bogey joe

Thanks WUTiger. That sounds right up my alley.......

Thanks Flintcreek, I will check it out.

Hello all. We are in the pre-production stage of a 13 episode documentary on old, historic 9 hole golf courses in America. We will be filming 6 courses of which two have already been chosen but the other four courses are not set in stone. This is where we need your help. We are looking to stay in the Southeast for these 13 episodes but are not limited to that area. So if you know of or play at an old 9 hole course with a rich history, we would love to hear about it and check it out. Our reason for this documentary is the alarming rate at which 9-hole golf courses are falling by the wayside and we want to bring attention to these courses and show that these facilities have value in the golfing food chain so to speak, and to show America the rich, fascinating history and the classic characters that are so often found at these courses. If you know of such a place, shout it out. Who knows we may even see you there one day.

My name is James Leeth and I currently own a small golf course in Chattanooga, TN. I am also the host of Golf Soup a 30 minute golf program that airs here locally on the Fox network. Golf Soup has just been picked up to go national and we are very excited about this incredible opportunity! the format of Golf Soup in the past has featured myself playing and promoting 9 holes of a different local or regional course for my viewers and we were quite successful with that format, however with the national broadcast we will be changing the format to give more of a national appeal to the viewing audience. So I will be playing the 9 holes each week with a celebrity or a guest and we will be playing for money that will go to the celebrity or guest's charity while we learn more about the guest and their lives. I have been blessed in my life to meet some well known people and have great contacts to many others and I know that we will turn out some great shows with these guests. But with a golden opportunity like this I don't want every guest to be someone whose golden ticket has already been punched. Everyone has a story to tell or knows someone that they would like to help or a cause that they want to champion. I would like to have guests from all walks of life not just the red carpet walk of life. But most importantly we want people who are passionate about helping others and giving back as we play for charity each week. Our guest line up so far includes a county music star, a former PGA and Sr PGA star, a comedian, several presidents of charities, a couple of actors and so on. What I am specifically and actively looking for at this point is a Wounded Warrior with a love of the game of golf to join me in raising money for the Wounded Warrior project or any charity of his or her choice. But that is not the only person I am looking for, as I said earlier everyone has a story to tell. Maybe you would like to get your story out to 30 million people. Maybe like me you have struggled and toiled your whole life with your business or product and have been waiting on a break to get your story out to the masses. I now have the platform that can help people in many different ways and that is exactly our mission statement. To help, promote, and change as many lives as possible. If you think you would be a good fit for our show, let's talk. Send me a private message here on this site. Thanks for taking the time to read and good luck to all out there.

Good point and sorry for not clarifying that. Yes it would be gross!!

First let me say that I own a golf course in Tennessee and recently a friend of mine, whom is a home builder, approached me about having a golf tournament for a house of his. The idea caught me a bit off guard and seemed a bit on the pipe dream end for me originally. However after several meetings and seeing his decent plans on the project I am beginning to give the idea a tiny bit of weight. However before I commit to such a large undertaking I would like to get as many thoughts on the idea as possible and this has always been a great forum for getting answers. I will condense the idea for you so you can give it an up or down vote. 50 two-man teams, 54-hole event with cut after 36 holes to 25 teams. Format shall be four-ball. Scorers will be with every group. $1,000 per player with Co-ops welcome ( i.e. 8 people putting up $250 per person to back the team). Prize a 3 bedroom, 2 bath, 2,400 square ft. home in souteast Tn. or the option of taking a cash payout of $60,000 if you so desired. My buddy has much more details than those, but that is the gist of the idea. so fire away friends give me a yes or no as to whether you would play in such an event or if you know someone at your club who you and some buddies would back to take a chance on winning the house or the cash. Please don't be shy to answer all the feedback I can get will be helpfull. Thanks, Bogey Joe

I had 3 double eagles before I carded my first hole in one. It was a stat I was very proud of knowing that a double eagle is much more rare. However in the last 10 years I have surpassed my double eagles with aces though I have added 2 more double eagles to stand at 8 to 5. Please keep in mind though that I own a golf course and play way north of a hundred holes every week, mostly at my place, so that much golf at the same place you can bet some good things are bound to happen from time to time.

