dmband8985

yes, i have started to do some research into wishon, along with SMT, Alpha, and Nakashima. As far as club head designs go, they seem to offer a wide variety, and have things i've been looking for in specific...traditional toplines, narrower soles, options of mixing cavity backs and muscle backs. I guess the next step would be to find certified clubmakers in my area and try them out. if anyone has experience with any of these, please share any details you might have...including how much something like this would potentially run me...

thanks, all brands i've been looking at...i'm might have to give the 4dx pro's another chance from nickent....i'm really happy with what i was able to get out of my 3dx redbacks and i like that nickent is loyal to their customers...they recently gave nickent hybrid users a chance to upgrade to the new 5dx hybrid for half the price, not many other companies that would do that. but again, my first impressions of the new irons were a bit iffy I have looked into snake eyes too...i really like the 675's...plus since they are highly customizable i could combo the set with cavity backs in the longs and muscles in the shorts and get the best of all worlds. Another set I've been eyeing is the Ben Hogan Apex FTX irons which are under 400 bucks on golfio...i've actually hit them before and really liked them, but kind of weary buying clubs from a company that may or may not exist anymore (I know callaway bought them, but what is the future of the company? will callaway handle customer support and/or any warranties and repairs?)

About a few years ago I bought the irons I'm currently playing, Nickent 3dx redbacks. What I liked about Nickent was that they clearly cared about their products...put money into R&D;, made clubs that were of the same standards as the top OEMs, and as I would find out over the course of the last couple of years, had incredible customer support (randomly busted a ferrule on my 6 iron and they repaired it for free and within a week)...and I seem to have forgotten to mentionthat their products don't cost an arm and a leg. I'm a firm believer in buying products only from companies that I like, so now that I'm in the market for new irons, does anyone know of any companies that are similar to nickent...maybe not as big in operation as the callaways and taylormades, but are equally dedicated to the quality of their products and don't have the name brand inflation of the oem names? good customer support is important too....I've considered staying loyal to nickent but i'm not in love with the 4dx line...looking for a mid-low handicapper's iron to grow into and preferably something forged

i have a 08 f speed ld 10.5...get yourself on a launch monitor and find out what combination of loft and shaft stiffness fits you best...every driver will be different. i was playing a hibore 10.5 and wanted something that would help me out with a lower trajectory so when i was hitting new drivers i found myself trying 9.5's, but had mixed success depending on the model. the graphite design shaft on the f speed has more of a mid kickpoint, and that combined with a 10.5 gave me a consistent launch angle that i was happy with. it fit my swing but you'd have to do that same thing to find which one you like... another thing to consider is the high torque on the shaft of the f speed, takes some time to get used to, i find myself torn whether to reshaft at this time....somthing with similar flex characteristics but lower torque and stiffer through the tip...maybe a christmas present to myself

glad to hear that i'm not the only who's ever gone through this...one of the local ranges opens the grass up for weekends, so fridays after work are great cause the grass is still intact. i'll stop by de-weed the place with my 7 iron...

or at least that is what i'm blaming for my inadequacies hitting off grass. The only grass range near me in unlit, and the only time i have to practice is the evenings, so i've been forced to hit of of mats. they are nice mats, that true strike stuff that you can actually spin your irons with, but they are still mats and when when you hit it just a bit fat, you can still muscle through it and pretend like you're actually good at this game. anyways, i had been hitting the ball damn good off the mats...everything felt buttery on impact. i was hitting down with my irons, getting good trajectory and that making that cool sound you get when you hit irons cleanly, and then i went to the range that has grass tee boxes and it was like i've never played this game before in my life. as far as i could tell my swing was exactly the same, but for some reason when i'm on grass, it's like i'm afraid to take a divot and i try to pick the ball off cleanly from the ground. when i go out of my way to take a divot, i end up hitting it way too fat. i just can seem to find a good middle ground. then i go back to the mats and its like i've been playing the pga tour. this is just plain annoying.........i'm beginning to hate this game (not really, but kind of sort of)

few options that might fit your game well, maybe a tad over 200 but not much: http://www.rockbottomgolf.com/nicken...-graphite.html http://www.rockbottomgolf.com/bridgestone-golf-cg-oversize-irons-set-steel.html http://www.rockbottomgolf.com/adams-golf-tight-lies-idea-a2-irons-set-steel.html

