Nwehrman

Actually, I argued that if they were told by a rules official to hit from somewhere else then they shouldn’t have been DQ’ed. I’m not going to argue whether it was a rules official or not because we don’t know. It’s the words of 20 or so people that were at the event against a few people in this post that weren’t. If it was a rules official I stand by everything I’ve said. If it wasn’t, they made the correct decision although it is still an unfortunate situation for the kids.

So you haven't read the article posted earlier in this thread obviously. They literally did exactly what you said they should have, other than playing a second ball. They did have a question. They asked it. It was answered by a rules official. They followed what the rules official said. There was no need for hitting a second ball because there question was answered by someone who SHOULD KNOW. I'll stop posting in this thread because at this point I am just repeating myself to a bunch of people who either have absolutely zero reading comprehension or haven't even bothered to look into what actually happened yet decided to post here blaming the kids anyways. Lastly, the DQ is fine. It's really shitty for the kids but technically they didn't hit from the correct tees, but the rules official is absolutely to blame for that just as much or more than they are.

I have posted elsewhere. I registered a day ago because I thought this would be an interesting topic to discuss but I guess I didn't realize everyone here literally worships the rulebook. I have no affiliation with anyone involved. I live on the other side of the country. You can doubt that the volunteer was a rules official all you want, but when 20ish people that were involved are saying that he was, I'll take their word over your doubts. You got me. I have never played competitive golf. I'm just starting to take the game seriously and trying to get better. I have however played many other competitive sports and in those sports whatever the ref, umpire, or official says, goes. I don't see why golf would be any different but what do I know, apparently I just go out there and hit the ball all over the course.

My lack of understanding? I understand it just fine. Who the hell are they supposed to listen to if not the people in charge of the tournament? Who do you think made this tournaments rule sheet? Probably the tournament officials, you know, the people that told them to hit from where they did. In basketball if you have a question about a rule you ask the ref. In baseball you ask the umpire. The fact that you are okay with a tournament official giving players bad information and then later having them DQ'd is, again, baffling.

@Vinsk So what about the group that was at the blue tees and had a TOURNAMENT OFFICIAL tell them to hit from the reds? Does it get any easier than that? Follow the rule sheet or follow what an official tells you to do. That seems like a pretty shitty situation and the fact that you can't understand that is pretty baffling.

Oh you mean the rules that the tournament official told them? To hit from the reds? That's a really solid post you made.

It is just unfortunate they got DQ’d for this. They weren’t sure so they asked and were told incorrect information by a rules official. Sure you can blame the students some for not playing a second ball, but when a tournament official tells you where to hit from why would that even be a thought? If it is true that one group was at the blue markers and that same official told them to hit from the reds then that is completely on the official. It’s just an unfortunate situation all around but it does sound like the kids handles it well.

After reading through the golf digest article it sounds like the kids did pretty much everything correct. They weren't sure so they asked a nearby coach. The coach asked a rules official just to make sure and that official told them to hit from the red tees. So assuming this is true, and it sounds like almost 20 different coaches and players from multiple schools say it is, then what? Apparently for one of the groups that got disqualified, they were about to hit from the blues when that rules official stopped them and told them they were playing from the reds on that hole.

Alright man. Technically by the rulebook they deserved a DQ. You win. Stupid kids. But we just ignore the fact that a tournament official, in a state tournament no less, didn’t do their job?

If the person in charge of placing the tee markers had put them in the right spot this whole issue would have never happened.

I’m not trying to debate the rules with you guys. I imagine you guys could all recite the rule book in order word for word front to back. Which is great and all but that’s not really my point. It’s a shitty situation for the kids. If I was in charge, the official who was supposed to move the markers wouldn’t have a job. Is that fair? I think we can all agree that if they had moved them to the correct spot there would be no issue but since he didn’t here we are. So the kids get DQ’d for not following the rules of golf, should whoever was supposed to move the markers be fired for not doing their job?

Essentially the officials made a mistake forgetting to move the markers, which in turn caused some of the golfers to make a mistake hitting from the wrong area. The kids get punished by being DQ’d, the officials can hide behind the Rules of Golf. Justify it however you want, it’s not right.

