2018 PGA Championship at Bellerive

[iacas]

[brocks]

Tiger won the 100th US Open by 15 shots.  Just sayin.

[HJJ003]

Don’t know much about this course. Anyone with insider info? What’s its main defense? 

[brocks]

42 minutes ago, HJJ003 said:

Don’t know much about this course. Anyone with insider info? What’s its main defense? 

This doesn't go into a lot of detail, but it gives you an idea:

https://www.pga.com/events/pgachampionship/what-its-play-bellerive

[ChrisP]

I think they will score well on this course. Four par 5-s and some short par-4s. Opportunities will be there.

[Shindig]

Early odds for Tiger?

[brocks]

16 minutes ago, Shindig said:

Early odds for Tiger?

From http://golfodds.com/upcoming-major-odds.html.

If you can find a bookie who isn't paying too close attention, try to get Zach Johnson at 2000-1 (there's a Zach J. Johnson at those odds)

PGA Championship
Bellerive Country Club - St. Louis, Missouri
August 9 - 12, 2018

ODDS to Win:
Rory McIlroy	12/1
Jordan Spieth	12/1
Dustin Johnson	12/1
Tiger Woods	16/1
Rickie Fowler	16/1
Justin Thomas	16/1
Justin Rose	18/1
Brooks Koepka	20/1
Jon Rahm	20/1
Tommy Fleetwood	25/1
Francesco Molinari	25/1
Jason Day	25/1
Hideki Matsuyama	30/1
Patrick Reed	30/1
Henrik Stenson	40/1
Paul Casey	40/1
Alex Noren	40/1
Phil Mickelson	50/1
Sergio Garcia	50/1
Bubba Watson	50/1
Tony Finau	50/1
Xander Schauffele	50/1
Matt Kuchar	50/1
Marc Leishman	60/1
Branden Grace	60/1
Louis Oosthuizen	60/1
Patrick Cantlay	60/1
Bryson DeChambeau	60/1
Webb Simpson	60/1
Adam Scott	80/1
Zach Johnson	80/1
Kevin Kisner	80/1
Ian Poulter	100/1
Thomas Pieters	100/1
Tyrrell Hatton	100/1
Rafael Cabrera Bello	100/1
Daniel Berger	100/1
Kevin Chappell	100/1
Brian Harman	100/1
Brandt Snedeker	100/1
Charley Hoffman	100/1
Jason Dufner	125/1
Jimmy Walker	125/1
Emiliano Grillo	125/1
Matthew Fitzpatrick	125/1
Charl Schwartzel	125/1
Martin Kaymer	150/1
Ryan Moore	150/1
Kevin Na	150/1
Russell Knox	150/1
Peter Uihlein	150/1
Russell Henley	150/1
Kyle Stanley	150/1
Brendan Steele	150/1
Luke List	150/1
Haotong Li	150/1
Byeong Hun An	150/1
Gary Woodland	150/1
Kiradech Aphibarnrat	150/1
Lee Westwood	150/1
Keegan Bradley	150/1
Pat Perez	150/1
J.B. Holmes	150/1
Aaron Wise	150/1
Joaquin Niemann	150/1
Bill Haas	150/1
Billy Horschel	150/1
Shane Lowry	200/1
Beau Hossler	200/1
Chris Wood	200/1
Andy Sullivan	200/1
Danny Willett	200/1
Charles Howell III	200/1
Michael Kim	200/1
Adam Hadwin	200/1
Cameron Smith	200/1
Si Woo Kim	200/1
Chez Reavie	250/1
Scott Piercy	250/1
Austin Cook	250/1
Chesson Hadley	250/1
Shubhankar Sharma	250/1
Jim Furyk	250/1
Padraig Harrington	250/1
Ross Fisher	250/1
James Hahn	300/1
Satoshi Kodaira	300/1
Ollie Schniederjans	300/1
Bernd Wiesberger	300/1
Jordan Smith	300/1
Brice Garnett	300/1
Andrew Landry	300/1
Patton Kizzire	300/1
J.J. Spaun	300/1
Ryan Armour	500/1
Ted Potter, Jr	500/1
Chris Stroud	500/1
Scott Brown	500/1
Vijay Singh	500/1
Davis Love III	500/1
John Daly	1000/1
Rich Beem	1000/1
Y.E. Yang	1000/1
Paul Broadhurst	1000/1
Omar Uresti	1000/1
Rich Berberian, Jr	1000/1
Matt Dobyns	1000/1
Marty Jertsen	1000/1
Shaun Micheel	2000/1
Craig Bowden	2000/1
Michael Block	2000/1
Bob Sowards	2000/1
David Muttitt	2000/1
Jaysen Hansen	2000/1
Brian Smock	2000/1
Sean McCarty	2000/1
Matt Borchert	2000/1
Zach J. Johnson	2000/1
Jason Schmuhl	2000/1
Danny Balin	2000/1
Ben Kern	2000/1
Ryan Vermeer	2000/1
Shaun Warren	2000/1
Craig Hocknull	2000/1
Johan Kok	2000/1