what kind of scores do you post? how seriously do you play? Are you looking to take up golf seriously and looking to break 80? all i think are important questions to ask. Also, the answers will tell you what you really need in your bag...most beginners box sets come with a driver, 2 fairways and 3-pw, and i suspect that is why you originally said you wanted these clubs. but if for instance you can't hit long irons and you hardly ever pull them out on a course, why pay for them? same goes for fairway wood. i was in the same situation you are about two years ago when i bought new clubs. i couldn't hit driver or long irons really well...i started off with a set of nickent 3dx redbacks 3 and 4 hybrid and 5-pw. also bought a 56 and 60 degree wedge from adams. played a bunch of short exec courses in my area to gain consistency. after a few months of practicing i found that i hit my hybrids a good distance, 210-215 on my 4h and 225ish on my 3h. so instead of spending money on fw's i just bought a driver, the hibore xl had just come out and scored a great deal on the original hibore. i seriously recommend gigagolf, a friend of mine just bought the pursuit forged irons and i've had a chance to hit them, they are great for low to low-mid handicappers...i'm sure all they're products are strong as well.

what is this off-season you are referring to? i don't understand the concept...it the middle of november and its close to 80 degrees here in socal...year round golf is where its at... but yeah i did a little equipment shuffling. replaced the hibore driver with an 08 f speed ld, love it already but really need to do something about the 5.1 torque shaft...thinking grafalloy blue or prolaunch platinum, or v2

nickent 3dx ironwood with ust v2 shaft for 80 bucks at golfsmith the 4dx with the same shaft is 150. they make great hybrids, and they get a lot of play on various tours. nickent hybrids rack up a bunch of wins on the nationwide tour

i've tried choking up on my driver with varying results...i think the characteristics of the shaft have a lot to do with the success of this. but i have found tremendous success with my longer irons chocking up. i've long known that my 8 iron is my favorite club...when i set up it feels just perfect and natural and i can carry 155-160 with a slight draw pattern. i started experimenting choking on clubs longer than my 8i trying to emulate the same length so that i can make roughly the same stroke and what do you know i'm hitting every iron in my bag cleanly and perfectly at a very high percentage. what i've noticed most is the shorter length give me more confidence to hit down on the ball and really apply pressure on the ball. i'm planning on building a snake eyes driver, i might build it with a shorter shaft so i can finally get that control with the driver i've been looking for.

alright here's a deal, you can look the part with your 700 dollar irons, your 60 dollar nike dri-fit shirt and your $175 FJ's...throw in a cool visor while you're at it. i'll keep myself busy making birdies and counting the all the extra money. i might get it all in singles and roll around in some green on the greens. bottom line is i hit my friends irons from gigagolf a club further, straighter and higher than i do my nickent 3dx redbacks which i bought at almost the exact same price...how's that for performance? i just want to give you one piece of advice to follow...don't settle for an ill suited set of clubs just because they are brand name. if there is something out there that you hit better, who cares what name it has on the back of the club...last time i checked you hit the ball with the face of the club. 30 day money back guarantees from companies like gigagolf means YOU can hit the club and YOU can decide if its right for YOU

what about gigagolf? a practice buddy of mine just got a set of forged irons from them...he actually ordered a combo set of forged cavity backs for long irons and and muscle backs on the short irons. heads are forged from the same steel that even the highest end component makers like Wishon uses. forging processes are apparently similar too...he got his built with TT dynamic gold's with sensicore, which aren't exactly bottom of the barrel shafts. a similar club from mizuno or a company of the like would have cost him twice as much easily. even a good set of preowned would have been a steal if got them for the same price. i've hit them and they are pretty damn nice. even if they are not from as good of materials as some of you claim...for a few hundred bucks i wouldn't mind having them in my bag for a few seasons, sure beats paying a grand for some miz's or titelists i hear the argument of resale all the time, and i'm not really a believer....first of all, unless you upgrade your equipment every season, a set of clubs that are two or three model years old don't fetch much on trade in value. second, i personally don't believe that you are using your clubs properly if they are graded in excellent conditions after two or three seasons of golf. if you are looking for a set to help get you from a high handicap to a 10 handicap you can't go wrong with clones or components...the difference in how much you pay for and get in trade in for a set of name brands will always be more than a moderately priced club that you can learn the game on well (you can always get a nice tax deduction when you take them to goodwill when you decide to splurge on oem's, assuming you haven't hit them against a tree or thrown them in the lake out of frustration). plus you can use the extra money for lessons and greens fees