I can see the writing on the wall for me and my distance as well. My golf was built on and largely is still based on 2 major componets, power and solid ball striking. My power for now is still there, I consistently move it from 290 to 320 depending on conditions and it takes a real miss to fall under 280. However for me to get and maintain that distance it takes everything I have. In fact I had one person describe my driver swing as "more akin to an act of violence than a golf swing." That act of violence is starting to catch up with me physically. If you want to see what I'm talking about search youtube for Golf Soup and you can see first hand what I am talking about. Anyway, though I still have my power I am seing my solid ball striking starting to wain a bit. Use to I felt like 95 to 98% of all my iron shots were dead solid I now feel like I am at 90 to 95%. And then comes the real problem, it starts to get into your head. As to where I used to know I was going to hit a solid shot, suddenly I'm thinking if I don't hit this club solid bogey in on the table and that kind of thinking can sometimes infect my entire game. So I have began placing more emphisis on my putter, the theory being if I have confidence in my putter, I won't be afraid or timid on my chips, and with confidence in my wedge, I'm not afraid to hit a bad iron shot and that frees me up to make more confident and aggressive swings at the ball. Maybe I am way off base but it is working very well for me right now. Thanks for the post.

I am 42 years old now and I must admit that my practice habits on my golf game have been anemic really since I began playing competitive golf at age 11. But now as my skills begin to deteriorate thanks to father time, I find myself having put in more P.T. than any other time in my life just to stay competitive on the "Fried Chicken Tour" and lowballs locally. So my question to you guys is, how much value do you place on the different segments of your golf game. Me personally, I must say that my putter get the highest percentage of practice time which with me is just common sense since that is the place the vast majority of shots are taken in every round. I guess I would break it down as follows for me: Putting: 50% Chipping: 25% Short irons: 10% Mid and Long Irons: 5% Driver: 10%. How about you guys?

I feel your pain, for I too play with a very strong grip and weakening it only leads to the shanks for me. However to your hooks, without seeing your swing all I can do is relate what works for me, and for me the first thing I change is my hand position at address. I'll bring the butt of the club which is usually pointed at my left thigh and point it more toward my left hip joint. This may require you to also become slightly more upright in you posture. If that doesn't work for me I go to the exteme and become very upright with my posture and then begin working it down until I find a sweet spot. But again, without seeing your swing and knowing that you have a strong grip, I could be way off base here, but give a try for a dozen swings or so.

Wow......, I had no idea this question would generate such great debates and responses. Now I want to weigh in myself for a minute. I can agree with just about everyone who has posted here. As a tournament player I agree with those who believe in playing strictly by the rules. For everyone who carries a usga handicap, I agree you should play to the letter of every rule as you know it because your handicap can have consequences to other players in tournaments, as other's can affect you as well. I do not believe every round you play should be exclusively for your handicap index, there is no way I would be enslaved to the system like that, but when you do decided to play a round toward your handicap, for better or worse be honest and record it. To those who don't strictly adhere to the rules, good for you too!!!! It is after all still a game and I say to each his own. As long as you are not cheating someone and if you and your friends are ok with it, play the way you want so long as it does not adversly affect others on the course. I do believe we should all strive to grow in the game and all get a better understanding of the rules however, me included. I am the host of Golf Soup, a golf program the airs on Fox here in Southeast TN. Some time back I was running a weekly contest for my veiwers, if they could spot the rule infraction that I purposely committed. I had huge responses early on as the infractions were simple and easy to spot, grounding your club in the hazard, not taking stroke and distance for OB, removing a leaf and moving the ball, but as the rule infraction's got more obscure, the correct and overall responses plummitted. And me personally, I was reminded how ignorant I was of the rules. Although I have a fair grasp on the rules themselves, I was stunned at how many times I was wrong about a penalty being a 1 or 2 shotter. Anyway, after seeing the spirited debates and diverse opinions, I think I will bring back the rules infraction for the show. Thanks to all of you for sharing your opinions.

I completely agree and understand with how you handle the out of bounds. I think in casual golf there should be no ob, just hazard to keep things moving and help everyone enjoy their round more. As to the "testing the sand" rule, I only learned of it first hand in '87 at large high school tournament. On the 16th hole with myself and two playing competitors were tied for the lead, locked in a great match, One of my competitors hit his tee ball in the left edge of a large fairway bunker. The rake was on the right side and he grabbed the rake walking across the bunker and drug the rake behind him to first take the shortest route, and second to keep the bunker raked. My other competitor approached me and asked if I witness what player A just did? I had no idea he committed an infraction of the rules, but as it turned out it was a penalty. It was very awkward scenario but in the end I won the event by 1 shot over each of my competitors. The victory has always and remains tainted to this day for me. I would have never called the penalty even if I was aware of it because it is a STUPID rule. But that is how I know it. And by the way, the kid that called that penalty that day is now a P.G.A. tournament winner but still an ass.

