bobbob

Well I though my statements made it quite clear I wasn't but there is no need to argue any further.

I am surprised at how easy it can be to fool people into thinking you're BB producer. As long as I just post in the Big Break thread and seem interested in stats, that automatically makes me a Big Break producer.

This golf swing kind of looks like Meghan Hardin's--very choppy and her head dips down a lot causing her to have trouble with extensions. I thought Emily's was better though, maybe it was just that swing,

Nice job, Mary....in solo last place out of 139 players after a terrible 86 with 5 bogeys, three double bogeys, one triple bogey, and no birdies. And my two cents: If Jackie played anywhere near her actual abilities, she would have won BB in a landslide. I think she is the real favorite at this point, especially considering she just beat Mary by a full 18 shots and has scoring averages of around 6 shots better than any of the others remaining. (Renee is still a dark horse, though) Here are the overall Big Breaker Results: Jackie Stoetling 68 Selanee Henderson 72 Mallory Blackwelder 73 Sara Brown 73 Shannon Fish 74 Emily Talley 76 Sadena Parks 76 Maiya Tanaka 76 Taylor Collins 77 Blair O'Neal 78 Carling Nolan (Coffing) 80 Lili Alvarez 81 Kristi O'Brien 81 Stefanie Kenoyer 84 Mary Narzisi 86 Cactus tour: Tonya McCall 68-69-72 Nina Rodriguez 69-74-74 Lindsay Aho 70-77-74 McKenzie Jackson 76-73-79 Kylee Duede 79-84-81 And just for fun, here are the LPGA Big Breaker Results: Gerina Piller 72-71 Ryann O'Toole 70-73 Anya Alvarez 73-76

Well I guess some of them are "investing" in their future; maybe they had some savings from their families and will use them to play for a short amount of time (1 year) to see if it works out.... If it doesn't they'll quit. Look at it, from Big Break Atlantis, almost all of the golfers have quit: Marcela: quit golf Selanee: still playing Gloriana: quit Christina: quit Anya: still playing Kelly: quit Allison: quit Natalia: quit Aubrey: quit Zakiya: quit Shannon: still playing Meghan: still playing (horribly) And of these 4 that not have not quit, Anya is the only one really have any sort of success. Meghan is just living off her rich family (plays occasionally on cactus tour but averages like 85 shots), and I'm not sure how the other 2 get by. So to answer you question, if they can't get by, they'll just quit.

"First of all... YES, more full holes for elimination and one immunity challenge. I've seen weeks and weeks of who can hit best at 95 yards, I get it, let's see some golf already!" I agree, but from many sources/past player comments, I believe the elimination challenges are actually more holes than they actually show and they just edit out the holes that don't make a difference. This may also explain why there is never a tie on an elimination challenge. In real golf, two players of similar abilities should tie quite often over a two hole sample. So maybe there are actually like 4 holes and they only show 2 or maybe they actually tied over the first two and then they replaced one of those with the tiebreaker or something like that... "Next: just because someone is winning on some random tour does not mean they are a better player, just playing better at the moment. I've watched Tiger get beat by players far less superior." Umm.....I mean, well, the same could be said of the Big Break I guess; the players faring better are just "playing better" at the moment. But the tour results are better overall indicators of golf game over the course of 36-72 holes than the Big Break. And really, that statement is really meaningless, even I could say I'm a better golfer than Tiger Woods, he just happens to be playing better golf than me. "Also: I have to agree the golf hasn't been that bad... This isn't the pro tour, it's armatures aspiring to be pros and playing under a spotlight.they aren't used to. In addition, I still saw 1 ft chip shots this week, not bad." FYI, all of the players here are pros, and many of them have been for several years.

