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Handicap Index

Found 5 results

  1. I recently asked @mvmac, who was familiar with what Dave and I taught, to give us a report card on what advanced players are learning from advanced coaches and how he felt we stood. Mike hasn't seen us teach much in the past four or five years, and we haven't put out a lot of videos (aside from these, of course) lately, either. So some of the things he thinks we teach date back five years or more. Before I get into the list… you're going to quickly see that most of the list is "for better players." I'll make a conscious decision a lot of the time to decide which of two slightly different directions to go. For example, some people here on TST were surprised by the "flow" talk we've had the past several months here on TST. I'll admit to getting people to "create space from the wall" by learning a very centered to even slightly forward-of-center hip pivot (heck, I still give this drill to students), but these are golfers > 6 handicappers (often > 10) who sway their hips back a lot. For them, going a little extreme to this side of things is a conscious choice by me to help their ballstriking. For better players, I talk about more "flow" stuff. I let the right hip look like it moves back an inch or so. The way I talk about a lot of things is a little different. I don't teach "one swing" but I do have one general system of what I think is right, but within that, I have preferences for different types of players. The player who is an 18 who wants to become a 10 and won't really spend a lot of time practicing gets something different than the motivated 6 handicapper trying to become scratch. That all said, the list, and my reactions to it. For Most Players… … I wouldn’t change much, little reverse K setup, err with a stronger grip, Bender/Geoff Jones style pivot with some feet flare, don’t be afraid to get speedy with the arms coming down. So, this is what I talked about up above. For most players — and for us sometimes that's 90% of the people we teach — the simple, very centered, slightly less dynamic pivot stuff he's saying is still pretty good. Again, not much time spent here, so let's move on to the finer details. My text will remain in black. For Better Players… … I don’t know if I would call these changes to what you do but how I would go about teaching better players. Changes in my view from several years ago. In no particular order: Foot Flare No more than 20 degrees of foot flare, even less on trail foot. I understand the reasoning for this, and I'll still add some foot flare to the trail foot for an older good player to help increase range of motion, but I think the gains here are so small that this starts to "matter" (still only a little) to scratch golfers or better. But, maybe there's something to learn here… Hips/Pelvis Pelvis more level or even slight LPT at 1 Avoid idea or image of hip slide I think I get a check mark here. I talk with even mid-level handicap players lately about "landing" on the front foot, which includes a little "flow" back toward the target with the upper body. Even higher handicappers, while I'm emphasizing "getting forward" (great players still get their weight AND pressure forward - the images in the "hip slide" topic aren't "wrong") the hips getting forward, I talk a lot about "sending energy" forward. Hands A1-A2 Little or no depth with the hands to 2 or even feeling forearm counter rotation in takeaway for players that bank the club inward. From DL, the "curve" of the "hula hoop" is basically negligible in the direction of "depth from A1-A2, so what appears to be "straight back. A2 depends on how quickly a player hinges the club, of course, but most good players have a pretty narrow range here. I probably allow a little more hand depth than Mike would like, but often I feel that's a matter of other things being a priority. I like to see the hands go slightly inward the first half of the backswing while the latter half becomes about more "ascent," but even then a lot of that "slightly" is after 1.75 or so. As a brief aside, I think my own swing is shaping up in this regard nicely. I'd get too shallow, too low, and my wrists would react poorly at the top given what I'd done to get there. I now feel like my hands go out away from me from A1-A2.5, but of course they don't actually. As for the counter-rotation, I'll have Mike clarify perhaps, as we've taught this to even poorer players. The feeling that the right hand stays "on top" a bit longer is very helpful in not swinging the clubhead well behind the player, and in keeping the face a bit "squarer" (or at least not flopping it open) longer. "Stretching" the Trail Side Stretching the trail side without elevating the rib cage I get what he's saying, and it's something I work on myself as well. I'll "stand up" a little too much during the backswing. The feel for me is from the top of the right thigh up across my pelvis and just above my belly button, but the rib cage as Mike says doesn't stretch up. S&T teaches you to feel the stretch further up, up the whole right side, and again for higher handicappers we'll let their hips turn (trail leg extends a good bit) and they'll feel the stretch all the way up, but for lower handicappers, we don't do that quite so much this way. Lead Side Unweighting Unweighting lead side early. That could lead to a trigger move or a slight pelvis bump or a little pressure “rock” to the trail side before the club/hands move back. But doesn’t has to. I teach this, and in looking at a few videos of some of Dave's better players, he does too. Mike's right that we didn't as much seven years ago, but the pressure data we were early at looking at led to small changes here. Trail Knee Extension Avoid a lot of trail knee extension from 1-3 Ha, addressed above, before I got to this point. We don't teach a lot of this here. Unlike George Gankas. 