Let me start by saying I am by no means a well read golfer when it comes to the usga and r&a; rule books. However, I do think that I am fairly well versed in the day to day rules that come up during an average round of golf. Some years ago while on a golf trip to Myrtle Beach with some friends, friends not near my skill level, we were trying to hash out our bets the night before our first round. My friends were asking me to give ridiculious amounts of strokes to them. I was a near scratch player and my friends claimed to shoot 85 to 90 on average. Finally after hours of negotiating I agreed to give each of them 35 shots on 18 holes on the condition that we played strictly by the rules. This was a mistake on my part as far as friendships went. I began on the first tee box by calling a penalty on one of them for teeing off in front of the tee markers, another was hit for searching for his golf ball in a hazard with using his club, another for raking his footprints behind as he walked to his ball in the bunker (testing the sand). I made them hit 3 from the tee when they hit it out of bounds instead of dropping where it went ob, like they normally would. when they hit it in the water I made them drop at point of entry or the drop area, not over the water as they did. By the turn they had not only conceeded their bets, it seemed for a time my friendship as well. So 2 questions here: First, Do you think that if the average golfer (85 to 105 shooters) played strictly by the rules that he would enjoy the game as much. Secondly, instead of asking if you have ever fudged a rule or unwittingly broken one, I like to know if there is anyone out there who believes they have never breached a rule of golf. I myself am not without sin and cannot cast the first stone. I thank you all in advance for your responses.

Very, very rarely will I not go for it. Too many times early in my career I tried to play safe only to skank an iron or tug it into the high rough and it wound up costing me the bogey I was trying to avoid. And I found out by going for it the vast majority of the time I became quite an accomplished scrambler and grinder. So I guess my opinion on this topic would be, if you have the ability to make a couple or three birdies in a 9 hole stretch and a above average short game, going for it all the time is not such a risky approach. If you don't have the game to pay for your mistake, the cautious approach my better serve you. But in the scenario you laid out I would say go for it. Sometimes a double-bogey can be like a good, swift kick in the butt and motivate you as you play on.

Will be hosting one of these tourneys in early November. It will be a two day 36 event, we will be playing 18 holes at my place vs the membership of another club and finish with 18 holes at the opposing club. Looking forward to it and will let you know how it goes.

I agree with Grumpter. I do play pro-v's but if I am playing in a scramble format where the one ball rule is not in effect, I will hit a nxt off the tee and it does seem to provide 7 to even 15 yards more upon rare occasion. However I can not speak to its playability on approach shots because I switch back after the tee ball.

Congrats of the albetros!!!!! You should have no regrets or misgivings over your incredible accomplishment. Double-eagles are far more rare than hole-n-ones and you are now part of a very small segment of golfers. I had a similar situation earlier this year as I also carded another double-eagle on a 447 yard par-5. Because it happened on my own course I had to call it in to the local newspaper. The reporter, a friend of mine, questioned and even gigged me little over the short yardage of the par-5, asking me "What's up with that? Shouldn't that be a par 4?" My response was simple, "that's the way they built the course, and all I can do is play the hole in front of me." As far as the plaques go, I can help you with that if you want to contact me. I have began manufactuering my own plaques for myself and those who make aces or double eagles at my course and I would be more than happy to get you one at a reasonable price if you like them.

Wow some great responses to this one, and I thank everyone on both sides of the aisle. My original train of thought on this process was to coordinate with and use the youngsters in the first tee program or possibly even inviting several local high school teams and let the proceeds of their time spent benefit their programs. These youngsters would likely not be experienced caddies but would have enough general golf knowledge to not hinder anyone and may provide an opportunity for a good learning experience for both player and caddy. But I must admit that as my thoughts drove further down the road, I think it could be a viable charity fundraiser. I am not suggesting this be coordinated soley between the course and charitable orginazation and when you show up at your club some Saturday that caddy day is sprung upon you. It would be the charity's responsibilty to fill the alotted tee times with players willing to participate and champion the cause of the group. Throw in trophies for the top five in net and gross and now you have a charity event where your playing your own ball. Me personally, I problably play in 30 charity events a year of which 99% are scrambles, captain's choice, what ever you call select shot in your part of the country. I would jump at the chance to play my own ball in a charity event. I know you could have the same tournament without the caddies, but my opinion is that the novelty of the caddies would draw more players. Anyway, thanks for the great responses both pro and con and keep them coming.

I've often thought about, yet never acted upon, having a caddie day at my course. If you have never played golf with the assistance of a caddie, you are missing a great experience. Playing a round with a caddie, especially and experienced caddie, is golf at it's purest form. I realize in today's fast pace world caddie's, at the majority of courses, are outdated and not practical. But my question to you is would you pay an addition 10,15,20,25, or 30 dollars once a year for the experience? I also believe this to be a possible alternative to the dieing charity scramble. If your group or charity were willing to volunteer as the caddies and you organized it with the golf course, it could be a great fundraiser with a side of healthy exercise as a bonus. Just a thought. Tell me what you guys think. And I thank you all in advance for your comments.

