You ever play a course that did not reflect its rating or slope?

[Bump-n-MI]

The metro park course down the street from me plays to 71.1/118 and is 6663 yds. This course is WAY tougher then a dozen others in the area that (according to the USGA) play much more difficult. My scoring average at this metro park course over the past 5 rounds is 78.8 (78, 80, 81, 77, 78) and my handicap index would around 5 if I played there exclusively. My club plays to 71.4/129 and is 6330 yds. but is much more forgiving (other then the pea sized greens). My last 5 founds at my club were 75, 74, 76, 79, 76 which would put me at an index of 2.2. I've often wondered how and who actually sets the guidelines and parameters for rating and slope because they do not seem to coincide with many of the courses I play.

[underparnv]

Course Ratings and Slopes are determined by your local or state golf association. For here in Northern Nevada I know that the Northern Nevada Golf Association handles all of that. I also know for a fact that they have to go to training in order to be even allowed to do the ratings...

How they are actually calculating the ratings, I'm not sure...

Hope that helps...

[Bump-n-MI]

Course Ratings and Slopes are determined by your local or state golf association. For here in Northern Nevada I know that the

Yep, our ratings and slope are also determined by a governing board in Michigan. My question was more about discrepancies between rating/slope when they do not seem to match what the governing body publishes....and whether or not you have played courses that did not match what was published.

[PiKapp23]

One of the courses in Cincinnati that I play on a regular basis has a rating and slope that is way too low for the course difficulty. From the tips the length is only 6100 yards, which is obviously short. However, the course has a number of doglegs that prevent a long hitter tearing the course up, so it's not quite as short to play as the yardage indicates. The rating and slope is 68.9/111 from those same tees. That doesn't sound unreasonably low unless you've played this course a couple times. Tee to green if you can hit the ball fairly straight (most holes have a little room to miss both directions), then it's not a tough course. However, on the green is where it gets tough.

This course has perhaps the most difficult greens in Cincinnati, especially during the summer when the course dries out. Almost every green is very severely sloped and you MUST be below the hole or make the putt because if you're above hole or to the side and miss just a foot long (or less), then the ball could very well roll off the green (and on a couple holes it could roll 20-30 yards back down the fairway). To make it even worse, there is almost never a straight putt of more than a few feet because of how much undulations are on the greens and they are going all directions, which make it hard to read. The greens seldom follow normal design conventions (such as water always breaks toward water or away from bunkers, etc.) I have played almost every course in the area, several with ratings 73+ and slopes 135+, but my average scores on this course are higher than any other course.

A couple summers ago I had a 6 putt on one of the most severe greens that had flag on front of green on a huge slope. With the pin position it was impossible to leave the ball short without it rolling off the green and down the sloped fairway (it was very dry period that summer), so you either went past hole or chipped again. I guess technically it was only a 3 putt because the others putts were from off the green, including a putt that I rolled from about 5 feet off to about 6 inches past, but beside hole, then watched the ball roll back down the hill again, leaving me an even longer shot this time. I hit the next one about 10 feet past the hole and watched the next putt roll off the front of green again. My 6th 'putt' I finally made from behind the hole about 5-6 feet that would have rolled off green again if I hadn't accidently rolled it into the hole.

[flopdarock]

yeah... my brother took me to a course i had never been before...
71.1/132 seemed reasonable to me from the blues and the distance was 6479... which i thought was short... my brother suggested we move to a teebox forward... and i looked at him like "dude are you kidding"... he'd played there before so i listened to him... we moved to the whites... im glad we moved up cuz that course kiced both of our asses really good... didnt break a hundred that day... risk/reward and course management yikes

[jrm1493]

There is a course near me, an old beat up muni south of houston, that rates a 70.5/120 from the blues, and they claim it to be 6620 yards on the scorecard, which seems reasonable for that claimed yardage. Well there is no way on earth that this course is over 5800 yd from those tees. It is actually a fairly difficult course, being tight and having a lot of waste areas, small elevated greens and a 100yd bayou that you hit over on about 1/2 the holes, but it is very short.

The first hole which seems to be the most exaggerated, is 340 by the scorecard but I have nearly driven the green (and I top out around 250). A handy Google maps tool I found shows blue tee to center of green to be 247m, or 270yd. That is a huge difference (maybe the source of hackers who claim to hit it 300 - 40 yards short on a hole like this they actually hit it 230). There is another par 3 that cannot be more than 100yards, even from the tips - still a surprisingly tough hole because the green is severely sloped and a full wedge just rolls back right off the front and if you manage to end up above the hole the putt downhill is almost impossible - my only birdie here was when I accidentally hit a chucked 6-iron on the green (was trying to hit a pitch with a 9-iron and grabbed the wrong club).

I think they basically sent one of their redneck employees out there and just completely made up the numbers on the scorecard (they are all nice round numbers), and then convinced the USGA or whoever to give them the 70.5/120 rating probably based on that scorecard value of 6600 yards - somehow it slipped through the cracks. Pretty pathetic but I have to say it is a fun unique course for a goat farm, it was built in the 20s or 30s and it is neat to see how different the layout is from modern courses.

Edit - after looking at the scorecard, nowhere does it claim that the numbers are actually yards... sneaky

[Big_M]

The metro park course down the street from me plays to 71.1/118 and is 6663 yds. This course is WAY tougher then a dozen others in the area that (according to the USGA) play much more difficult. My scoring average at this metro park course over the past 5 rounds is 78.8 (78, 80, 81, 77, 78) and my handicap index would around 5 if I played there exclusively. My club plays to 71.4/129 and is 6330 yds. but is much more forgiving (other then the pea sized greens). My last 5 founds at my club were 75, 74, 76, 79, 76 which would put me at an index of 2.2. I've often wondered how and who actually sets the guidelines and parameters for rating and slope because they do not seem to coincide with many of the courses I play.

