ChrisWev

Thanks for sorting the posts/ images out. As far as the key system goes: 1: Used to sway all onto back foot (so head moved), don't do that now so pretty sure this is covered 2: 70% there I would say, this is a bit of a by product of 1? 3: I think I might flip with the 5i, and 6i, less so with other clubs, never really thought about this, my pro has never mentioned it. 4: Think I'm better at this than no 3! 5: nope

Hey I'm open to ideas :beer: Rather than post in the other thread ;) (feel free to move the other posts over) Re iron striking and why they appear to be bunching up on GG and on SkyTrak Not sure what is going on, I know some of the 8's and 9's on GG are from the rough so will likely be fliers(190 8I???), skewing the distances. I know I was hitting 144-151 carry with the 7 on gc2 hmt before Christmas with my pro at the range on a decent mat, I would say that might even be 155 now as my strike has improved loads since I stopped the out to in path. I know for certain SkyTrak is under reading my ball speed, I think it's because the surface I hit off is pretty solid and the bounce is effecting strike (or my strike is moving the SkyTrak effecting the reading). I'm going to try it down a range with a decent mat(sitting on concrete) and from the grass at my course and laser it. I carried (2/3) past the pin from the tee off the deck on the par 3's the other day and the other plugged pin high, which according to my gapping should have been 10-15y short and rolled on to the flag(which I lasered). This mat/ suspected movement of the unit might also be effecting launch angle numbers. I've heard pro's launch at impact is lower but have masses of spin which increases the spin loft? None of my numbers get above 4700rpm even with the wedge, and I hit 5 down with that I think. Again this might be something to do with my mat or the low spin Bridgestone E7 I was using.

Thanks Erik, I've put this into another thread, so you can delete the irrelevant posts if you like as it's gone by the wayside ;-)

Yeah, I couldn't figure it out but then I had a hallelujah moment, I set my driver up mid toe(as I hit the heel otherwise), 3w just in from the toe, same as 3hy but don't with my 5 or 6. This is probably pushing my strike to the heal and is why these are the only clubs that don't draw(gear effect and get a crap strike)! I can guarantee my smash factor is probably really low. I would have noticed that with face tape but didn't want to effect the gapping and testing of the spin! Looking forward to seeing what happens, I'll try it tomorrow. If that doesn't fix it I'll probably look at a combo set for the new clubs, or get a 3 and 5hy and just make myself hit he 6i well. Sometimes the 6 absolutely flies on the course and I hit my 5i 200y total once last week (so it must be in there somewhere). I've just got no concept of swing weight with the putter(alignment is half decent, they either stop just short like they would go in, or pass just on the high side but too fast), think I just need to do a solid week of 5ft, 10ft and 15ft putts which I will probably do when the weather is crap. Got all wooden floors at home so can't even do it there, think I need a putting mat. How do people control weight with the putter? Do they actively make sure they take the putter back the same distance for a set length, adjusting slightly for gradient etc(like with a 50% wedge shot etc), or just feel it out (I can't do this)? Or just use muscle memory and engrain a 10 footer into the memory bank?

