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CarlOwen

Match Play Opponent "Too Nice" - Gamesmanship?

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5 hours ago, CarlOwen said:

The next time, I play with someone like this, I'm going to be quiet as a churchmouse and say nothing at all the entire round. This to me seems unfriendly, sure, but lhe only solution, without actually having an akward conversation about it.

That's just another form of taking yourself out of your own game, and letting someone else change your behavior.

Figure out what you want, and then enforce that sort of state on the match. Answer him with brief answers, tell him to let you alone, ignore him… whatever.

30 minutes ago, Piz said:

It is only gamesmanship if you think of it that way.  I figure an opponent who talks a lot is nervous...or just likes to talk a lot.  Either way it isn't anything to be concerned about.  I've made innocent remarks that have been taken the wrong way and I figure other people do also.

I take this approach a bit myself.

If an opponent is behaving unusually, I figure he feels he needs this trickery to beat me, so I've already got a leg up on him.

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thanks guys for all the comments and post mortem. I especially  agree with IACAS about taking yourself out of your own game. The more I've thought about it. this is my problem, not his, and how I react to it, is up to me

case closed.

wait until next year!

 

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45 minutes ago, DaveP043 said:

That's fine, until he's saying how well the ball is hit, as it heads directly into the middle of a pond.

"Beautiful shot! Went right where you were aimed!"

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4 hours ago, Club Rat said:

Most Match Play events allow players to have a Caddie, I would recommend having someone join you in a match.
If nothing else, it will keep an opponent at bay and usually when a player has a Caddie, opponents often are less sociable.   

That sounds like quite the bit of gamesmanship 😋

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I don't see this as gamesmanship. Perhaps he is always like that, same as in friendly games with nothing on the line. I know I am a bit like that, feeling fairly comfortable pretty quickly with strangers I have never met. I guess that's a byproduct of routinely get paired up with said strangers on the first tee... If you want to be quiet with me, that's fine too. I try to be sociable, but I don't mind the quiet type, competition or not. I just find that games with some banter (with friends typically) are a lot more fun! 🙂

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5 hours ago, mcanadiens said:

I'm not good enough to bother with match play, but I've heard some stories.

My club does match play by flights and uses net handicap.  Sure, you aren't quite ready to participate in the WGC-Accenture Match Play tournament, but there's no reason you couldn't play a match play round against someone in the 16-22 handicap range with appropriate strokes given on the right holes.  

40 minutes ago, Missouri Swede said:

"Beautiful shot! Went right where you were aimed!"

Would that last part possibly be non-public information being offered that could influence how a future shot is played?

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5 hours ago, DaveP043 said:

Both @Club Rat and I have been playing match play for decades, we've both developed the thick skin I recommend. 

NC 2015 was eye opening for me. I found the hard way that I am not very match play tough. But yes, since then I am finding the more match play I get under my belt, less I can be bothered. Of course if you are just swinging poorly, it's a non-factor anyway. 

 

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7 hours ago, CarlOwen said:

You are right Dave. I'm sure many a match play have been much worse.  and yes, he didn't do anything wrong as it relates to rules and as I said, is indeed a friendly person.

I suppose since I've never experienced this before, I wasn't equipped mentally to deal with it. 

It's interesting because, a frieindly round with the guys has A LOT of banter and trash talk which is what makes golf fun, but in a competitive match situation, it is anything but welcome. From what I've seen on TV, Is appears that no one talks at all during a match. 

The next time, I play with someone like this, I'm going to be quiet as a churchmouse and say nothing at all the entire round. This to me seems unfriendly, sure, but lhe only solution, without actually having an akward conversation about it.

You are in a competition.  You don't need to be friendly when in an organized competition.  Now if you are playing a casual round, you can come off as a douche for being unfriendly.  But when you are competing in an organized event, I see no need to be friendly. 

You should be courteous but don't have to be friendly.  Just my 2 cents.

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15 hours ago, Shindig said:

My club does match play by flights and uses net handicap.  Sure, you aren't quite ready to participate in the WGC-Accenture Match Play tournament, but there's no reason you couldn't play a match play round against someone in the 16-22 handicap range with appropriate strokes given on the right holes.  

I guess I'm honestly not sure how my association handles handicap in its match play event. There is a qualifier. Most of the participants are low caps.

Other than that, I've just not met anyone particularly interested in playing the match format. Most of my fellow hacks are focused on scoring total strokes.

 

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23 hours ago, CarlOwen said:

Hello everyone.

Last week, my match play opponent was quite a bit older and has a lower handicap of 3 strokes, consequently, he gave me strokes on a few holes. There was a lot riding on this match. The winner makes it to the semi-finals. From there your name makes it on a plaque for everyone to see.

Before my match, one of our pros said to me  "Oh, you're playing Warren, good luck, he's very crafty and a tough opponnentt"

Well, now I know.  This guy actually said, as I was taking practice swings on the tee box  "god, I wish I had a swing like you"

Or if it hit close on the green, he'll say "go get your birdie" when we're both laying two.. Following a very mediocre wedge shot, he'd say "that was a great shot" 

the worst was when I was I was one up and had a difficult chip then one put to win the hole, he say's, I'm not making this up... "so, how old are your kids?" of course, I take the bait, answer the question, and he says "that sounds pretty stressfull, "ive been through that..."