I'm just curious... which metro park, I have played most of them. Also, is the club you are referring to Inverness. If so, I am jealous... I went to law school in Toledo, but never did make it out.

[Big_M]

Also, is the club you are referring to Inverness. If so, I am jealous... I went to law school in Toledo, but never did make it out.

just answered my own question by clicking on your link... it is Inverness, but not the famous one in Toledo... Never heard of the one you play at, and I lived in Michigan for 25 years (Oxford and Rochester).

[Bump-n-MI]

I'm just curious... which metro park, I have played most of them.

Huron Meadows

[Bump-n-MI]

just answered my own question by clicking on your link... it is Inverness, but not the famous one in Toledo... Never heard of the one you play at, and I lived in Michigan for 25 years (Oxford and Rochester).

Yes, too bad I'm not a member at the Inverness in Ohio

. To be honest I had never heard of it either until I drove by it a few years ago. It was built in the 20's as a retreat destination for all the people that had summer homes in that area. There are only only 280 members and most are seniors which seldom play (life members) so I can walk out anytime and have the course to myself. The course is perfect because the encourage you to bring your kids (and I have a 6 yr old daughter and 11 yr old son).

[Slim 11]

I think the rating and slope don't always appear accurate because a particular part of one's game may be weak and needed for a particular course. For instance, I play an executive course by my house fairly regularly. Obviously low rating and fairly low slope. If I am hitting my irons well, I score great, but if I am having a bad day with the irons, I am screwed. Because of the course set up there is no real way to manage your game differently, so you have to get your irons working or suffer.
This can apply to courses that require long carries (not hitting driver well that day), lots of layups for doglegs (having distance issues), or tough greens (the flatstick is not cooperating).
I think the ratings people have to assume a certain average ability (they are scoring it for a scratch golfer, after all, or a bogey golfer when it comes to slope). It is easy to see, if you play often, that some people can score similar but maybe for different reasons. Long hitter vs. great scrambler, etc.
I am not a very long hitter, so I tend to struggle more on long courses.

[Big_M]

Huron Meadows

I've only played that one twice, just checked my scorecards and I shot an 83 and an 88... if I remeber right it was fairly wide open, but hilly and the greens seemed kind of tough if you weren't in the right spot. Some of the greens were kind of mounded if I remember right.

Yes, too bad I'm not a member at the Inverness in Ohio

280 members... they could all play the same day

It's always nice knowing you can just show up and be able to play... too bad they don't have 18 holes, then it would be perfect.

[Chief Broom]

Two local courses I play have very different ratings (68.1 116 par 71 and 70.5 126 par 72) but ironically the tougher rated of the two I usually play better, or at worst the same. This is bothersome to me because I'm a member of the easier rated course and most of my handicap is generated there. The difference in ratings and slopes means that for the same score your differential calculates significantly lower at the harder of the two courses for any given score. Ordinarily I wouldn't complain since the higher rated course should be tougher, but like I said in practice I can play the higher rated course better. Go figure?

[Bump-n-MI]

I've only played that one twice, just checked my scorecards and I shot an 83 and an 88... if I remeber right it was fairly wide open, but hilly and the greens seemed kind of tough if you weren't in the right spot. Some of the greens were kind of mounded if I remember right.

Yep, there is plenty of room off the tee but lots of obstructions and trouble on your approach shots…and yes there is a quite a bit of undulation on the greens. It is not an overly difficult course but, IMO, does not play to the published rating/slope.

[rjfan91]

We have a local muni call Red Wing Golf course that has a rating of 71.9, 125 from the blues (6653 yds). I call this place a handicap killer because I've never shot as high as my handicap. I always shoot REALLY well here because there are very few traps and little elevation. If this were where you established your handicap, you're probably screwed at other places.

[kfowler]

I don't think I've ever run across your situation but I played Westburn near Flat Rock and it didn't even have a Rating and Slope. I asked the guy why and he said it was too expensive. The club claims to have been around for 50+ years. In all that time they wouldn't pony up to get it rated? I think it's like $15K. Not sure how long the rating lasts.

[flopdarock]

We have a local muni call Red Wing Golf course that has a rating of 71.9, 125 from the blues (6653 yds). I call this place a handicap killer because I've never shot as high as my handicap. I always shoot REALLY well here because there are very few traps and little elevation. If this were where you established your handicap, you're probably screwed at other places.

out of the 3 beach muni's... redwing is the most difficult... if you think its easy... you must be destroying bowcreek and kempsville... hahaha... all of the beach courses are pretty flat... they make up for it with sand an water

[rjfan91]

Check my handicap. I'm not destroying anything except the number of golf balls in my bag.

I've never played Kempsville. However, I have played Bow Creek a few times. I thought Bow Creek was harder. Some of those greens are TINY. I heard Red Wing used to have a lot of sand traps. The renovation took out 2/3 of them. I played Red Wing last fall and they were finally getting the greens settled in. Back on topic though, I still don't think Red Wing is rated properly.

out of the 3 beach muni's... redwing is the most difficult... if you think its easy... you must be destroying bowcreek and kempsville... hahaha... all of the beach courses are pretty flat... they make up for it with sand an water