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rustyredcab

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rustyredcab last won the day on September 4 2012

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75 Power and Finesse to Spare

About rustyredcab

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  • Birthday 11/30/1958

Your Golf Game

  • Handicap Index
    10.1
  1. Been off the forum for a few months... Why aren't more people copying Moe Norman's swing? I don't know why. I can glean some insight from my (then teenage) son as he said, "I don't care how well it works. I think that swing looks goofy. I don't want to look goofy." In his defense, my swing looked awkward for a few years because it felt uncomfortable to me. I discovered "Natural Golf" back in the days when it was mostly a front to sell clubs. I took private lessons from a local NG pro. After almost two years of NG, my index dropped from an all-time low of 18.0 before NG to a 16.1. My distances were shorter (I was never a long hitter) but my accuracy was better. My 90+ rounds were a little less frequent but still happened. It seemed I was still as likely to shoot 105 as I was 88. Searching for more improvement and an instructor who would teach me the swing without trying to sell me more clubs at very lesson, I stumbled on Graves Golf and signed up for a 5-day school. What I discovered was that Graves taught Moe's swing and not the modified version that Natural Golf taught back then. They changed my grip, setup, take away... everything. They also showed me that with a proper setup, I should not have more upright clubs. I could use any brand of clubs. They did not care if I bought clubs from them, somewhere else, or simply flattened my existing clubs. They just wanted my static measurements to fit me. The swing was no magic bullet and breaking bad habits took time and practice. After a few months of working, the new Moe swing started paying off. My high rounds happened less often. My index started to drop. I gained lots of distance. I now am among the longer hitters in my group -- though a short hitter by internet forum standards. I've changed irons and shafts recently to increase distance consistency and do not care about length with my irons. My index dropped to a low of 6.1 a few years ago when I played and practiced "a lot." This year, with only 12 rounds played, it has jumped back up to 10.1. While very high for me of late, even 10.1 is a number I could not have dreamed about before discovering Moe's swing. As I said, it is not a magic bullet. One must still practice to play well. So... Why aren't more people copying Moe Norman's swing? My regular group has watched me go from a shorter hitter who was among the worst scorers in the group, to the longest hitter and the guy who's ball we play off each week. I'm giving 15 strokes to guys I used to play even. One guy has "tried" Moe's swing and gave it up because the change was too hard for him -- everything must change for this to work. The oldest member of our group has just ordered the videos and plans to try it to prolong his years of playing (he is 75 years old). Moe's swing is easy on your back and knees. My older buddy has moved away so he is on his own (no range help from this long-time student). In his prime, he was a very good stick. I imaging he will have a hard time giving up his old habits. Changing to Moe's swing is a big change. It takes time and work. Guys who "try it" are doomed to fail as they would be "trying" any major overhaul of their swing. Guys who try a bit of it are also doomed IMO. Imagine trying to copy one aspect of any pro's swing while leaving major parts of your current swing as is. Why didn't Moe win majors? For one, he played at a time when being a PGA pro was not just about posting low scores. And, back then, Moe was never anyone's idea of what a golf pro should be. For another, he was one messed up and odd guy. Sponsors avoided him. Moe got a tip about his grip from his hero while on the range after the first round of The Masters, and he practiced so late into that night that his hands were bloody and he could not hold a club the next day. He ended up withdrawing (a big no-no in those days). He wore odd and ill-fitting clothes and used to lay down in the fairway in protest of slow play. Stories are that he was belittled by other pros for his dress and antics when he played in the US. They believed he was bad for the game. So he went home to Canada and scratched out a living there. There is a book about Moe and there are rumors of a major motion picture coming about Moe. His is a bittersweet story to say the least. Natural Golf today -- the instruction part of Natural Golf was purchased by Graves Golf Academy a few years ago. So, Natural Golf now teaches the real Moe swing. They are teachers, not club salespeople (although they will sell you almost any brand if you wish). If you ever have a chance to see Todd Graves do a hitting demonstration, it is a thing to behold. His swing is an exact copy of Moe's.
  2. Golf or Football