lol

kylee Duede's results on the Cactus tour this year on very simple courses that average like 5-10 shots easier than Symetra tour courses.... (from most recent to least recent) #11 Legacy / Shriner Pro-Am : 79-84 #10 Ocotillo White/Gold: 83-78-82 #08 Wigwam Blue M/T (2 day): 82-79 #07 Sundance : 84-82-80 #06 Wildfire Palmer/Faldo/Palmer : 72-72-73 #04 Ahwatukee CC: 76-77-76 #02 Sun City CC : 84-80-75 Avg: 78.8 Other than that one 72-72-73 on what seemed to be a very easy course (she wasn't in top-10 and winning score was -14) , all her other results had been terrible.... Just keep in mind that a 79 on the cactus tour is like an 85+ on the Symetra tour.... And many other girls like Kristi, Lindsay, and Tonya have played in thee same tournaments and their averages are like at least 5 shots better.... In hindsight, I'm surprised she actually lasted so long...

http://www.thecactustour.com/2014resultstpp/event11/Stroke.html Today's Cactus tour event results so far... Tonya is currently leading by 6 shots (-7) while other Big Breakers like Nina Rodriguez (-1), Lindsay Aho (+3), and McKenzie Jackson (+5) currently sit in 2nd, T-5, and 7th positions. Kylee Duede is a full 26 shots off the lead through 2 rounds at +19. Now before we all praise Tonya, keep in mind this is a low-level cactus tour event with second and third-tier Big Breakers. None of the ladies she is beating fared very well in Big Break. I'm pretty sure if we brought in a few Symetra tour players, Tonya would be toast. Please do not compare Tonya's 68 to Jackie's or Mary's mid-70s on the Symetra tour--Symetra tour courses are far more difficult than Cactus tour courses, which rarely play over 6000 yards. For example, Shannon Fish has shot numerous rounds in the 60's on the Cactus tour and averages like 70 shots on the Cactus tour but averages a 76.5 on the Symetra tour. But still, if anything, this really shows how bad Kylee is. A 79-84 on the Cactus tour? I can't even imagine what she would shoot on the symetra tour (that is, if she would qualify, and she would not with her current pathetic game)...... You could say that Tonya is just playing "better", but someone who is beating someone else by 26 shots through 2 rounds is just simply a better golfer. Kylee's 83-78-82 last week wasn't very impressive either...

The last tournament was pretty bad but Jackie has been doing decently overall. Atlantis vs Florida is debateble overall in golfing quality. What I don't agree with is the statement "there is no real correlation between success on BB and success on a tour (apparently at any level)." 4 out of the top 5 are the four out of all 12 to qualify for the Symetra tour though intensive Q-school and other series of tournaments. That shows a very, very strong correlation between tournament results and on-show performance. That was how I knew Jackie, Renee, Mary, and Sadena would perform right from the beginning, even though at the time many had doubts about Mary and Renee. Renee and Mary's results haven't been pretty this year, that's true, but at least they qualify for the Symetra tour and are not floundering around on the cactus tour like Kristi, Kylee, Lindsay, and Tonya, struggling to get in even the lowest Symetra tour events. As regards to watching--sure do whatever you want, no one ever forced you to watch... No one ever said the golf on the show was good, I'm just saying relatively speaking the Symetra tour players are doing decently.

Seems like people on this forum are finally beginning to realize how important Symetra tour results and outside results are, hitting a few good shots on the show is not going do you any good in the future and missing a couple of shots here is not going to affect your future either. Symetra tour results are the best indicator of a player's abilities and the oppurtunities they will get. I have been advocating this since day 1, its a pity that we had to wait so long until basically only the Symetra tour players (Mary, Sadena, Jackie, Renee) remained on the show to realize this. But yes, I will agree that this seasons players will pretty bad, usually a season will have like 6-8 decent Symetra tour players wile this season only had 4 players qualfied to play the Symetra tour, where all the top-tier Big Breakers' play. Also, I said she may have been a bully, may have been a bully depending on whether GC misconstrued her actions to make her look like a bully. Again, I was advocating for Renee since day 1 because I was one of the few that actually looked at the fact that she was one of the 4 who played on the Symetra tour.