Hi all I'm going to use this thread as my progress to break 80 (on my home par 72 course, SSS 71), hopefully by the end of next summer and what I need to do to achieve this. If anyone is interested or has any comments. Basically I started playing properly last summer and had about 10 rounds prior to this over about 10 years. I was injured all of winter (crushed nerve in knee from playing hockey,still recovering) so got back playing again late spring. I started this year playing at around 22-23 HCP which I've calculated from the rounds I've played this year. I was sat at about 18 HCP for the last month or so but this is looking at about 15.5 now, so I've altered my profile to reflect this. I basically count every round I play and work that out as if it was 18 holes, ie if I'm 1 under HCP for 9 hole and I leave, I'll this down as 2 under for 18 as I think this should be fairly accurate. Most rounds are 12-18 holes, depends when it gets dark as I nearly always play after work. Most of my rounds I'm in a rush to get started so tend not to warm up or practice any putting (I know , I know ), so usually my first few holes are pretty bad, then I get into a decent rhythm and play well, then I get cocky and mess up. Putting costs me quite a few shots as I never practice this as I had been spending most of my time trying to correct my path from being 10 degrees out to in (I play field hockey, so this "was" natural). Obviously with this swing style I was fading and slicing. I've had some lessons and worked on path and now I'm about 5 degrees in to out, which is where I think I want to be. I strike the ball much better and now have a draw with most clubs, with my bad shot being a push. Sometimes I hook with driver, maybe 1-2 per round. I would rate my self compared to what I percieve most 15-20 HCP players to be, which I play with most often: Putting: Very Poor (average 2 putts per round, but considering I chip well this is too high, PPGIR is 2.3 for last 10 rounds) Chipping: Very Good Pitching: Average Iron striking: Good (up to 6i) Iron distance: Average Driver striking: Average (hit out of the heel if I don't grip down half the shaft) Driver distance: A good strike can ususally go 230-240 total, but I've had quite a few go to 270 in the last few rounds Bunkers: Poor Course management: Poor (I go for everything) Originally posted this in another thread, but it's more suited here: Actually I've just noticed something on Game Golf with regards to ball striking, a lot of my irons seem to be bunching together over the last 5 rounds, should I read much into this? These are totals and I tend to grip down on some to get yardages which might account for some variations, my course is flat so none of these are really hitting downhill/ uphill. Left is last 5 rounds, right is all rounds My 5i is very poor, I think I might have been hitting it out of the heel (I don't use my 4i). I've just bought a SkyTrak amd carried out some gapping on 4 July: My ball speed doesn't seem to increase much between my 7i-5i and the loft doesn't change much either, any idea why this would be? As a whole I would say these are all under reading by about 5%, compared to my last set of numbers from my lesson on GC2 HMT and what I see on the course (think it might be to do with the mat I hit off but some are saying it's software issue with the latest Skytrak release). Club speed is "estimated" on SkyTrak, but it's well under as it basically works this out on more than a max smash factor from the ball speed (which I doubt I get). My 7i club speed is ususally 89-93 mph on GC2 HMT. Driver speed was about 105mph, but was tested a while ago. I've played hockey as a striker for 18 years, and basically been belting the ball all this time, so should have plenty of speed in my locker, just need to be more eficient with it. My gapping averages above are based on taking about 15-20 shots, taking the top 2-5 out (depending on how many shots are hit) and the ones that are left below the select 5. An interesting thing on there is the spin numbers for the Bridgestone E7, they never seem to change , not sure if this is me or the ball but the numbers are the same on GC2 HMT. I'll be swapping ball soon. My ping G20 irons were fit by measurement last year (I didn't hit them) and all other clubs are off the shelf. I plan to get fit for new clubs next month. Good news is my last two rounds (when playing off 17) were +8 off 10 holes (had 5 pars in a row, before getting cocky) without warming up, and a +8 off 9 holes (which would adjust to +7 off 9 holes as far as Congu handicap goes). I should have been 1 under par off 4 holes here. 3 putted the first from 15 feet (didn't have a clue about the speed of the greens, very slow!) and missed a 4 foot birdie putt on 4 :( Both of these rounds would have been me playing to roughly 14 HCP with CONGU.

This is probably for it's own thread (think I'll repost it if I can): Actually I've just noticed something on Game Golf with regards to ball striking, a lot of my irons seem to be bunching together over the last 5 rounds, should I read much into this? These are totals and I tend to grip down on some to get yardages which might account for some variations, my course is flat so none of these are really hitting downhill/ uphill. Left is last 5 rounds, right is all rounds My 5i is very poor, I think I might have been hitting it out of the heel (I don't use my 4i). Some gapping I carried out on 4 July: My ball speed doesn't seem to increase much between my 7i-5i and the loft doesn't change much either, any idea why this would be? As a whole I would say these are all under reading by about 5%, compared to my last set of numbers on GC2 HMT and what I see on the course (think it might be to do with the mat I hit off but some are saying it's software issue with the latest Skytrak release). Club speed is "estimated" on SkyTrak, but it's well under as it basically works this out on more than a max smash factor from the ball speed (which I doubt I get). My 7i club speed is ususally 89-93 mph on GC2 HMT. Gapping averages are based on taking about 15 shots, taking the top 2-5 out (depending on how many shots are hit) and the ones that are left below the select 5. An interesting thing on there is the spin numbers for the Bridgestone E7, they never seem to change , not sure if this is me or the ball but the numbers are the same on GC2 HMT. Good news is my last two rounds were +8 off 10 holes (had 5 pars in a row, before getting cocky) without warming up, and a +8 off 9 holes (which would adjust to +7 off 9 holes as far as Congu handicap goes). I should have been 1 under par off 4 holes here. 3 putted the first from 15 feet (didn't have a clue about the speed of the greens, very slow!) and missed a 4 foot birdie putt on 4 :( Both of these rounds would have been me playing to roughly +14 level.