    Football: It is now or never -- unlikely to play football after high school and zero chance you will be playing when you are 22. That said, even just two years of high school football messed up my knees, hands, hips... I was too small to play varsity but played every down for two years and loved it. As others have said, it is a real team sport. I still recall the best game I ever played (as an individual) was a game my team lost by a lot. Golf: If you make the golf team, you will be a good golfer for the rest of your life. I've never known anyone who played high school golf who was not a good golfer as an adult. I could not have made my high school golf team (and it is much more difficult now than it was in the 70's). If you can make the team, do it. Find out how they decide who makes the team -- just scores during tryouts or is "potential" part of the equation (things like how good your swing looks). You should have an idea before football starts if you are good enough to make the golf team. If you think it will be close, you have a very tough decision.
  3. Thank goodness the weather stinks. My elbow was impacted on the outside and the only thing I do to potentially cause injury is golf. After therapy I am luck enough that there are nearly zero lingering effects. I don't wear a strap but likely will if playing a lot. I also hope to limit shots on mats for a while and, if it ever gets nice, avoid ranges with hard dirt. Or at least hit fewer balls from hard surfaces. My advise is find a PT you trust and do as they say. If you think they are not aggressive enough, find one on the same page as you are on.
  4. Most comfortable golf shoes??

    True Linkswear Stealth. 2013's are awesome and, since they are discontinued, they are for sale for $70 at RBG. I thought the 2011's were great at $200 and 2013's are even better.
  5. Scheduled my first lesson!

    Hope it went great for you. Go 100% all in. Take the advise and buy in all the way. No holding on to a little of this or that from your old swing. I have watched guys at golf school try and do "most" of what they are being told. 100% or it will not work. If you find you will not trust your pro 100%, find a new pro.
  6. To be clear, the course is dry but your rented house is your house. So if beer while playing matters (as it does to some of my buddies) then skip this place.
  7. I love the golf at Lawsonia in Green Lake WI -- 2.5 hours from O'Hare. Two wonderful courses and, while very affordable, among my favorite places to play at any price. They held the PGA there about 70 years ago. The Links course is a wonderful design that I've come to appreciate more the more I play it. The golf is one of the great deals I've ever found. The courses are located on a large property called The Green Lake Conference Center. They have lots of on-site lodging designed for church groups and families. The entire property is owned by the Baptists and the course and "hotels" are dry. I understand that it was an upscale resort "in the day," fell on hard times, was purchased by Mr. Kraft of Kraft Foods, and he donated it to the Baptists. I have been the guest of a large group that rented houses on the property and we saved our non-Baptist fun for evenings. This was an annual thing and we all loved the golf and shared houses. As a guest, I don't know what houses cost but guess the ones in the woods are much cheaper than those on the lake. I do know there are a few (very few) hotel options near the courses that range from budget to fancy. There are also a few restaurants within a short drive. There are also B&B; options that may make a deal if stay during the week and avoid peak season. http://www.lawsonia.com http://www.glcc.org
  8. What's the best "impossible" shot you've hit?

    Deep in woods after tee shot and about 170 to the pin. Can't go backward, sideways either way -- total jail. So caddie advises that we mine as well hit and hope toward the green. There is no place to drop and re-tee would take us out of the hole. I'm a 18 handicap and the only thing I have in common with Seve is that we both have an "s" on our first names. Choke up on a 3-wood to try and keep ball under the first tree directly in front of me. Shot goes over, under and through trees without hitting any -- on my line, the ball avoided about 10 trees. Ball clears woods and lands fifty yards from the green in the fairway and runs up and onto the green to two feet from pin for a conceded birdie. Our side takes low ball and total.
  9. Why I do want to work out and be in better shape as it relates to my golf swing: Stamina -- when I'm in good shape, my swing does not change through the round as fatigue sets in like it does when I'm not working out. Extra strength and flexibility allow me to maintain the feelings from the range and from early in the round. Fat me is starting to drag on hot days sometime after the turn -- that can not be good for a repeatable and consistent swing. Odd shots -- there are times when an awkward stance or deep rough call make being in shape, more flexible and stronger really work. Capability -- When I'm fat and out of shape (like now), there are certain compensation that must creep into my swing. My pros (Graves Golf), did a webinare in which Todd wore a fat suit and showed what to do when you have a big belly. While the information was helpful, it was nicer when I didn't need to make those compensation. Wife -- I'd like to look acceptable or even good to my wife and to grow old with her. While this does not directly relate to my swing, my wife "allows" me to spend a lot of time with golf. If my getting in shape is, in large part, because of golf, it reenforces her good decision to give me my golf obsession with little grossing. BTW, where is Carl since his weight gain success of a while ago? To the OP, assume your swing issues are either unrelated or are a result of your body feeling like it is making the same swing when it is not. Enjoy the new flexibility and strength and spend some time, and some of your renewed stamina, and introducing your changing body to your desired swing positions. Good luck.
  10. I got in great shape a few years back, lost weight fast, and also lost my swing a bit. Here is my theory: the added flexibility and strength changed the feelings of my correct positions. So, while I felt like I was turning, bring the club back, etc. the same, it was not the same. After some extensive range work with video, I played better than ever. Bad news is I found all the weight that I lost -- almost all anyway. So now I have been relearning my fat-guy swing and feelings. Maybe this year I'll get in shape again, a bit more slowly, and have the best of both worlds.
  11. How difficult are PGA Tour course setups?