In the preview for the next episode, it's kind of obvious that their having two head-to-head matches, the winner of each goes on to the finale, the two losers are eliminated. This penultimate episode format has also appeared on Big Break Mexico, Big Break Indian Wells. To be honest, I'm not a big fan of this format because it kind of restricts who is eliminated/who is moving on. Since the promo shows Jackie vs Mary in one match and Fiamma vs Renee in the other, it means that the final match will not be between one of these duos. I'm 99% sure based on the comments from the preview that the final 2 are Jackie and Renee. Fiamma, who is going against Renee, says "of course I wanted to win..." in the post round interview. Someone who just won doesn't say that, leading me to believe that Renee won her match. That doesn't surprise me either, Fiamma is clearly outmatched. Jackie also said something along the lines of "everyone thought I was safe, I wasn't" Honestly, that sounds like something someone who won says. If she lost, she would be saying "I knew I still had a chance....." Again, GC may be misportraying these girls but that is what I believe.

Yes, Sadena was eliminated, but I actually kind of like the fact that Mary chose Sadena for the elimination challenge. I think it showed guts on her part, even though she clearly knew and stated that Fiamma was the "weaker link". Regardless of whether she picked Sadena because of her friendship with Fiamma or if she wanted to take out a stronger player and have a "real match" with Sadena like she said she did, kudos to her for winning the match. Throughout the whole season she emphasized that she thought Sadena was beatable and she said that numerous times throughout the season and she actually showed that today. Yes, she may be a bully, but today she showed that she can still play. (kind of)

The overall average of 76.45 just isn't going to cut it out here. Also, this seems to be a "fluke" performance by Mary, her other results outlined below. The fact that she needs a "fluke" performance just to average 75 says it all....not impressed. Below I compare Jackie, Renee, and Mary over this tourney and the last two. (Sadena did not play them) Mary's last three tournaments+this one: Florida's Natural Charity Classic 80-80 IOA Golf Classic 75-84 This Tournament 77-73 Jackie: Florida's Natural Charity Classic 70-70-71 IOA Golf Classic 70-74-73 This Tournament 75-77 Renee: Florida's Natural Charity Classic 79-76 IOA Golf Classic 74-71-77 This Tournament 80-82 Overall Avg Mary 78.2 Jackie 72.5 Renee 77.0 Clearly, Mary's performance was a streak and even factoring this good performance her scores are still far worse than Jackie and even Renee, who has played pretty poorly in her own right.

Anya Alvarez 71 Emily Talley 72 Selanee Henderson 72 Jackie Stoelting 75 Taylor Collins 75 Shannon Fish 76 Stefanie Kenoyer 76 Mary Narzisi 77 Mallory Blackwelder 78 Blair O'Neal 78 Maiya Tanaka 79 Sadena Parks 80 Sara Brown 80 Renee Skidmore 80 Lili Alvarez 80 Avg Score: 76.6 not good... But the courses are harder than the Cactus tour courses, that's for sure.

Emily Talley is actually a decent player on the Symetra tour, she has had far better results than just about every Big Breaker currently playing on the Symetra tour, maybe except for Jackie. She seems to be one of those players who doesn't handle pressure very well though, her play on Big Break was very sub-par although her team scraped away with victory because Doleman just downright didn't know how to play golf. Kind of reminds me of Rick Cochran, actually. Rick is actually having some success on the PGA Tour Latinoamerica--he has had three second place finishes ( in 150-player fields ) in like 5 tournaments.

Sorry, but some of the players on that list have played very few events or have never even played a Symetra tour event at all.... For example: Fiamma played one event 2 years ago Kristi never played a Symetra tour event Meghan Hardin never played a Symetra tour event McKenzie Jackson never played a Symetra tour event Kelly Villareal never played a Symetra tour event I really beginning to doubt some of the things the Symetra tour is releasing. First the bad stats, then this....

Emily Talley is actually a decent player on the Symetra tour, she has had far better results than just about every Big Breaker currently playing on the Symetra tour, maybe except for Jackie. She seems to be one of those players who doesn't handle pressure very well though, her play on Big Break was very sub-par although her team scraped away with victory because Doleman just downright didn't know how to play golf. Kind of reminds me of Rick Cochran, actually. Rick is actually having some success on the PGA Tour Latinoamerica--he has had three second place finishes ( in 150-player fields ) in like 5 tournaments.