Edited July 24, 2018 by brocks

[HJJ003]

41 minutes ago, Shindig said:

Early odds for Tiger?

Interesting note: In the last twenty years only one golfer of 40 years of age or older has one won the PGA Championship. Who? Vijay Singh in 2004. Doesn’t bode well for any golfer in the tournament over 40 BUT Golf hasn’t had golfers playing at Tiger and Phil’s level consistently at their age in that timeframe either. 

The PGA championship has kinda become US Open lite (which hasn’t had but one champion over 35 i think around 20 years in Angel Cabrera). Not saying Tiger can’t win it because I think he can. However, I think Augusta and The Open are his best chances from here on out. 

[Club Rat]

 Bellerive Country Club - St. Louis, Missouri is in my home town and I have played it many times.

1 hour ago, HJJ003 said:

Anyone with insider info?

Quote

Founded in 1897 as The Field Club with a nine-hole golf course, the membership incorporated in 1910, moved the club to Normandy and named the club Bellerive after Louis St. Ange De Bellerive, the last French Governor in North America. The original Normandy course was designed by Scotsman Robert Foulis.

THE GOLF COURSE AND BELLERIVE’S CHAMPIONSHIP HISTORY

In 1955, the members decided to relocate and chose Robert Trent Jones, Sr. to select the land and design the new golf course.  The club relocated to Creve Coeur in 1960.  Five years later, in 1965, the club hosted the United States Open, the youngest course to ever host an Open Championship.  Gary Player won the 1965 Championship, completing the career grand slam in the process.

Bellerive went on to host the inaugural United States Mid-Amateur Championship in 1981, won by St. Louisan Jim Holtgrieve.  In 1992, Bellerive hosted the PGA Championship which became the first major championship won by Nick Price.  Price finished three strokes ahead of a group that included Nick Faldo.  In 2001, the club was prepared to host 70 of the world’s best golfers at the WGC American Express Championship when the terrorist attacks of 9/11 forced cancellation of the event.  Bellerive then hosted the 2004 United States Senior Open, won by Peter Jacobson, the 2008 BMW Championship and the 2013 Senior PGA Championship, thus becoming only the third club to host all four US major traveling championships. 

The course underwent a major renovation in 2006 led by Rees Jones, the son of Robert Trent Jones, Sr. to provide Noticeable changes include the tree removal and lake construction on #2, making the hole one of two potentially drivable Par 4s (with the changes to #11), the straightened 618 yard Par 5 Eighth Hole, and the picturesque 482 yard Par 4 Twelfth Hole.  

In 2013 Rees Jones, facilitated additional course modifications. These modifications included a complete reconstruction of the bunkers and the installation of a unique championship bunker sand. Turf lines throughout the course were also modified. These changes predominately were around bunkers, creek edges and at all putting surface complexes. The modified design increased the aesthetics and introduced new playing challenges coupled with enhanced vistas and sightlines, Bellerive’s progressive modifications have added to its historic legacy and national championship appeal. 