i'm gonna start throwing out statistics, cause i'm a science major and i like numbers....so here are some 2008 pga tour stats to show that there is not necessarily a correlation between driving distance and other aspects of the game including scoring... The top three on the driving distance list followed by other stats: 1. bubba watson -315.1; 27th in GIR at 67.6%, 182 in putts per round (ppr) at 30.5, and 82nd in scoring 2. Robert Garrigus -311; 21st in GIR at 68%, 154th in ppr, and 97th in scoring 3. JB Holmes - 310.3; 152nd in GIR at 62.9%, 88th in ppr at 29.28, and 63rd in scoring conversely, there are five players on tour that hit 70% or more GIR: 1. Durant - 102nd in Driving distance at 286.5 2. Allenby- 61st in DD at 291.7 3. Frazer- 14th in DD at 299 4- Huston 65th in DD at 291.6 5- Baird- 116 in DD at 285.2 only Frazier seems to have the best combination of distance and accuracy according to this list...4 of the 5 most accurate players on the tour this year were on average 25 yards behind the longest driver on tour. so here in my final post on this subject cause i'm kind of over it at this point...does driving the ball a long way make it easier to score lower? yes...does driving the ball a far way necessarily mean you are going to score lower? no. these stats were from people who play golf for a living and practice every day sometimes two time a day to hone their skills. a 20 handicap plays maybe once or twice a month, they are bound to be more erratic on the shots that require the most precision (short game and putts) than they are with shots with a larger margin for error. that is why people who can hit the ball a long way off the tee can still put up huge numbers. if you're still not convinced i've got one name for you...john daly

do yourself a favor, set out twenty balls the next time you go to a range...hit ten with your driver trying to hit it in a zone 250-270 yards out and about 10 yards wide. then hit 10 with a 60 deg or whatever you prefer trying to land it in a small confined area...my range has a big rectangular shaped target thats about 5 ft by 5ft and is about 55-60 yards out. come back to me with your accuracy...gauranteed that even though you think its harder to hit your driver, you'll get more in your target area with it. i think we're going to have to agree to disagree on this one, but all aspects of the short game are much harder than driving the ball. another aspect that i haven't brought up is the technology in drivers these days...every company is out there to give every average joe the chance to boom his drives. huge faces, ultra thin faces that are incredibly hot and have super high moi's. anyone with 400 dollars can get the ball high in the air and flying for 250...throw in a few lessons to get some basic technique and 300 isn't out of the realm of possibility. try to remember rounds you played when you were a higher handicap and try to remember where the extra strokes came from...very few came from what you did with driver. you were almost lucky to escape a long par three with a bogey. knowing how to hit a driver far does nothing if you cant get a ball out of a bunker when your left knee is near your chest and you're stretch your right leg to the ground....or if you can't pick a ball out cleanly out of a fairway bunker on a long par four...or if there are trees in your view of the green and you can't work the ball in a given direction forcing you to take a shot and lay up, or if you can't play a low roller to get out of some trees...all i'm saying is there are alot of shots you need to be able to hit to put up a low score, all of which don't necessarily correlate to your ability to a hit a shot off the tee with the biggest most forgiving club in your bag with no obstacles in front of you. basically a three putt every odd hole and missed green on every even hole adds up to 18 shots over par...its not that hard to do regardless of how far you drive, and its also not that hard to do both on a couple holes

i still don't see how you don't think its possible to be 20 shots off par and be able to drive 300 yards. sure aspects of swinging your driver and your wedge are the same, but i don't see see how being good at one necessarily means you have to be good at the other. you go to any practice range in this country and even the best golfers will tell you they can't hit every club in their bag well...usually they feel comfortable with short irons, are less consistent with long irons, and they are afraid of what they will do with their driver...it's not inconceivable to imagine that there are people out that who just hit their driver better than the other clubs in their bag. again, i bring up the case of professional long drivers...according to your logic seniors on the long drive tour who can hit the ball 350 at times should be competing with Tiger and Phil for Green Jackets. and again i have to mention the mental aspect to it. when you are on the tee box holding your driver, you are hoping to land your ball in a much bigger area, lets say an imaginary box on the fairway that is 10 yards wide and 20 yards long plus about a few yards on either side of the fairway where you wouldn't really mind ending up...thats a landing zone of approximately 200 sq yds or more...it's really easy to feel comfortable hitting the bejeezus out of the ball knowing you have a decent margin for error (you wouldn't necessarily think this way but a 20 handicapper would). conversely, for the 50-60 yard approach, you're looking at a landing zone, you may need to land the ball in a 20-25 sq ft area and have it stop on a dime...much much much tougher shot than the drive of the tee is it not? plus i don't know what kind of courses you play, but a lot of the ones that i do really require you to set up your approach to the green in order to have a chance to two putt (plateaus steep drop offs, ridges, valleys etc). you can play it safe and just get it on the putting surface, but from a lot of positions on the green three and four putts are very much in play. one more thing....you need to properly understand what 20 strokes over par is....its just slightly over bogey golf...these are people with general skills of the game, but not a complete game. on average they play about a stroke over what really really good players do on any given hole. this stroke could come from a three putt, over/under shooting an approach, chunking a bunker shot, and errant tee shot that land out of bounds or finds the drink and you have to take a stroke. i really think your rant would have held more traction if it was against 30 handicaps who drive the ball 300 yards, it's a bit more difficult to believe then.

