ChrisWev

Hi I'm in the UK and will be looking to get a new set of clubs fitted soon, basically I've got a few quieries if anyone can help. My set of clubs were bought from static measurements (Ping G20, Black Dot, Aqua grip, Regular shafts), measuring hand to floor, height and grip size etc. I never hit them or checked them on a lie board before purchasing (I would have been too nervous to do this as I was awful). G20 driver is 10.5 in regular, same as hybrid. G25 3W is stiff (I think) and I probably deliver this consistently straighter than any club and will be keeping this. I've noticed the lie of some of my irons seem very toe high, especially the PW etc, I couldn't get into a decent stance to have the club sat how it should be (v slightly toe up?, not level), and I do hit about 50% starting left, I've messed with grip and even the weak grip ones can start left etc. I now understand that this can be down to lie angle but as my clubs are cast they aren't as easily altered? Anyway, rather than mess around with my old clubs I want to get fit (dynamically as well as statically) for something more modern and and with lofts, lies, shaft flex that will actually suit me (for at least a year or so till I can hopefully get to low double digits). My driver swing speed on last check (a while ago) was about 105mph. With this in mind I'm guessing I will likely be in the stiff range for all my clubs and this may slightly explain why there is a lot of variance (other than what I'm doing wrong) with my irons. I kind of liked the forgiveness of the cavity backs and beginner clubs but they have always launched high for me, and I'm not mad on the look of the offset. So after my rambling, would the following suit as a starting point (I wan't a bit of background before going to the fitter, when I find one): 105mph driver S/S (on last check 6 month ago) Is it worth going for forged (for later adjustment if necessary), softer feel might be nice too Don't think I wan't much offset as I've never struggled hitting it high or squaring the face, don't really like the look of offset either Think I might need stiffer shafts I don't want blades as I'm nowhere near good enough to hit them Does anyone know of what recent clubs may suit the above (and my level)? Is it worth trying a new shaft in my current driver or basically just looking at a newer model? I'm not that fussed on cost if it's going to help Do any of the UK guys know a good fitting place, preferably in the north, that are not tied to one manufacturer? I've checked a few of the other threads and nothing recent seems to answer my questions, so hopefully not repeating anything here.

Depends how well I'm playing and what ball. I've hit a 9i carry that far with a rock hard ball and then fly off the back green. But at that point my 8i would go about 140 and roll on (hard ball). Then a couple of weeks ago I would need to hit a 5i to carry 150 as I was flipping and hitting it too high. Now I've sort of fixed the high launch/ flipping and using a better ball I would say if the pin is 150 I would hit a 7 and possibly grip down a touch. If I hit it well it "should" go 150/155 and the spin should hold it. If I hit it bad it would probably go 140 and then roll out to 150 ish on a green, as it would likely spin less. I would expect in a couple of month or so that 7i would change back to an 8i.

I've saw: Foxes, lots of foxes Local kids riding motorbikes on the course stealing players balls (don't play that course anymore) Me hitting a thin 64 degree, like a bullet that wen't about 15 feet of the ground straight into the railings outside the clubhouse, on the second tier (where a LOT of guys were drinking). That made one hell of a bang! One guy from another group snap his club in fury, then walk over and snap a guys club in our group who laughed A massive swarm of bees, came directly at me about 6 feet of the deck (I panicked big time!) in Tucson when I was over there with the RAF in about 2004 (about my 3rd round ever) We don't get much of the dangerous wildlife over here, don't think we actually have anything that could kill you, maybe a Bull could, but you don't get many of them on golf courses.

I'm not at your level but when I stopped practicing short game and was messing with long game swing and just playing I lost the same distance by flipping the club at impact and adding loft, although I imagine you would have noticed this on course. I'm sure many others will say it but post a video in the swing thread section.

Obviously this is personal preference (I used to sit the ball back too), but I changed based on some advice form a few people, certainly of the younger generation. Do you not find back of centre is a bit old school and robs you of loft (on every club) and can be difficult when it's wet (and in the rough for me)? You're making your lob wedge into a 45-55 degree or something by doing that. I know I wrote earlier (can't edit it) about "ball forward" but, that's just what I'm thinking, I mean on the line of my heel, which seeing as I point my left foot out 45 degrees on a narrow stance is actually middle or slightly forward of middle. I find this much easier, consistent, get more loft and the bad shots are nowhere near as bad. You will, then it will become your best friend. You might be finding it hard if your stance isn't open as if you don't it (apparently) doesn't give you time to get your hips into a good impact position, it's like being already set in the correct place with the stance open.