You may be right but to be honest I would disagree (as would my pro and the people I play with), for the reasons below, sorry if this gets long but I like to provide an explination to my reasoning: Don't read too much into my HCP on here, it's come down about 5 strokes in the last 2 month and the Congu HCP system is slow to react to fast improvement. My handicap is including never practising putting and bunker shots as I'm not prioritising these at the minute. I never warm up either and don't take mulligans etc. As far as looking at my iron play goes, I've only played with one other person in the 12+ region who hit their irons as cleanly as I do, but my swing tempo varies quite a bit. Pretty much everyone I play with (who I don't know) says "no way are you a 17/18, you would be lucky to be playing off 15", then the see how bad I am at putting and in bunkers (which are nearly always wet, which I've never practised). Over here it's like everyone gets mad when their handicap gets cut, to me that's a big positive. My putts average is 2 per hole for the last 5 rounds, which doesn't sound like the end of the world but considering I chip very well for my leve, this is very bad. I can chip one to 3ft and putt that, but anything from 6ft is 80% a 2 putt, and anything more than 20ft is 50% a 3 putt. This probably costs me 4 shots a round on it's own. A few lessons on putting and some time on the practice green could get me to mediocre putting within a week but I find it boring as hell, so not interested in that yet. I very rarely hit my irons fat or thin, It just looks like I hit the ball low, but this is probably due to me messing with my path and closing the clubface taking loft off (I wouldn't know this without the launch monitor data) . A lot of my irons hit the front of the green and just run all the way through it, the ball I've been using hasn't helped either, but this is getting changed. As far as my handicap went I would probably rate myself in this region: Driver - 15 3 wood off the deck - 12 3 Hybrid - 23 - I don't like this club, feels to whippy Irons - 10 Chipping and pitching inside 30 yards - 9 Pitching - 30-80 yards - 15 Putting - 36 Bunkers - 22 if dry (36 if wet, literally never practiced this ever) I do plan on getting my putting sorted (probably over winter), but I wan't to get my distance and consitant loft with my irons sorted first. I'm going to get LSW when I'm interested in playing more comps and this will be crucial for that, as I know my course management is terrible. At the minute I play like tin cup and pretty much go for every shot as I like to try new things and keep it interesting. If I implement the above a can see myself breaking 80 early next summer, I had 5 pars in a row in my last round so it's definitely in there. I would be happy to recieve any comments on the above, whether you think this is the right way to go or not? I just do what I think is best for me and to keep me interested but always appreciate outside opinion. But I'm quite stubborn, as you can probably tell

They look good on all the charts but they're pricey new, and not common in the UK so I doubt I could get them cheap or a "lakeball" variant.

Fair enough Mike, I might look into a little bit more later down the line.

I don't really want to use Callaway as they change balls more than I've had hot dinners, which means I would probably have to pay full price for them and would be hard to stick to the same ball. Snell are unavailable in the UK. I'll be trying Project A, Velocities might be more of a distance ball. I don't mid a higher launch as my ball flight is pretty low I think, so I'll be giving these a shot. Under that theory we should all play with pebbles or range balls? I'd go as far as to say that the club is the thing that will have the least effect on the players game as far as the difference between manufacturers goes. From all the reviews there is never more than a couple of yards difference with clubs, and that's normally down to stronger lofts and varying shafts.

Not a lot of love for the Titleist, which is surprising considering it's a four piece ball. I't's not going to be cheap to make. I'm going to try the Bridgestone E5 out too, something deterred me form this but can't remember what it was. It might have been the swing speed it's recommended for. I know it's a two-piece ball but if it's "almost" as good as the others it's certainly worth a shot, at about 40% cheaper price. The E5 could be the stepping stone whilst I'm still improving quickly and still prone to loosing a few. Bizzarely when playing on my own I lose a lot more balls from basically not watching where they go until the ball stops moving, or losing them in the sun, rather than smashing them OOB or in the water.