To buy new or used? That is a question I will soon have to answer for myself, for I am on the verge of change which I do not embrace. The irons I play with I bought new, but that was back in 1998......... I know it is crazy. But even crazier than that, other than my driver, my irons are the newest clubs in my bag. A look inside my goes like this, top-flite Ti irons (by far the 2nd most solid club I have ever hit) MacGregor Mactec driver (my 3rd one, busted the head on first 2), ping B-60 putter I got in 1989 or 90, Phil Mickleson PM lob wedge (great club, has almost no bounce and the sharpest leading edge of any wedge I've ever seen). And then there is the greatest single club I have ever hit, my callaway Bobby Jones, deep face 4-wood. I doubt there will ever be a club head made that hits the ball more pure than the deep face bobby jones I have. I recently experimented with some 3-woods to see if I could gain just a bit more distance but ever could. I tried beit Taylor made, callaway, macgregor or others, at their best they were all at least 10 yards behind my 4-wood, so unless I lose that club, I doubt I ever buy a new replacement for that one. I am in need of upgrading (or downgrading if you ask me) my irons because the face of them has become to slick and I can no longer get the spin I need at times. Will I buy new? If I find a set that feels right in my hands, yes. If I find a used set that feels right then I will by used. However if I find a new set that feels right in my hands I will not wait and try to find a used set of that same club for cheaper because I do not believe any 2 sets of identical clubs are the same. If you are buying off the rack, you will never get identical reactions out of two different sets.

I love the game of golf. Because I own and operate a small 9-hole facility I essentially spend seven days a week on the course. Much of my time is spent working, but there is always time left to play plenty of holes each week, weekends especially. It is not unusual for me and my friends to play 45 to 54 holes in a day on weekends, but that is at my own course where I can control tee times and pace of play. However, when visiting other public facilities in my area it is the norm to spend 5+ hours to get in only 18 holes. And no matter how much I love the game, frustration always sets in when having to hurry up and wait. What are your ideas on speeding up play to make everyone's overall esperience more enjoyable. Myself, I feel educating the slower players is the best course of action. Many of my newer members and players at my course did not grow up playing the game like myself and have had noone to teach them the proper ettiquette of the game. It is possible to tactfully teach most players, though not all, and it will produce much more positive results than just bitching about the problem with the faster more educated players. But I believe that the approach you use and the words you choose to breach the subject is very important. Now that having been said, not everyone is going to be receptive to coaching. Just the other day I had a member say that "he paid his money like everyone else and he'll play at any pace he wishes." I do not like having to deal with that comment but from time to time I must. My respnse was peacefull but very firm as I told him that I can not allow one individual spoil the afternoon for 40 others and that the greater good of the masses must come before the individual. He of course still was not happy, in fact fighting mad at this point, and not willing to change his habits so I was forced to return his money and ask him to leave telling him that playing here is a privilage and not a right of his. Was I wrong? Other ways I have found to speed up play amoung my regulars is playing double bogey max. And on rare occasions I have even asked groups to skip holes, although I always allow them to go back and complete the hole to complete their round. Give me your thoughts on the slow play, if any, at your courses. Thanks for your feedback.

WUTiger, I appreciate your well thought out and well read response. I have been thinking along the same lines as you on the management contract, but am going to wait out the winter to see if my prospects in a negotiation would be stronger after the cold months. Anyway thanks for the great response.

Sean, I run into the same problem on a daily basis. It's sord of an old guard vs new guard scenerio. I love the old guard because they are colorful, wise, and very fun to play with but they have had their run of the place for so long it is hard to bring change to bear around here. In the two years I have been here I have slowly...., slowly implemented changes to benefit the greater good but to this point it has been a slow go. I have a great group of guys as a whole, but it is by far the new guard that generate the greatest amount of money for me. So I guess at the end of the day I have a battle of old vs. new vs. my family and bank account. The old guard here deserves respect and I give that to them, but my family deserves food on the table and that will win everytime.

I agree with the cookie cutter reply. I am a former pga and teaching pro. Though I rarely......., very rarely, teach anymore I am helping my brother who has recently taken up the game as a serious player. My brother is a large man and frankly not capable of making the same moves I make during the golf swing. So we have to build him a stance, posture, hand position, and swing that allows him to work with what he has and around his belly. We have had to try countless combinations of them all until it finally clicked with him. We are all built differently and gifted differently mentally and physically so look for a pro who will work with what you have to work with and a pro that encourages you to constantly experiment, with his teaching in mind of course, on your own.