seriously, i think your rant is ridiculous...there is more to the game than how far you can drive. have you seen those long drive competitions, i'm pretty sure very few of them are scratch golfers. never underestimate the intimidation of the short game....sure you can boom the ball off the tee but what good is that if you can't land it where you want. lot of courses and holes where you have to strategically place every shot just to be able to get to a place on the green from where you can two putt. say you get to within 50-60 yards of the green and the pin is on a plateau on the back of the green...that is a remarkably tough shot that requires a completely different set of skills than hitting driver 300 yards. plus never underestimate the psychological intimidation the flat stick has on most golfers. There is a saying that 95% of putting is between the ears. even if you hit a fair share of GIRs, three putts will put a dent in your score card. to sum up it is not ridiculous for a 20 handicapper to hit the ball 300 yards. to be a good golfer you need to possess a wide variety of skills, only one of which is hitting the ball a far way. its like being a wide receiver in football. if you are fast, you have potential, but if you can't run a route or have butter hands you're just a fast runner.

i'm a fan...i realized a lot of my inconsistencies in my iron shots were due to inconsistent wrists from swing to swing. it is a lot easier to control the wrist hinge closer to your body and in front of you than it is when your arms are behind you. also i believe it helps me be a more controlled and consistent in my take away. i've found that it lets me put more pressure on the ball, and i've been hitting my irons a club further and higher than before. with woods its been a bit more of a challenge as far as the timing of the release so that i can get the ball on the release rather than hitting down on it like and iron

i've never heard anyone complaining about a slight draw...its actually the desired flight path of most good golfers. it's most likely your new irons, you should also notice that the shorter the iron the more draw effect that you are getting. it's normal and its very good. learn to harness the draw, it will help you attack fairways and greens like you never imagined. plus, i don't know about everyone else, but i find it easier to adjust and hit a straight ball or work it left to right by adjusting small parts of my swing rather than having to make adjustments to hit a draw

if you are prone to losing balls just use whatever you don't mind losing. nothing worse than paying 50 bucks to play a course, then and extra 15-20 bucks for teh half dozen pro-v1's you lose. when i was at that level i couldn't tell the difference between different balls, even now i'd be hard pressed to spend too much more than a buck a ball. top flite's have always been trusty, the top flite d2's are actually a solid ball for the price. also i have played snake eyes balls from time to time (got 2 dozen once for 15 dollars) and they are really pretty nice...the feel great on iron shots, and i still use them if i ever play a quick round at an executive course.

did you build the club yourself? what kind of shaft are you using? i know the one they have at golfsmith preassembled has a proforce xt shaft, which i don't think will suit my game. i'm not a club builder, but does anyone know what golfsmith charges to assemble a club if i buy components from them?

hey all, i'm looking for an adjustable weight driver and all the r7's are still a bit expensive for my lowly budget. I'm considering the snake eyes viper 464 or tour driver, was wondering if anyone had any experience with them.

not a huge fan myself, i've been looking for a set of players irons and have been hitting all the demos i can. the head feels too heavy for my taste too

my irons came with winn grips, they are nice at first, but like others have said, they wear quick. also my palms can get a bit moist sometime, especially during summer playing time here in so cal, so i needed something with a bit more grip. playing tour velvets midsize now, and have adjusted to them quite nicely. lamkin crosslines area about the same grip. though i will say, getting the right grip size can do marvels to your game. first round i played with midsize grips, i saved about stroke every other hole

i've been playing nickent 3dx hybrids for almost a couple of years now...absolutely love them. i've hit the 4dx hybrid and it's just as good if not better, would love to upgrade at some point but would rather spend money on new irons first. I like adams hybrids as well, but not as familiar with them