toroboy

You obviously don't have the tape. Consensus nonsensus. Thought Nazis. I just go where the evidence leads, sorry. Don't be surprised when your hero-worship turns sour. I shouldn't post because I don't agree? My view is not shared? Threaten me with administration? All I did was view a broadcast and form a heretical conclusion. If I wanted socialism I would watch soccer. Golf was the last bastion of individual freedom and adherence to an honorable code--and the rules are there to enforce the code. This is my last post sorry to ruin your club.

Nice call bobbyg. Just reviewed the tape. If you noticed he pinned that plant to the dirt so it wouldn't return to it's original position. I started out being incensed about the branch vibrating and moving the ball (via another little plant that was moved by the branch) and wind up seeing this clear violation. After review of the tape it had to be Snedeker who kicked the branch after knowing the placement of the ball as he had done a mock address of the ball a few seconds before that. Bottom line---Snedeker got away with one--a big one. If Dustin Johnson is up by 2 strokes he plays 17 completely different.

I could say a lot here regarding the veiled insults but I thank Robato and Rick---you have made my month worth living---just admitting movement of the ball and the possibility of jostling. All the abuse I have received just speculating on the situation tells me that the guys in the studio did not want to create controversy for it is they who have all the angles to see if it was "Sneakeder" or his caddy performing a pre jostle on the limb. But think. Attention was on Lingmerth. Snedeker's ball was found and known and that's when the close up zoom snuck between leaves to view the jostle and ball rotation. It is just a possibility that Snedeker was unaware of this close up when a seemingly inadvertent misstep lands on a ten foot long limb. Seriously, if the ball had not been found there would be no question it was accidental. But c'mon you golfers know what's up. Don't rely on reputational propaganda---yes we heard the great story about Snedeker. But why? Don't' all golfers self report.

It is very hard to discuss something when people feel you have an agenda. All I have is suspicion---and I would say it is something around 20%. 80% that log was hit inadvertently. 4putt, if no one even admits to ball movement of course you can't even graduate to conspiracy or cheating. I could only tell that the ball moved by the rotation of the black numbers on the ball---like reading the stitching on a fastball. Nice classical reference re the toro handle. Maybe I am also just a blowhard.

again. The wandering and lollygagging is what led to suspicion on my part, him looking for an opportunity for averted eyes to tweak the log. Someone hit that log. The ball moved. Who? No one talked about it because no one saw the ball move initially. I thought golf had strict rules which is why I watch it. Camera proof of ball movement I thought still counts. And then, officials review the whole thing including outtakes--even after the tourney. Isn't that a rule? Was this a PGA event?

I don't know how to call it in. I was sure others had seen it move. I am taping the replay and will definitely investigate Snedeker's movements. I think the network will have the answer on unused angles---answers as to the whereabouts of Snedeker when the log vibrated.

join yes. start something no. It went down like this. I saw the limb move and I thought I saw the ball slightly move, and I thought why is anyone even near the limb adjacent to the ball. Just before this I asked my brother " why is Snedeker wandering his ball is right there. " I felt great satisfaction in proving to my brother that the ball moved---after 3 rewinds. My brother is the golfer who suspected nefarious activity. A lot to be gained by stepping on the log to see if it is a movable impediment. Anyway I joined because I just couldn't find any discussion on the web about it even moving--the whole speculation about cheating came later. And yes I do smell.

to 4 putt: yes I am way out there on this. to David: yes, that's exactly the point. The ball was shaken loose of the log by the unknown "stepper". My guess is that it was Snedeker acting like he's helping the other search---and unaware of the camera focused in on the ball at that exact moment. The step and vibration a few minutes prior to the clearing.

That is true. But Snedeker had found his ball and was then ostensibly helping to find Lingmerth's ball. Lingmerth's ball was 20 yards away. Snedeker was the only one near the log---however it is possible for someone to have jumped in and hit the log. The salient point is the next view shows all clean dirt right behind the ball and the log and brush all gone. "Improve you lie, sir." (caddyshack) I have OCD. In that tense situation I would be yelling at people to stay away from that log----the ball microns away from a 6 inch diameter log. In the close up the branch/log shook and the ball rotated. I was surprised when the next view showed a nice clearing---the clearing made while everyone was looking at the Lingmerth situation.

tj I need to respond. I noticed Snedeker "milling around" in the brush after he had discovered his ball. Was the step on a long branch/log inadvertent? What if he saw the ball next to log and needed a "shake loose" maneuver. Other cameras and angles are needed to correlate Snedeker's movements. Remember at that time Johnson had not hit OB yet. I don't think HD is even needed to see this movement. Any DVR will do. It's shocking I know, but in the heat of the moment poor decisions are made.

Thanks John. I was so concerned he was going to loose the tourney. They will add 2 to his score. Mark my words. In that case no harm to him or fedex points.

Just started a new thread. BALL MOVED! Seriously Snedekers's ball move. Check the tapes. See new post under rules. If you thought it moved you are right. Someone hit that big log and the ball rotated about 1/64th of an inch. Replay verifies. Now what is the rule?

In the Canadian open Snedeker's ball moved and I haven't seen any comment. The camera zoomed in on his ball in the debris. At that moment someone out of frame ticked the adjacent log--I presume it was Snedeker and the ball moved----100% sure on this for we replayed it many times on HD. Ball moved. The next time we saw the ball Snedeker had already removed said log and other twigs from area behind ball. What is the rule? Player hits debris either inadvertently or not and ball moves. Ball movement may only have been seen by camera. Same debris is then removed prior to shot. Hole 12. 2-shot penalty or dq since he signed the card? This will be big and maybe you heard it here first.