🙂 At any rate, for a lower handicapper who lacks some range of motion (an older good player), we might let them get away with more trail knee extension, and to be clear the trail knee still extends measurably. Elbows Close Avoid squeezing the arms together at 1 or in the backswing. Hate this one myself. I've been saying for years that squeezing the elbows together during the backswing is almost the surest way to have them come apart during the downswing. Banking the Trail Foot Avoid trying to bank the trail foot, allow heel to come off the ground by 6 Check. I know why Mike added this - a lot of poor players, and a lot of juniors, will shoot their trail knee toward the ball early in the downswing and the heel will come off the ground VERY early. But I looked back at the lessons of my good players, and the notes, and I've not mentioned the trail foot banking in at least several years. And though admittedly I don't have many Justin Thomas type players… I do let people get away with some more of the "knee action" described above with the driver than with irons. Like JT himself. Stopping at A4 Avoid stopping or rehearsing 4. Pending more information, I don't know that I'll agree here, and I might humbly suggest that because what Mike has been working on, he's seeing this as limiting "flow" and the general athletic movement. On that I'd agree, but sometimes stopping at A4 is a good way to check on something that happened from 2-4 or something. Or if I have someone who is across the line and who dumps it under from there, and they're working on not only getting more "laid off" (feeling only) so the club can pitch out a little (paging @saevel25), it can be useful, IMO, to isolate just that piece starting from the proper spot, so you know it's the proper spot. Also, I will do a lot of "pump drill" type things when teaching something dynamic that's transition or early downswing-related. Fast Backswing Fast backswing via body is good. I might be missing something here, too, as we've talked about speeding up the backswing for awhile now. It's even in LSW, and was "old" when we put it in there. Maybe the bit I'm missing is "via body" but I don't feel that way. Two Random Bits Have concepts for the downswing/impact but train the backswing. Understand that a lot that is occurring with the club/limbs/wrist angles is being heavily influenced by the torso/pelvis motion. These are a bit more philosophical, so, I can't really comment concretely here. We work on a lot of backswings, and since the arms are attached to the shoulders, of course a lot of what they do is governed by how their being "flung." And Mike won't deny that sometimes the downswing is what needs the work. I'll make edits as needed, or comment in posts further down the stream, but I'd like to thank Mike for taking the time to comment. I think we/I graded out pretty well, and if nothing else, I think maybe I'll do more to share and talk about some more advanced player "stuff" in the coming weeks, months, years.
  2. Threads and Articles Basics Big List of Golf Terminology The 'P's (Positions) or 'A's (Alignments) in the Golf Swing General Instructional Stuff "Swing Thoughts" forum "So You Joined TST and Posted a Member Swing" topic. "My Swing" Video Threads RULES - Please Read "Filming Your Golf Swing" blog post "My Preferences (If Forced!)" topic. Instructional Threads 5SK Video Topic A Centered Pivot How to Make a Centered Hip Turn Why Flaring Your Feet at Address Makes Golf Easier Quickie Pitching Video - Golf Pitch Shot Technique Chipping With a Putting Method Putting - DO NOT Accelerate Through the Ball 3 Keys to Better Putting How to Grip a Golf Club, Commonalities of a Functional Golf Grip Shaping the Ball Good Golf Posture (How to Address the Golf Ball) Simple, Specific, Slow, Short, and Success - The Five "S"s of Great Practice The Four Stages of Competence Hitting Up or Down with the Driver in an Inline Pattern How to hit Sand/Bunker Shots Shorter (Probably Better) Swing? Keep the Right Arm Straight Five ways to tune your game, no talent necessary How to Draw the Golf Ball (or How to Stop Slicing) How to Hit a Driver (Hit it Further and Stop Slicing!) How to Effectively Create Lag Simple, Specific, Slow, Short, and Success - The Five "S"s of Great Practice How to "Flight" Your Wedges and Short Irons How to Hit Partial Wedge Shots - Learn your Tweener Yardages Proper Grip Pressure: It’s Firmer Than You Think Videos Key #1 Key #2 Key #3 Key #4
  3. Hi, had an account but not used in a long time and e-mail wasn't in the system so made a new one. It's been an interesting week. I replicated the feeling of greatness an expression coined by Moe Norman and how to replicate Moe swing action. It allows the student to add 100 yards from tee and accuracy along the way. Numbers based on amatuer mid handicap 13-15 with a swing speed of 93 mph and 215y driving. Showed video I am making to student and he went from 220 yards to 300 yards with a 3w! Instruction works out of the box and is the biggest discovery in golf's history. I leave with a teaser trailer what is to come