What I've been doing (an how I think when setting up): Open stance to target, narrow stance, ball forward, weight slightly forward, shaft slightly forward, grip down to the end of the grip, DON'T MOVE HEAD and keep weight in the same place and be "pro active" with the swing. If I try to hit it soft there's too much variation and anything can happen. There's hinge and hold, clockface, mirroring swing on the take away and follow through, accelerating to the ball, using gravity to the ball and a million other different ways. Practice a couple of the techniques (you will probably already have one) on 50 yard shots and see which is the most accurate. Funnily enough - for my PW: Back swing to 7:30/ 25% with a bit of hinge = 30 yards carry +/- 3y yards Back swing to 9 O'Clock/ 50% with about 90 deg of hinge = 50 yards carry +/- 5 yards For me it's the gripping down that's the key, there's so much more control. The longer shots tend to hold the greens better as if they are struck with more pace they spin more (if using a decent ball). Obviously you can do this with almost any club and with some practice you can reduce the variation right down (I don't practice this enough to be honest).

Before my recent high launch/ flipping issues I thought I was striking my irons well and above average amateur distance (150 8i carry), probably as on course I only remember the good shots and not the fats and thins. Now when I'm practicing on the LM I hit 5-10 warm up shots, and then start a measurement test of 15 shots. I use the best 10 for my gapping, but all of them for dispersion. I take the info out of the LM (as it plots it awfully) and copy it into a basic spreadsheet/ graph with a trend line. Turns out all my old "good/ long" hits were overdraws or hooks and my bad ones were short, high and and to the right. The only things I'm concerned about now are the percentage within 5 yards left and right of centre and the distance of the ones in that central range. Whilst also keeping an eye on the percentages left and right. Physically being able to see this plotted kind of makes things hit home and is why I've altered a few things. If you don't know what your misses are or what the bad shots are it's hard to get rid of them or work out a plan to manage it on course. Now I've realised that the majority are around 140 for the centre hits, 150 for the overdraws and 130 for the pushes, with about 35% being in that central range, 50% left and 15% right. Work to be done. I've also been monitoring putting (although I knew this was bad), what I didn't realise is every miss on a level surface is a pull. That also needs looking at.

Once thing I've just noticed on my grips, is the old Ping grips had long lines on them. If you drew a line all the way from the bottom "white" groove of the club so it runs up the shaft it would continue into a long line on most of my clubs. I had always set up the grip of my club to one of the long lines (as they were all bang straight when I bought them). I noticed earlier that my 7i is about 5 degrees closed if I set up on the line now and a couple of others are the same. Might be something to keep an eye on if you've got grips with lines on them.

I suspect you've got the wrong end of the stick Lihu, I'm sure you've seen a few Guy Ritchie films and have heard of Cockney Rhyming slang, but anyway: Apples = Apples and pears = Stairs Barney = Barney rubble = Trouble Septic = Septic Tank = Yank I think he was talking about RAF Regiment and UK military terms, so not much chance of any others from across the pond understanding. Cockneys talk in code, it's even hard for me and I only live 200 miles from them . I know you aren't all from the USA or whether you guys think us calling USA guys yank's is bad, but we see it the same as you guys calling us brits etc (not a problem at all). Either that or he really does think you are all Skeptic's (and miss spelt it) or even Septic and he just doesn't like you lot .