As with the original design, the difficulty of the course is best demonstrated by holes 14 through 16, known as “the Ridge.”  All of the holes on “the Ridge” play into the prevailing southerly wind. Hole 14 is the last of Bellerive’s strategic 4 par. Hole 15 (495 yards) and 16 (235 yards) are long but straight forward challenges.

Year 2018

TAGS -PGA Championship

2008 BMW Championship -

Scores should be similar with a milder weather forecast predicted. We have had a very warm stretch and temps are lower 90's this week.
The course is a very traditional Country Club style with tree lined fairways and no real tricky holes.
A few greens have huge humps (VW's graves), but are manageable to play.
With the hot weather the past two months, it may have paid a toll on the ruff which typically is very plush.
Not many hazards, OB on perimeter holes, a few holes where a player could lose strokes for a Lost Ball.
Talk around town is they have spent a ton of money prepping for the championship.
I'm guessing they have shut it down for members as there have been several members playing my course last week.

St. Lou is a great stop for the tour, wish we hosted events more often.
 

[iacas]

1 hour ago, brocks said:

If you can find a bookie who isn't paying too close attention, try to get Zach Johnson at 2000-1 (there's a Zach J. Johnson at those odds)

Yes, as you know he’s the PGA professional.

[Shindig]

3 hours ago, brocks said:

From http://golfodds.com/upcoming-major-odds.html.

If you can find a bookie who isn't paying too close attention, try to get Zach Johnson at 2000-1 (there's a Zach J. Johnson at those odds)

It's an interesting thought, but then I might find myself rooting for Zach Johnson.  I can imagine hedging my bets with an actual bet in team sports but I don't see it in golf.

[brocks]

3 hours ago, iacas said:

Yes, as you know he’s the PGA professional.

Actually, the "real" Zach isn't a bad bet at 80-1.  He looked very good at the Open.

[ChrisP]

Zach hasn't really had that great a year, though. Only one top-10. He played well at the British, but he plays well there all the time. 

Heard some early analysis that they're expecting a lot of low scores at this PGA. They changed it to a par-72 with 4 par-5s, two which are pretty short, all which are reachable. Also 4 par-4s which are relatively short. So it should favor the big hitters who like to go out and make a lot of birdies. Guys like Rory, Koepka, DJ. Hurts the grinders out there who like the difficult conditions and courses.

[DeadMan]

Robert Trent Jones Sr. design and Rees Jones redesign? Holy shit, count me out of this one. Half the holes will have fairway bunkers on both sides of the landing area for tee shots. They'll have 20 yards of fairway to land it in. Except the long hitters will just be able to smash their drives over the bunkers and have wedges in. Ugh.

[Shindig]

6 minutes ago, DeadMan said:

Holy shit, count me out of this one. 

No offense my friend, but I wasn't planning to place a bet on you winning it this year. 

[Club Rat]

34 minutes ago, DeadMan said:

Half the holes will have fairway bunkers on both sides of the landing area for tee shots. They'll have 20 yards of fairway to land it in.

Not so, the course is short for Tour Standards and it's an easy course for players who manage their game.
Greens are huge and hitting them near the pin locations is a key for scoring well.
Long putts will be a problem for those who do not.

Par Fives are reachable and pose little problems around most of the greens.
Bunker play will be no problems for the Pros.

A few greens will have potential penalties (hazards) if missed in the wrong areas.

[DeadMan]

9 minutes ago, Club Rat said:

Not so, the course is short for Tour Standards and it's an easy course for players who manage their game.

Are you sure we're talking about the same course?

Course is 7547 yards, which is hardly short by PGA Tour standards.

[Club Rat]

34 minutes ago, DeadMan said:

Course is 7547 yards

Most holes are elevated tee shots which make them play shorter than the yardage.
#9 plays uphill and a difficult hole.
It's been very dry the past month and the courses in our area are all firm even with nightly watering.

Granted, it's not Carnoustie firm, tee shots will run.
The #11 hole is the only narrow fairway and is a short hole.
Players will mostly hit irons.

All other holes are great driver holes even for the short hitters.

Edited July 25, 2018 by Club Rat