  4. This will be an odd post to write, and I'm going to ask for some leeway in how you interpret it to give me the benefit of the doubt. This is not a rant, I'm not upset, and this is not aimed at anyone in particular. I, more than anyone else, am aware of my flaws and limitations, and unaware of much of what other people do, and I recognize that. I also stand by the work I've done here on TST, with my students, and with the various other things I've done over the years - training a hundred or so instructors in 5SK, writing a book and making a Lowest Score Wins DVD, the work, time, and energy I've put into traveling to work with experts in biomechanics and other hard sciences, the money I've spent getting "toys" and conducting my own research with them, and so on. Give me a little benefit of the doubt that my mood in writing this is perhaps best described as "mildly disappointed but not at all surprised." That post struck me as appropriate. It's in a thread where @Phil McGleno was responding to @Marty2019 re: Paul Wilson, how much you use your arms and wrists (and how) in the golf swing, etc. While I remain almost 100% convinced that @Marty2019 is "wrong" with his own theory about how he doesn't use his arms as more than connecting his body to the club… (while simultaneously understanding that if that's what he feels he's doing it's a completely different thing altogether)… he's not really going to a chemist and arguing with a pet theory over a chemical reaction. This is true simply because there is no universally accepted truth in golf instruction like we have in basic chemistry. @Marty2019 could cite several other "chemists" that back his theory - "chemists" with years of experience, YouTube videos, DVDs perhaps, websites of their own, and thousands of students. Because there's no rigorous testing or scientific process to determine when someone is a "golf expert," golfers have to rely mostly on perception: does the person seem like they know what they're talking about? Unfortunately, too often, that test fails, simply because it's pretty easy to fall into the trap of something that sounds logical. A charismatic instructor can make you believe a lot of things are true or beneficial when they are not. Add in a dash of golfers who secretly hope to find "the secret" or "that one tip" that will put them over the top, and you have a recipe for disaster: a golfer who will spend time, money, and energy chasing the dream of finally being able to break 80, or par, or hit the ball 270 yards, or sink every putt they look at, or whatever… What can I do about it? Not a whole lot, except to keep trying to hold myself to a high standard, and to educate as many people about the standard to which they should hold their instructor to as well. Golf is not in the age of chemistry, it's still - unfortunately - more like the days of alchemy.
  5. Our discussion in another thread about the consistency of all golfers' swings was very interesting, and enlightening I think for most of us. In the discussion, we agreed that if golf swings were essentially repeating and consistent for all golfers irrespective of skill level, but that results obviously varied significantly across skill levels, there must be some variability somewhere in the poor golf swings that isn't immediately recognizable on standard video. We used the terms "macro" and "micro" to illustrate this; we said all of our swings are consistent on the "macro" level, but that the worse you are at golf, the more inconsistent your swing is at the "micro" level. This got me thinking about whether anyone has studied this, and of course, someone has. And as you might imagine, the studies come from our friends in the UK, the home of golf....appropriately so, I think. This paper is a collaboration of scientists from Leeds University in England and University of Limerick in Ireland. It's not what you might expect from an article on the golf swing....it's highly technical and it isn't easy at first to see how it applies to how we play golf or how golf is taught, but I think it's very interesting reading. I put it here instead of the swing or instruction forums because it's really more a geek thing than a golf thing. But I think this kind of research will someday help us a great deal in showing us how to go about teaching and learning golf. The study looked at the variability from swing to swing for expert golfers (hcp </= 5), and correlated that variability with the variability of outcome of the flight of the ball. For this study, they used ball velocity as the outcome measure. The measure of variability was extremely high tech; a three dimentional motion analysis of multiple points on the body, including two on the head, and several on the upper torso and several more on the legs and feet. The study found that there was no correlation between the variability of the golfers' swings and the variability of their outcomes. In other words, even though each golfer's swing varied from swing to swing with regard to how each body part moved, the variability of these movements did not predict variability of the outcome. Stated yet another way....they weren't able to determine that consistency or lack of it among any specific body part predicts anything about the result of a shot. Read! Enjoy! Talk amongst yuh-selves. Tucker et al (2013) Is outcome variability related to movement variability in golf.pdf
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