If I am a 16 year old kid and I head up to where I know the markers are supposed to be (and before you quote me and say they are supposed to be wherever they put them, because from what I’ve read they forgot to move them to the intended location) and I don’t see them even after looking around, so I ask an adult, whether it was a Marshall or an official since apparently that’s still up in the air, and they tell me to hit from where I’m at, I would have done the same thing. If you see that as completely my fault then okay, we agree to disagree, but these aren’t pros or even college players. They are high school kids, some of whom probably aren’t even old enough to drive.

So the word of one rules official or the word of coaches, administrators, players and spectators? I know where my money would be but with as quick as everyone in here was to throw the kids under the bus I assume I’m alone there as well. But even if it was just a course Marshall, If he/she is out there for a state tournament should they not have still known? Or at the very least, when asked they should have gotten with someone who knew for sure. It it has been said by many people who would know, that the markers were supposed to be at 172. So if you want to blame the kids for not hitting at the markers that’s fine, but you should probably also blame the people running a STATE TOURNAMENT for not ensuring the markers were in the correct location.

@DeadMan I believe he meant tournament officials moving the markers not the players. When they found out the first 4 groups hits from 172 instead of going and telling the rest to hit from the back they should have moved the markers up to 172 where they were supposed to be in the first place, and had the rest of the groups hit from the same spot. Problem solved.

The official tourney scorecard is where they were supposed to be. They weren't. If they would have seen the blue markers and hit from there they would have been hitting from the right spot per the rules sheet, but the wrong spot per the OFFICIAL scorecard. Someone running the tournament messed up, plain and simple. I don't see how you can possibly blame the kids for that, but apparently I'm alone in feeling that way. The fact that they didn't simply let them re-play the hole from the spot the rest of the groups played or had the rest of the groups play from 172 like they were originally supposed to is beyond me. As for how we know these things, some coaches and people that were at the event have made some posts about it.

I've just recently taken the game up somewhat seriously. Have played all my life but just a round here and there, never consistently. When I decided I wanted to play more and get better, going out and playing 18 didn't really help. I had a bad swing. Hip sway, over the top, couldn't keep my head still, you name it I did (or still do) it. Going out and hitting a ball all over a course isn't going to help if you have a bad swing. Not saying don't play, but don't expect your swing to fix itself out on the course. The driving range won't really help either if you don't know what you are doing wrong. Best advice I could give is like many others said, get yourself a lesson or more from a pro and try to understand the swing more and get a decent swing down. When you have a better understanding of what you need to be doing it is easier to make improvements at the range as opposed to out on the course in my opinion. You can hit a ball, realize what you did wrong and immediately hit another while trying to fix your mistakes. You certainly want to get some rounds in because that's the fun part of the game, but as far as improving as a beginner to me the range is where the progress is made.

You guys either aren't understanding or are just too stubborn to realize this isn't totally the fault of the kids. The blue tees were supposed to be at the 172 marker where they hit. The official tournament scorecard said so. Not a generic course scorecard, the State tournament official scorecard. The kids hit from where they were actually supposed to hit, but since someone didn't make sure the markers were in the right spot and wasn't man enough to own that mistake, the kids get penalized. They couldn't see the markers from where they were supposed to hit. Should they have looked a little harder? Yes. Does that change the fact that an adult screwed up? Absolutely not. They did ask someone about it and that person also told them to hit from where they did. Is anyone calling for that persons job? You can put some of the blame on the kids, but the fact that multiple people in charge screwed up doesn't change. They could have easily fixed this but they chose to punish the kids for something that was largely their own fault.

@iacas They didn’t assume the markers were in the wrong spot. The markers WERE in the wrong spot. They hit from where they were supposed to hit as per the official tournament scorecard. If you want to lay some blame on the kids that’s fine but the fact is someone in charge messed up. Whether it was not moving the tees or not having the right distance on the scorecard, and they handled it terribly by punishing the kids.

Reading through the comments on one of the news pages, it looks like the blue markers were in the wrong spot. Everyone played a practice round the day before and on that particular hole they hit from 172, where the kids that got DQ'd hit from in the tournament. It goes on to say they hit from where they did because they were up on an elevated tee box and couldn't see any blue markers, the scorecard said the distance was 172, and the marshall told them that is where they should hit. So as it turns out, the ones that got DQ'd actually hit from the right spot, but since someone didn't make sure the markers were in the right spot they get screwed. Everyone in here is quick to blame the kids without knowing any of this. The fact is the people in charge screwed up and instead of owning up to it they took the cowards way out and punished the kids.