (the red lines move relative to the sign as you can see), so I drew the yellow line up from the same spot on his shoe in both frames. His hips, if anything, are further left at the top of his backswing than right, based on this video.

This one too.

DJ Driver.jpg

Graeme McDowell and many other players bow the left wrist in the backswing.

1 hour ago, MRugroden said:

Austin initiates the forward swing with the left leg.  As the left leg leads, the hips slide toward the front to the straight left leg.

This is true of virtually every good player.

DJ's action is no different, here, than virtually everyone on the PGA Tour. Or me. Or Rory.

Rory.jpg

Note… left leg is still bent a bit on the right there…

1 hour ago, MRugroden said:

The right hip starts to swing around the straight left leg like around a post.  The arms can't help but be on plane and sling the club through the ball.  Follow thru end on the left side in balance so the the shaft of the club about level with ears behind the head.

Like this, on the right?

Rory D.jpg

Oh, whoops, that's Rory again. Dustin's follow through is below his shoulders.

The rest, well, that's basically a description of anyone good's downswing. I'm still waiting for "The Secret Mike Austin Sauce."

1 hour ago, MRugroden said:

Modern instruction usually says restrict the hips against the lower back during the turn.  Don't slide the hips, don't straighten the legs. Get in this and that position.

Eh. Not really. And I've never taught that. And PGA Tour players never really have swung like that. They've all turned their hips, extended their trail leg, slid their hips forward, etc.

That's what I've seen when I've studied and viewed thousands of swings on YouTube, as you asked me (and others) to do earlier.

1 hour ago, MRugroden said:

BTW, I took lessons from Haney and was told there was no other way to  play golf other than the modern method. I almost quit golf until I found Austin.  The pain was too bad.

Haney sucks. He doesn't represent ALL of "modern" instruction. Not even close.

1 hour ago, MRugroden said:

Now that I've backed it up why don't you back up your statements in post #2.

This hardly qualifies as backing anything up.

1 hour ago, MRugroden said:

Pretty easy to toss something like that out there and then expect everyone to accept it because you are an administrator.  Why is Hogan's method better?

Who said Hogan's method is better? I haven't.

1 hour ago, MRugroden said:

If you want to have a discussion then let's put it all out there.  For you to declare Austin's  a scam show us where what he teaches doesn't work.  

You first. You said Dustin Johnson swung uniquely. You said he did things I have shown here he doesn't do.

I'm pretty comfortable with what I teach, and I've got thousands of posts explaining it here. It's been vetted by people who know a good bit more about the golf swing than you do, from biomechanics guys to golfers to physicists and the like. I'm pretty well on record, and I've shared millions of words on the golf swing, for free.

So no, I don't feel like re-typing a bunch of it here, for the benefit of one, when you can just go look around this site and elsewhere.

Here's a good place to start:

Enjoy.

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25 minutes ago, MRugroden said:

Cute.  Did it take long to come up with that?

In fact, it appears to me that @iacas did take quite a bit of time to respond to you in detail...

 

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2 minutes ago, David in FL said:

In fact, it appears to me that @iacas did take quite a bit of time to respond to you in detail...

 

I was responding to Hardspoon.

For your critiquing pleasure.  A swing that won't ruin your back.

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3 minutes ago, MRugroden said:

I was responding to Hardspoon.

 

I'd be more interested in your response to @iacas since he's the one you addressed in your prior post.

Since you brought up hip-slide as somehow missing in "modern instruction", I thought you might find this thread interesting...

 

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