dietz

I think that for years ppl have been putting together some pieces of what we now call SnT. But NOBODY has put ALL of them together in the manner that Andy & Mike have. If you look at the SnT book you will see that they have a bunch of different pictures of pro's at various stages, ie: all the pieces that make up SnT. If you talk with anyone who REALLY knows, they will tell you about Hogan or Sergio or whoever at a particular position. This is because all of these ppl exhibit "pieces" of the pattern, but not the entire thing. You can use any part of the pattern to help with your "traditional" swing, the down fall is that if something goes wrong you cant ask someone (SnT'er or other wise) what your doing wrong as your swing is just a hybrid, so opinions will vary and ppl will want to change anything and everything. This is what i really like about SnT, if i dont get what i am looking for, i just ask or post a vid and bam, there's my answer. Good luck with whatever you decide and have a good time out there !

MrP After taking some time and looking at the YT vid and porting it into V1 software. I can really see what Erik was talking about. The shoulder turn / tilt is not enough. If you look at the middle pic of Charlie here you can see his shoulder turn / tilt. Notice how if you were to draw a line from his left knee straight up it would hit the center of his chest, yours hits your left shoulder. This shows that the tilt and extension are not enough. Again agreeing with Erik, this would be the first step you would want to work on. Charlie2to4

Right you are Erik, The issue is with the shoulder turn, I really didn't look at the whole swing. Hey then again.... I see SnT in EVERYTHING now

MrP Some nice work your building on. I have found that SnT is best worked on by taking it piece by piece. that being said on your dtl view i notice that your hands work away from your body. try to keep them in tighter but make sure the club head is either on the hands or a slight bit out if you were to look at a paused position when the club is parallel to the ground. I have been doing this bit by bit and it seems to link the parts together better. Here is a quick vid of me working on the very same thing. notice how my hands keep the depth working more inside, but keeping the clubhead out.

One thing to make sure to keep your clubface square at impact is to keep the right hand on top of the club as your taking it back to say a parallel position, then allow the club to come up and hinge naturally. But be careful when doing this, you must keep your hand depth working inside and keep the clubhead out side the hands, if looking DTL. Here is a video of me working on this very thing, you can see the clubhead is still in just a bit, like right on the hands, but you can see the right hand on top of the club. Hope this helps

I know that people are drinking the bourbon in KY, but have they started to drink the Kool-Aid yet ??

no biggies Ping..... When he told me that, I had to step back and reevaluate my whole thought process as well Its so much fun though... hitting the ball first opens up a whole new world. The big thing that i noticed was a higher ball flight, and the divots are shallow, dollar bill like. Keep up the hard work, and get some vid posted !!

HEHE.... love that Ping.... Dave told me it took him 8 months just to get the finish down to the point that it matches the 'prescribed' method. And this on the back of working with Andy. I really think ANYONE can do the pattern, but i also think to learn the subtle nuances is a whole nother ball game !! And I'm not sure if you can get all of it off the dvd's !! (unfortunately). Ted

Ping, The vids are great !!! As a beginning Stacker, i can honestly say that at the very least posting vid will help big time. There are a couple of dedicated forums for the pattern you can also check out, pm me and i can give you the links. I found an instructor for the pattern, I have to drive about 1 hour and 45 min to get to him, but its all worth it. Speeds up the learning curve. I'm not understanding why anyone who is not familiar with the pattern would say if it doesnt help or work out will you go back (not that it not a valid question... but). Just the basic principal of Stack & Tilt (weight forward) cant be wrong... can it ? Look at vids of pros and see where they have their weight, as opposed to all of us hacks. Not try to start an argument, just stating a fact.

Please be careful of statements on hip slide, check previous threads for PROOF of hip slide. NOT trying to start something here, but choose your words carefully.

On Friday, I went to the first class that they held. I have been reading some post on other sites about S & T, and it made/makes sense to me. This whole year i have been having an issue of getting the weight stuck on the back leg on the downswing, and hitting most shots fat. Even though i understand what i'm doing, its another thing to change it. S & T cures this from the get go. Dave and Steve who run the school, have worked with P&B; for many years now and understand this pattern VERY well. I can honestly say that the DVDs do give you great info, but...nothing beats getting first-hand instruction. The problem with the DVDs is that they are not 3 dimensional. What i mean by that is, they really dont do the simplicity of the patten justice. I have watched the vid's many times and there were things that without personal instruction i'm not sure if i would have gotten the complete info. The pattern of S & T is not new but has never been put together in this type format with the refinements and now scientific data. After looking at many pros you can see most of them exhibiting some of the positions and inclinations of the pattern. REVIEW The school was very informative, set up with verbal instruction followed by hands-on WITH video taping for printouts. The student to instructor ratio was fantastic, it felt as if I was the only one working with the instructor. I was given the time to do 'my' version of what I thought S & T was (to show the "before") and then given the parts that would correct my swing to match the model. (much like what i've done with conventional instruction) I walked away SO excited about the day and how it changed my ball flight. It was the best amount of money that i have yet spent on golf. I still have a lot of work to do, but one of the great things about S & T when not done correct is that your swing is self diagnosed. If you see this or any school on S & T, and its something YOUR interested in.... run dont walk to sign up !!!!