These types of comments and questions went on and on throughout our match. He's a friendly person, but I'd be damned if he didn't know what he was doing. 

Because I was playing some really good golf up until this match, I could have easily beaten this guy, but I didn't, and now I feel like I've been cheated and can't get this out of my head and move on. Any advice is greatly appreciated, I do happen to see this guy around and I do not want this to be an "incident" but at the same time, I feel like exposing him for what he is,-which I would characterize as unsportsmanlike.

I've played a number of match games and never had to deal with this. Most opponents know when not to talk- or leave you mostly alone if you are not initiating convesation. My comments are usually limited to "nice shot" or "what a bad break" if my opponent has an unfair situation, but that's about it. I know there is a little bit of head games with when to conceding puts and the like, but at the same time this is not a pool hall on the south side of town.

 

Well your pro did say he was crafty. :-$

Theres nothing wrong with what he did, IMO. He hustled you. Its a part of competition. Play your game. Win holes. You'll know better next time, or maybe even choose to use the same tactic on a opponent yourself. When I'm getting beat badly in match play (2+ holes down) i get slow as molasses and take like 50 practice swings every time. Depending on the mental makeup of the player, he'll either get frustrated and come back to me, or just ignore it and go along his merry way. These types of gamesmanship things separate match play from medal play. It really is a different game. 

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There are lots of different ways of gamesmanship in match play.  I used to hate match play with a passion, because I would always get in my own way and just blow up or get antsy if I was down a hole or 2.  I won our clubs match play tourney last year and was 3 down going into the back 9 to a very good and very long player.  I just waited patiently for him to make a mistake and then would capitalize on it.  Ended up winning 2up.  After playing 5 matches or so last year, match play is now fun to me.  I love the guys that watch you roll a put 1-2' by the hole, watch you mark it, they putt out and then as you are looking at your putt and get ready to hit it they tell you "its good".  It drives me crazy, but its another little way to make you sweat a little bit and maybe take you off your game a little bit.

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8 minutes ago, Grinde6 said:

I love the guys that watch you roll a put 1-2' by the hole, watch you mark it, they putt out and then as you are looking at your putt and get ready to hit it they tell you "its good".  It drives me crazy, but its another little way to make you sweat a little bit and maybe take you off your game a little bit.

I can honestly say this never bothers me.  My attitude, if I can make the putt every single time, I'll happily putt it.  If I can't make it every time, I deserve to putt it.  The timing of the concession never gets to me because I'm always planning to putt it.

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On 7/24/2018 at 9:34 AM, mcanadiens said:

I'm not good enough to bother with match play, but I've heard some stories.

Apparently my association has one guy that is known for accusing people of cheating early in a match if he thinks he can get away with it. He never actually take it to the powers-that-be. It's just try to upset the oppo and put him on tilt. 

All the old-timers know this routine, but he'll get a few people when they aren't aware.

I'd love to get that guy in a match.  I'd be guaranteed at least one hole won, because if he tries to cheat I'm going to call him on it, and if he disputes it, I'll make my claim before the next tee as the rules require.  He sure won't get in my head that way - I'm more likely to bug him when I quote the rule to him.  And I'll keep bugging him with rules until he decides to play golf and leave the head games in the clubhouse.

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3 hours ago, mcanadiens said:

I guess I'm honestly not sure how my association handles handicap in its match play event. There is a qualifier. Most of the participants are low caps.

Other than that, I've just not met anyone particularly interested in playing the match format. Most of my fellow hacks are focused on scoring total strokes.

 

This is really a mistake to to get too stuck on stroke play.  I've always played a bit of match play when playing casual golf as well as playing in men's club matches.  It keeps you mentally flexible.  And it's fun.  And you can still keep a legitimate stroke score for handicap if you so choose, even if some rules are contradictory between the two forms of play.  My brother and I often play matches when we get together a couple of times a year.  I used to give him strokes, now he has to give me about 6 strokes. :-)

Edited by Fourputt

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4 hours ago, DaveP043 said:

I can honestly say this never bothers me.  My attitude, if I can make the putt every single time, I'll happily putt it.  If I can't make it every time, I deserve to putt it.  The timing of the concession never gets to me because I'm always planning to putt it.

Same here. I always plan to putt out. So that tactic is worthless on me. 

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Ha!   I love this guy.   didn't say one bad thing.    If a transcript is written on paper, he didn't say anything that would be construed as anything but friendly chatter.   Yet, he was absolutely in your head in the worst way possible.  appears that he mentally ripped you from your game without any effort at all.   

Maybe it was gamesmanship, maybe it wasn't.  but, based on the words you wrote, I would highly recommend not making a fuss about it.  You will not come off well at all.  
just chalk this one up to classic crafty old guy stuff, learn from it, and come out a bit mentally tougher next time.

Edited by iacas
Removed unnecessary spaces

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He didn't "do" anything.  Other than maybe being friendly and outgoing.  Maybe it's his nature and golf is his happy place and he genuinely likes meeting and playing with new people.  Maybe he's a coach and volunteers with kids and is habitually positive and supporting by nature.

That certainly must have been a horrible experience for sure.....

But you certainly did something to yourself.

Now that guy that starts off with a false accusation.  Frankly, he shouldn't be allowed to compete or even play the game, unless alone, after sunset.  Seems there should be a rule for that type of douche nugget

Edited by rehmwa

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