craps

So, what do you call these?

Your thoughts on this subject does make some sense but how can one argue with the great Albert Einstein"s E=MV2. If more mass(weight) + velocity is channeled, more energy will be generated at impact thus producing more distance. Oversize is not far from normal size. Besides those MB clubs that you recommended above are made bigger than normal. The new HOGAN FORTH WORTH 15 irons is like mid-size. So I think MB clubs does move in the direction that I mentioned earlier. I have a single Tommy Aaron MB 7 iron which has a large face. Some old guy gave it to me when I was asking him about golf in his farm in Kentucky 20 yrs ago. That was the club that he asked me to practice with. I did not return the club to him but until today, I still use it. It is so easy to set up to the ball because it has a square sole with a very straight leading edge. Its made by Spalding. Until today I can't find any expensive clubs that was close to it.

Just curious, why not make oversized blades with muscle backs no offset? Iam sure a lot of low handicappers would buy it. Are the new BEN HOGAN FORT WORTH IRONS heading in this direction?

So far, I got varieties of info. Some say it is a cosmetic thing, some say it helps to get the ball airborne, some says it helps square the club face. Keep them coming. What's next?

If offset do good, why is it so little? Why not more??

What makes them hard to hit?

Trying to find a set of clubs with leading edge of club face directly in line with shaft. No offset at all. Its like every club built the same as a pitching wedge. One reason is for lining up with more ease. Am I again talking more craps?

would rotating the club face through the shaft and not through hand rolling change the pitch? Yes it does. Most evidently is the driver. You really don't want to forward your left hand more outwards of your body to get a square face at address. So one way is to grip weaker another is to roll both wrist towards right. Do you agree your most comfortable grip will enable you to swing more on plane. So would you let your clubs PLAY YIOU OR YOU PLAY YOUR CLUBS? How about twisting the club head clockwise to get a square face. That way you have your most comfortable grip and a squre club face. This would be possible if club fitting accessories were to have joystick like hosel that can rotate 360 and one only need to get fitted for each club with their most desirable grip position.

imagine this. Your desire grip gives you a closed club face. Now without changing the loft of the club, what do you do?

Just wondering whether there is such an apparatus for measuring the pitch of a shaft in relation to the club face. Meaning a golf club with a joystick like hosel. The reason I am asking is a lot of times I felt very comfortable with a certain grip but refuse to turn the club to make it square to the target and how I wish the shaft could be pitched so that the club face will be square. I know I can turn the club and regrip it but it will feel different because the different pitch will cause an uneven feeling in the hands. Am I talking CRAPS here!!!

This I somewhat disagree. I am in the music teaching profession. Being an instructor, I always allow my students to interpret on their own and guide them to better their performance. No 2 golfers swing alike. If I have a fundamental flaw sure I will correct if it does me better but to adhere to a method , you will find yourself more and more confused. Happens to tour pros too. To me a good instructor does not change your swing but correct or better it. That why we have so many unorthodox but successful golfer. Have you looked at Raymond Floyd's swing. He broke most of the fundamental rules. What is important is you must own a swing unless a total beginner.

Very well said and you are 100% right in your explaination and I totaly agree but maybe people don't really understand what I am trying to express and misinterpreted my post. Imagine if I were to ask you to throw a ball into a trash can 10 yards away. You will miss a plenty. But if the trash can is 2 feet away, you will get it every time . The point iis do something that is highly repeatable and if it is faulty, at least be consistent. With modern club fitting one can have his clubs bend to compensate his swing. All pros do then why not us. My take is if we do a full swing , we tend to HIT because of the urgency to get to the ball but if we do a 3/4 swing we can accelerate to the ball and that take the hit out. When we don't hit we will feell in control. This is my honest experience. II am not implying that don't go for golf instruction. Before I go I need to find my swing and have the pro perfect it. If I totally don't own a swing, I will feel very mechanical trying to swing to the so-call right golf swing. Dies this make sense?