Is your club actually digging into the deck? Is the ground very soft? What happens on the firmer surfaces or at the range? There should be enough bounce on your 7/8/9 and PW as these are normally stock as far as I'm aware. A low bounce Gap/ Lob wedge or something would be a different matter mind. You almost have to be coming in steep, or basically you might just be leaning over too much or the clubs are too long? Try gripping down half an inch or so and see how this effects things? The ball may also be slightly too far back in your stance or weight too far forward. If you're hitting good shots with big divots this might not be a massive problem (one of the better guys may know). Loads of tour players take big divots in soft ground, just look at the state of the fairways on the afternoon in the masters in the lay up areas, big divots all over the place. I pro with a launch monitor would tel you what you're doing instantly, or even a face on swing vid in the "My swing" forum would help?

When you say bad shot, what happens? What club(s) are problematic? Where does your divot start and finish? Before the ball at the ball or just after? I'm no expert but: Sounds to me like you're coming down too steep, bottoming out your swing arc too early (and probably hitting it fat) or you're using wedges with not enough bounce in soft turf. If you're mostly striking the ball first and then the turf with your irons then you're probably not too far off, you might just be swaying back on to your right for your bad shot (for a right hander).

What do you do for driver tees? They're like gold dust around the tee box!

Thanks for the replies fellas. Not to detract from the thread but please don't take my comment as any kind of criticism or lack of understanding (I've read a lot of the 5SK thread, but have not "implemented" it as such, so certainly not criticising something I've not done, it just seems a sort of rigid structure. I agree I may not fully understand it, how could I). The 5SK idea does seem pretty simple to understand, but if each one has another 5 points to it then it becomes less simple? It cant be both ways. I'll leave it at that anyway as I don't want to veer off on a tangent . For me personally I react much better to numbers being put in front of me and making an effort to change them (through various sources/ ideas) rather than being told do this and do that etc. I sometimes react ok to trying to "feel" like I'm doing something, but not all the time. That's why any lesson I ever have in the future will be using a launch monitor, which all of the guys I wach are very keen on. End of the day it's "horses for courses", everyone learns in different ways. I've had to instruct various things over the years and what seems to me to being key to being a decent instructor is being able to adapt to who is being taught and getting the most out of them.

Basically I'm going to start with this as my bible: http://www.golfdigest.com/images/equipment/2014-05/eqsl32-hot-list-ball-spin-rate-chart.jpg My only worry with the Project a is the extra driver spin (which most don't want), this might be hard to keep in the fairway which makes the bonus of the ball (the high spin) become negligible from the rough, with less spin due to less friction on the clubface from grass/ water etc. Saying that the ball will probably launch higher to counteract that a bit. This is all totally give and take and the way I see it, unless you pay the price it's going to be: Hard ball: Low spin, good driver distance, less hook/slice, approach shots are hard to factor due to the fact the ball is going to be bouncing towards the hole (ie not much control over length) Med Ball: Med spin, average distance with driver, bit more wayward with the drives, less roll on greens Soft Ball: Harder to control with driver but if you hit the fairway, the shot to green should stick (if you hit that too). I'm going to try: Project (a) NXT tour Z-Star or Z-star XV

Thanks for the response Erik. About the physics stuff, I totally get that (I used to be an aircraft avionics engineer, and is fairly similar to rotors in gyroscope theory etc), and know that the ball only rotates/ spins on one axis, unless there are outside influences. It's what they're calling "back spin" isn't exactly termed correctly, but I know what you mean, you know what I meant and most understand what is meant when the term "back spin" and "side spin" is used. Spin access doesn't get used a lot as I would expect most don't have the mental ability to understand it. Totally agree that you you can't reduce side-spin without reducing backspin, ie the spin axis is both intertwined. I can understand how spin properties can change for driver and wedges though, this is basically due to the 3/4 cores and how the ball reacts differently at certain speeds/ compression etc. Hence why low spinning drives (at 150mph ball speed) and good backspin with wedges and on and around the greens (20-90mph bs?) are plotted on all the robot the charts. Sidespin and spin axis shouldn't matter too much with the more lofted clubs due to the D-Plane. Ie I'm not going to be hooking a wedge. Sorry about the multiquote, I was using my phone and it's not ideal to do that.

