Question for you low handicappers/consistent ball strikers

RWHJR3 · February 16, 2010

Hey everyone, just finished reading Hogans book and am very excited to give the fundamentals a try. One question though, which I probably know the answer to, but I figured I'd ask those who would know better. On the downswing, do you try to really whip your body/arms through the zone and into impact or do you come down with a nice smooth steady/unrushed feeling downswing? I hope that is clearly understood and I'm not confusing anyone. Just trying to figure out some tips to stay consistent so I don't hit fat, slice or hook to dramatically.

Thanks everyone!

Bobby

**joepro23** · February 16, 2010

For me, I definitely accelerate through the zone and on my downswing, but try to keep a solid tempo/timing that is not forced. If the whole body (legs, arms, hips) is just flailing in there on the downswing, you will have no timing and hit the ball all over the place. I grew up going at every shot full throttle and swinging as hard as I could. While I have slowly toned it down over the years, I still would consider my swing pretty aggressive. I guess I am a little closer to your first description of the downswing, but wouldn't go as far to call it a "whip" of my body/arms. On tee shots with the driver I have tried coming in smooth occasionally to sacrifice distance for accuracy, but that rarely works for me and I sometimes even hit it more off line. On full wedge shots and less I am in a second gear, but still try to hit down and through the ball to put spin on it. The last thing you want to do is decelerate on any shot, and coming in too smooth/steady may lead to that happening, especially if it is not natural.

**senorchipotle** · February 16, 2010

that all depends on distance. you can swing out of your shoes once you learn how a proper shot feels. at impact, i want to feel my wrist bowed or flat, facing the target, and my chest down square to the hitting area. as long as your hands are in front of the ball at impact, that takes out virtually any fat shots you might hit. this allows you to get down on the ball with your chest and back hand and take a nice divot, and your right shoulder to come through the ball/hitting are right after impact. these are my swing feels/thoughts. once you get your posture static and repeatable, then you can slowly pick up swing speed and keep your torso and head steady.

**grantc79** · February 16, 2010

Hey everyone, just finished reading Hogans book and am very excited to give the fundamentals a try. One question though, which I probably know the answer to, but I figured I'd ask those who would know better. On the downswing, do you try to really whip your body/arms through the zone and into impact or do you come down with a nice smooth steady/unrushed feeling downswing? I hope that is clearly understood and I'm not confusing anyone. Just trying to figure out some tips to stay consistent so I don't hit fat, slice or hook to dramatically.

I'd be very careful with Hogan's book.

Hogan's book was written assuming everyone was gifted with his abilities and his flexibility. It was a book written by Hogan on how to hit the ball like Hogan did which one in a million amateurs can do. It is more of a lesson in how Hogan would swing the club rather than how you should. Some of his movements are great across the board for everyone. But if the average amateur tried to cup their wrist at the top of the swing with an extremely weak grip like Hogan had they might actually slice the ball backwards.

**senorchipotle** · February 16, 2010

I'd be very careful with Hogan's book.

i disagree. hogan makes it clear as day many, many times that it is impact that matters. he describes where the hands, hips, head, etc. should be at impact to produce a good golf shot. hogan never said to hit the ball with a cupped wrist, nor did he advocate a weak grip. his grip in five lessons was neutral, and the left wrist was flat and pointed at the target in the impact zone.

**Randy4h** · February 16, 2010

I'd be very careful with Hogan's book.

I'm a great fan of Hogan's Five Lessons, but I consider it the equivalent of a college graduate level master class taught by Einstein. In other words, he is in a class by himself, somewhere us mere mortals can't even imagine. Yes, he describes his thoughts on his swing basics (grip, stance, backswing, downswing, etc.) and that information is invaluable,but I would say there is no one in the world who has ever swung the club as he did (sorry Tiger fans). I've tried for years to absorb his thoughts, and I now realize that it is impossible to copy his swing, not only for me but for anyone on tour.

While I recommend having Five Lessons on your bookshelf for continual reference, if the OP is just starting out in this game, something a little less technical would be the place to begin.

**grantc79** · February 16, 2010

I'm a great fan of Hogan's Five Lessons, but I consider it the equivalent of a college graduate level master class taught by Einstein. In other words, he is in a class by himself, somewhere us mere mortals can't even imagine. Yes, he describes his thoughts on his swing basics (grip, stance, backswing, downswing, etc.) and that information is invaluable,but I would say there is no one in the world who has ever swung the club as he did (sorry Tiger fans). I've tried for years to absorb his thoughts, and I now realize that it is impossible to copy his swing, not only for me but for anyone on tour.