Wow! These 2 guys looked so IN CONTROL of their swing. So a full shoulder turn means a full swing in your definition. Then we are not on the same page. A 55 year old man like me with a frail body can't do full turns. That is why I moved my target 3 inches ahead. That's imaginary though. I make sure I compress the ball and still accelerate. Thanks for the photos. My swing looks somewhat like these but with a lesser turn and a steeper swing.

I think I roughly know what I will encounter with a proper lesson because I have seen people taking lessons. Conventional swing in my terms means one piece takeaway, then when club reach waist height, fully cock your wrist and hinge the club, Turn shoulders 90 degrees and hips 45 degrees. Initiate downswing with a little bum of the left hip. Drop hands into the slot and supinate hands back to compress the ball and then rotate hands to get to the full follow through position. TOO MUCH FOR ME. by the way if one were to bow left wrist and cock right wrist before impact like Jordan Speith, there will be no more flipping. Just my observance.

Well modern is just a name. My guess is because of the modern equipment in golf , with the right flex in the golf shaft, one can actually play decent golf with a compact swing. You do agree a compact swing IS NOT A FULL SWING.

I am sure you guys are aware of 'the modern swing' , a swing even Tiger Woods is trying to change to. The modern swing is a swing where there is lot of connection in the swing so that a less athletic person can perform easily and get great consistency. It is a 3/4 compact swing with a lot of emphasis on set up. Its like setting up Iron BryonBryon.Once it is setup all you need to do is press a button. It involves the proper grip, the proper stance with right hand very close to body for the elbow to bend towards L shape. Its like locking all the gears in place in a machine. The REAL swing starts when club head reaches hind leg in downswing. That is where what Ben Hogan said that he wished he has 3 right hands. The club head accelerate as if the ball is 3 inches in front. I don't see a loss in distance with this type of swing. What I find is this type of swing cures OVER THE TOP, cures DROP HANDS INTO THE SLOT and cures flipping. I am not condemning the conventional swing but if you are not athletic or flexible, it too difficult to execute. It promotes a lot of separation and timing is hard to master. In short, there is NO MORE FULL SWING IN MY GOLF SWING AND THAT TAKES A LOT OF BURDEN OFF. This swing don't require one to roll over the hands to the finish. Its something like a Zach Joohson type of finish.

I think chipping if doing right teaches one NOT TO FLIP AT IMPACT. If you do a " bigger chip', it will actually lead you to swing with your arms. The difference is shiort chip require a very firm wrist, but a half swing require you to hold thethe club lightly and let the wrist hinged naturally during backiswing and back to firm when club head passes hind leg to avoid flipping. Isn't this right?

Maybe I misused the term drills. I tried a lot of drills. I looked at the mirror and videos of myself. They are all perfect especially the drop into the slot drill. What slot? When you drop the hands like the drill suggested you will prone to flip your hands at least I did. What I am really implying here is pre- setting ones hands and body at address so that the only swing thought is move both hands up and down.

High handicapper trying to get some light. I am convinced that the "natural instinct" swing of any beginner is a faulty swing. Over the top, casting, lifting and not turning, flipping etc. are all natural moves, but are bad for a golf swing. I read a lot of instruction books, you-tubes and found that although most of the info given were"right" for golf, but most likely, they will not work for an individual. Drills are useless cos' everybody would perform drills with 100% accuracy but when its time to put the total package together, they will fall apart. Drills are more like check points or information of the positions associated with the golf swing, but its tough to grove those feeling in the swing. Furthermore what about "discover your own swing" like Jim Furyk, Zach Johnson or even the great Ben Hogan. What I found is no matter what style of swing one has to perform, THE CLUB HEAD HAS TO COMPRESS THE GOLF BALL AT IMPACT AND SQUARE TO THE TARGET. With that in mind, I asked myself, WHY NOT LEARN THE GOLF SWING BACKWARDS? Start with chipping by holding a cocked wrist back to impact, then a 10 o'clock swing. Notice how the body and arms will react and manufacture a swing from there. Am I right progressing this way?