Thanks for the other comments, I won't quote them all but yeah with shipping the gamers would be pricey and not worth it. The snell ball looks very good, but as always in the UK we get restricted amounts of items at higher costs :( The TM Project (a) looks good, along with the Brigestone B330-S, B5, Chrome Soft and NXT Tour S, I've also seen a deal on Z-Star XV's too

I liked the sound of this, it gets mentioned a lot but you just don't get Top Flight golf balls in the UK any more. The only ones you see are practise balls or battered range balls.

Thanks but that's not going to be common in the UK unfortunately, the numbers do look good though Thanks but they are not going to be common in the UK unfortunately, the numbers do look good though

Of course there is, all spin axis is is a combination of the two and is why GC2 HMT lists figures for back spin and side spin and a figure for the combined "spin axis". I know what you mean though, but some balls list eliminating side spin on all shots, reduce back spin on long shots but maintaining back spin on wedges and around greens, which I find hard to believe. Surely has to be give and take to a degree? Spin access is the somewhat middle ground of the ratio between backspin and side-spin, which tilts the axis through a complex calculation (which I don't know), the ball manufactures won't list anything to do with spin axis on their sites as most won't understand it.

That's excellent, cheers :) I think the ball change will knock a couple of shots off, along with some putting work, I'll get there, it's just a case of when. August might be pushing it mind :) I'm going to change to using my game balls to practise with also as it's probably not helping me much using the ones I find, which can be anything from range balls, rocks, Pro V1's and balls with no dimples

I've found a fair bit of robot data but not much current for this year, but I do have this from 2013 which is very handy: http://www.golfwrx.com/forums/topic/838872-2013-hot-list-balls-spin-rate-chart/ In the mid range these look good: NXT Tour-S Hex Chrome Hex Chrome+ E5 Rocketballz Urethrane On another note it really goes to show how much better the top line balls are....

Thanks for the response :) I've started to put together a list and going to gradually narrow it down, that's on there. Think the Q-Star is the Normal two piece AD333, I've also go the AD333 tour on the list which is the three piece version but a little more pricey. I play with a lot of wedges and will carry a 64 for the foreseeable future as I like loft myself (quite happily sacrifice my 4I for the 64), but would rather only use that when I need to (which is pretty often in all honesty), so ideally want the spin so I can check the ball with my new 60 which will be my "go to" wedge. The good thing with the Srixons AD333's/ Z Stars and Bridgestones 5,6 and 7 is they're very common so I can get "Pearl Grade" lake balls very cheap locally, which are immaculate. Same with titelist NXT tour and NXT tour S which are also on my list.

Sorry for another golf ball thread but I've looked at the others and they're either not current or not suited to what I'm looking for (if it's out there). I'm looking to switch golf ball from the Bridgestone e7. That has served it's purpose of eliminating slice and hook etc but now I want something that will spin more around the greens and feel a bit softer. The e7 has helped me get me from 40 HCP to about 17 by keeping me in play (mostly), although I'm sure I'll be in the 12-15 range by the end of summer. I'm not that fussed on losing a bit of distance as I've gained that over the last few months and there's more to come I think. I'm going to switch my irons (5i to PW), get some Cleveland wedges (RTX 588 2.0 in 50-10, 54 or 56-14, a 60-10 and a 64-8. I plan to re-do my distances for full/ 3/4 and and half etc, as well as getting my distances dialled in with the shorter game. Key to this is I want to be playing the same ball for a while (as re-evaluating distance and stopping power takes a lot of time to do) so I need a common and current golf ball model, that is available in the UK (most US are the same). Basically what I'm looking for (in order of priority, I know it's unlikely to tick all boxes etc): Current and common model golf ball, that won't be discontinued any time soon Preferably 3 or 4 piece (as these seem to be better at various aspects, from what I've read) Not too pricey (forget Pro V'1's or Z-stars as I still loose a few), mid range is fine. My driver S/S is about 103-105 at the minute but I aim to increase that Good stopping power on greens Softer feel Low driver back spin Less side spin Distance I've thought about a golf ball fitting (and will probably try that anyway) but would be slightly reserved about taking just one persons opinion. I've just bought a SkyTrak and will give some of them a test to see what data that throws up, but I understand it's not going to be as accurate as a GC2 and I'm not a robot. Any advice would be very much appreciated. It's a nightmare looking through each manufacturers sites as they pretty much all say they're good at everything (which is pretty much impossible). I'd love to see some robot testing numbers on all of the various balls!