This ^

The basic premise is that Hogan had a ton of coil, an flat swing, came from amazingly far inside, fought a hook because of this, and was an amazing ballstriker. The book was written from a standpoint of someone with those charachteristics in their swing. The average amateur does not have a ton of coil, does not have a flat swing (in fact has the opposite), is over the top in their down swing, fights a slice, and struggles hitting the ball too fat and thin. Everything in Hogan's style was designed to helpstop hitting huge draws. 99.9% of amateurs do not need help in that area.

**DavidFehertysBike** · February 16, 2010

If you want to hit powerfade using a ridiculously flat swing plane, then i guess hogan is your man. Otherwise, i would say just focus on the fundementals and find your own swing. Who cares what anyone else swings like? They are not going to hit the ball for you..

**RIduffer** · February 16, 2010

OK, sounds like some of you don't think Hogan's 5 Fundamentals is a great starting point for the beginner (FWIW, I spent alot of time studying that book when I started playing, and didn't find it very helpful either). What would you suggest instead to the OP? The previous post mentioned "fundamentals", but what specifically do you think are the most important steps for a beginner? Any practice tips, books, websites, etc.?

**Randy4h** · February 16, 2010

These days, whenever I am trying to research anything, I just Google it. Whether it's how to do a brake job, how to build a house, or how to learn golf, there are hundreds of sites available. I just Googled "basic golf instruction" and it returned over 3 million sites. There should be a few good ones in there.

In addition, I recommend going to the local library and see what golf books may be available. Generally, there are several that are specifically aimed toward beginners. Our library even has Golf for Dummies. And it's not too bad. I would stay away from books ghostwritten by players, those titles like "How I Play Golf" which can be very confusing. There are a lot of basic books written by excellent teachers such as Jim McLean, David Leadbetter, Rick Smith, Jim Flick, John Jacobs, to name a few.

One thing to remember, though, is that no matter how much information you get from books, magazines or online, there is nothing like having a knowledgeable person, meaning a professional, get you started correctly.

**grantc79** · February 16, 2010

Honestly,

What I would do is buy a smart stick and start tracing lines.

I would also look into The Golfing Machine at www.lynnblakegolf.com

RWHJR3 · February 16, 2010

Let me ask this, what's everyone opinion on trying to force the right elbow (right handed golfer) to stay close to the right hip on the downswing near impact?

**grantc79** · February 16, 2010

Let me ask this, what's everyone opinion on trying to force the right elbow (right handed golfer) to stay close to the right hip on the downswing near impact?

My opinion is if you do the other things right that should happen naturally.

Slide your hips and try to drag your back shoulder down plane all the way to the ball. If you do it right you should feel a lot of weight on your right hand index finger at the first joint that comes out of the hand. That pressure point basically acts a sensor for the club.

RWHJR3 · February 17, 2010

My opinion is if you do the other things right that should happen naturally.

Almost like the feeling that you're pulling and pointing your shoulder in a downward angle behind the ball in the backswing and then turning the hips and make it feel as you're swinging your shoulder through the zone on the the same plane in the downswing?

**davbrucas** · February 17, 2010

If youre just starting out, try to get the club back on a flatter swing plane, fire your weight to the left side while pulling your hand/arms down into the space the right hip just vacated...hold the wristcock as long as possible and release the clubhead into the ball...you can put a tee into the ground in the 1 o'clock position out in front of the ball...(target line is 12 o'clock). Try to hit the ball to the tee that is in the ground. With a square face at impact, you should hit a nice high draw if you can get your weight to the left side prior to impact.

**grantc79** · February 17, 2010

Almost like the feeling that you're pulling and pointing your shoulder in a downward angle behind the ball in the backswing and then turning the hips and make it feel as you're swinging your shoulder through the zone on the the same plane in the downswing?

In general this is the process I would go for if I was starting from scratch and wanting to get everything right.

#1 get 2 laser pointers and attach one to each end a dowel rod, or spend the money and get a smart stick. Then put 6-10 feet of wide blue painters tape on the floor, put a ball right in the middle of the line. Now practice taking the club back and pointing the lasers at the line the entire time. Practice this until you get to the point that you can take the club all the way to the top and have the lasers never leave the line. This is a drill that you should do for life. Doing that drill with a tall mirror in front and behind you and watching yourself will make this drill 10x more effective. Once you have mastered that..... #2 take your club to the top of your backswing and focus on SLIDING your hips forward before your club moves downward. Your weight should go forward, your hips should SLIDE. Not open, they will do that on their own. Once you have mastered that....... #3 as you have probably noticed when you slide your hips your right shoulder wants to drop. Now train that right shoulder to drop diagonally towards the ball. Try to keep your right hand as passive as possible while transplanting your right shoulder from the top diagonally down to as close to the ball as possible. You should feel your right elbow begin to dig into your sides. If you can keep your hands passive until you feel that elbow you are in business. After you master 1, 2, and 3 start using your dowel rod to make full swings and keep that laser on the line the entire time going forward. That's a good start.

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