Update: Sadena has shot 44 on her front nine. (+8) OUCH! How is she going to win Big Break like this?

Nice going Sadena.......+6 through 6 holes..... Mary shot 77, Renee shot 80, yeah, its not pretty.....

A) Yes, but that still doesn't account for the big gaps like Anya's..... And does Renee really drive the ball 179 yards? Does Lili Alvarez drive it 182? B) Sure, that's pretty short, but Big Break fudges with the yardages very often and I wouldn't be surprised if the yardage was actually not 150. And even so, someone who hits a 5-h 150 would still drive it further than 179, probably around 210, 215. I'm not saying Renee's a long hitter, but I don't think shes 90 yards shorter than Sadena. Yeah, Sadena is longer than her competitors, but not by much, maybe 20 yards longer than Jackie/Mary/Shannon and 40 yards longer than Renee. I think the stats from 2013 are probably a better indicator of actual driving distances. This year maybe they messed up with stats or maybe at a particular tournament that Jackie/Shannon/Renee/Mary played but Sadena did not they gave all the players "0" or a drive or something..... And lol at the putts for GIR stats. They don't know what they're doing..... And is anyone following this week at the Symetra tourney? I know Jackie, Renee, Sadena, and Mary are playing, along with quite a few from past seasons.

The driving stats are not very accurate at all, if you know how they work....... (They are only based off of 2 drives/round and if you happen to mis-hit it or decide to hit a 3w or hybrid instead of driver, your yardages will be lower.) They only thing this tells us about Sadena is that she is aggresive and hits driver often. I really don't think Mary's driving distance (using a driver) is really 217 yards, Shannon Fish's is 216 Yards, Taylor Collins's is 195 yards, Lili Alvarez's is 182 yards, and Renee's is 179 Yards. (Yes, 179 YARDS) These statistics would be ridiculous if you used them to actually use them to predict one's driving distance. Renee's actual driving distance is probably around 230, she just happened to hit a shorter club on the holes that they were measuring the distances on. Another example that clearly shows the problems with judging a player's distance by driving average statistics is Anya Alvarez, who is splitting her time between the LPGA and Symetra tours. She is 1st in LPGA driving distance (no joke) at 279 Yards, while she only ranks 55 th in Symetra driving distance with 224 Yards. It is impossible her distances actually vary that much because they are supposed to be an "average". She probably hit a shorter club in the Symetra events when they measured distances, while she hit driver in the LPGA event(s). Thus, it is absolutely ridiculous that you guys are using these stats to judge players' distances.

"tough holes" So far, they have played or been on about ten par 4's this season, and the longest one we've seen was 348 yards. The average distance was like 320 yards. I am quite familiar with the courses they are playing, and they are playing the shortest kids tees on the easiest holes on the golf course. An 18 hole course from their tees would be like 5500 yards. Plus, Golf Channel is known to fudge the yardages, so I wouldn't be surprised to see it play even shorter than that. Keep in mind the course is only 6500 yards from the tips, and 6500 is the average LPGA course yardage. They are playing the forward tees. Yes, there is *some* talent, but just not very much of it. I'll be honest, the golf is overall better than the golf on Big Break Atlantis, but it is still very far from decent. The disparity between the good players and the bad players was just way too big, making it very easy for viewers to predict the results.

To be honest, I really don't think there is or was any sort of clique whatsoever. Mary was just being nice toward Fiamma so that Fiamma wouldn't pick her. And plus, even without Mary's persuasions, if I were Fiamma, I would still have picked Kylee. She's hit some terrible shots (missing the green 30 yards left from 100 yards comes to mind) and her Cactus tour results have been terrible. I think over the last couple of episodes, Mary's personality has kind of changed because she realizes that its important to be friends with some of the others and this may help her on the show. For example, in addition to her actions with Fiamma, she tried joking Jackie and Renee that Kylee was crazy and maybe that would gain their favor in future episodes. She seems to particularly hate Kylee, however.

lol @ Mary saying to Kylee "I think its a bold if statement. I don't think it really means anything. If anything, your trying to fool yourself into being confident rather than intimidate someone else" seems ironic...