    How hard? Very hard. Years ago, I played a course which had just completed an LPGA tournament on Sunday -- we played Monday in a charity event. Knowing I would be playing the course, I watched the LPGA event that weekend. Final group and final hole, Anika was tied for the lead. She hit a great approach shot to about 2.0 feet and the announcers declared her the champion -- she had little more than a tap-in as it looked on TV and the announcer validated. As she walked to the green, a storm rolled in and the rain picked up intensity. She made the putt as the skies opened up in a downpour. It rained hard until about 1 PM the next day. The event started late but went off as planned. Because of the storm, the pins all remained in their Sunday locations and nothing was mowed. Even with 18 hours of rain, the pins were extremely tough and the greens were fast, fast, fast. Pin placements seemed brutal -- the same pins that went without comment the day before during the TV coverage. When my group got to 18, after playing the hole, we each placed our ball where Anika had her gimme. It was a short putt, like we saw on TV, but it also had a little break and was downhill. Four us hit a total of 12 putts before one went in. I could have stayed there all day before holing that putt. Most missed the hole and left a 3-5 foot putt coming back. Try and take the break out and you were left with 10 - 20 feet. This after a night of rain and no mowing. I can not image how tough the greens and pins were for the ladies that weekend and they went without comment from announcers or players. Just another weekend on the LPGA. Everyone knew that Anika would make the putt. She walked up and drained it without fanfare. On TV, none of us knew how hard it really was. And that was LPGA and the years ago. I cannot image what they do on the PGA today.
  12. Golf Grip selection - help please

    Lots of threads here giving love to PURE grips. I love my Iomic Sticky 2.3 grips. I stopped wearing a glove. They are tacky but, dispute the name, not sticky. They have a bit of give so they are easy on my hands -- without even wearing a glove. Yet they never are squishy like the WINNs I had years ago. They seem to be lasting forever -- they are still like new after other grips would need to be replaced. Bad news -- expensive even when you buy the on line.
  13. Stop Aiming at the Flag!!!

    back to the subject of the thread…. Anyone tried the advice in the OP? Please share results. I'm looking out my window at a near white-out. Again. I'm visiting/lurking here to avoid shoveling snow. Again. Is it normal for a grown man to cry when it starts snowing? My five keys are bend my knees, don't take too much snow on the shovel, keep my back straight, throw snow down wind, avoid starting the job for as long as possible. As much as I love a spitting match about keeping my head still and the real five keys, I'd really love to hear about people's experiences aiming at the center of green based on handicap and yardage.
  14. Chipping problems....

    Good video in the thread above. Notice how the lead arm remains straight. For me, this is what I need to remind myself to do in order to hit solid short shots. FOR ME, when I'm playing well, I try not to think of much in the stroke when hitting short pitches and chips. I remind myself to keep a straight lead arm (without the reminder I tend to bend the arm just enough to distroy any chance of hitting the ball solidly) and then think about the flight I want and EXACTLY where I want the ball to land. Like putting, I try not to think about length of swing and followthrough. I've hit enough balls to let my sub-conscience take over. If I was tossing the ball, I would not think about my tossing technique, wrist position, followthrough.... Same idea here. When I get hippy around the green, no amount of thinking will help. It is hard, but I try to just think about the lead arm and hope that does it. Not sure if that will help you.
  15. Stop Aiming at the Flag!!!

    I am NOT a PGA Pro. I know, some of you may think I could be with a
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