Thanks, it made me feel a lot better. I was getting pretty mad with myself since I started hitting it way too high. I think because everything was going so high I was trying to absolutely smash it to make up for it, which was just further compounding the problem and also making me move my head. At least one good thing has come out of it anyway, I don't seem to be hitting it in the heel now, it's toe now if anything, lol. I don't really want to be going through that again, so from now on: Concentrate on 1-2 things at the most at any one time (not 12, as before) Only two full swing sessions before practicing some 30-70 yard shots (hinge hold type makes it difficult to flip, so it's short game practice as well as stopping a full swing bad habit) "Work the bag", the smash bag that is Putting practice for 10-15 minutes every day/ other day Try not to do too much too quick as that seems to give from one and take from another, it's not really progress Don't go more than a month without seeing my pro or posting a video

Well, there's a shock! Had a few hits on the smash bag and this happened: I was very surprised, these were pretty good hits with the 7i......and miles better than I had of late since I had been flipping. Then I realised they were with my 8i once I looked at the impact tape, nice surprise! These were the first 7 hits before I took the impact tape off, hence the very low spin numbers (which will have no doubt improved carry, but nowhere near to the degree of how short they were). I'm sort of back happy again now! I had it set up as a 7i in the program, basically picked the wrong club up. Went back to the stronger LH grip (which turns out wasn't that strong at all, 2.5 nuckles). RH grip neutral. Wasn't really paying much attention to direction or path either. Club speed data is calculated, so don't pay much attention to that, probably explains why the SF is through the roof thinking it's a 7i.

I was delivering the club pointing left sometimes. He weakened my rh (which was underneath), but i think i may have weakened my lh too (where as that might have been ok).

I think I might reset my GG stats at the end of winter and do the same, basically just use a different tag for any shot that is out of the "norm". Saying that, I suppose the average distances don't really mean a lot (I could just ignore them). It's the approach data and misses left/ right/ long/ short that are the most important and having the largest data range has a lot of worth.

Well done for a good year Pete . I've just got a decent mat too form Verde Sports, wish I had your field/ garden to go with it! I'll be shopping for a new house soon and pitching area is one of my priorities :)

Thanks for the input guys. I've been hitting a few 8i concentrating on not flipping and it looks like my LA is back to what it was before (about 23 degrees, still a bit high probably) but the distance is still miles short. Getting a bit concerned to be honest. I went from carrying the 8i 135 (a year ago), to 145 (about a month ago) and now about 120. It feels like I'm hitting it well, maybe there's something else off or I've beat the balls to death (although I would say this is unlikely). 7i was 155 and 6i about 165 on the better hits. I've checked an old video and it doesn't look like I was flipping back then (or moving my head as much), so god knows where they have crept in from. I'm starting to think that me changing my grip slightly weaker (pro's advice) about a month ago has totally killed the power and I've not been able to make up for it elsewhere. I'm going to try a few 7i's tonight as that's probably the club I've got the best ability to compare to previous results. Should also get my smash bag today to I can try a few more drills out to get a bit more lean. I've looked at the key 3 two ball drill. It looks alike a bit like Micklesons hinge and hold. I used to practice that a lot with my short game practice, I wonder that now I've not been practicing it much that it's let the flip in? Also been working on putting 6 footers this morning in 5 ball sets for about 20 mins on the putting mat, I was making about 40% when I started and every single miss was a pull. I had never noticed this before. Anyway, by the end of it I was making 60% then 80-100%. I also think my counterbalance putter might be too long, when the putter is level the counterbalance weight is right near my sternum. I think I might do this little putting drill for 10 minutes each morning with the Straight Back Straight Through Mirror (Elk's Key, or whatever it's called), and not let my self leave until I get two sets 80% or over in a row. I've looked at the pro's stats and they're anywhere from 50%-85% with 6 footers, on fast sloping greens though. I should be able to get 80% of these on a level surface, I would imagine a pro to get 95/100 doing the same drill.

On from the earlier posts regarding the high launch I've been practicing a bit with trying to stop flipping. My follow through feels totally different now, and hands feel higher, it feels good actually. That was the only thing I was thinking about when swinging so other bits are probably all over the place, but I'm not bothered about that until I ingrain this in. Before and after: I'm not too sure really what you guys mean about clearing the hips, but I'll read up on that as something to tackle in the coming weeks.

Unless it's the ball you play with (the one's you buy) I would just hit it back onto the range, or if you see a guy whack a game ball towards you on the range and it's safe, just wedge it back to him. I must loose 10 balls a week at our practice area but find another 10 of different types. Only bother using my collection of nomad balls when I'm just concentrating on the swing, not where the ball goes. Any meaningful game time or ball flight stuff I want to be using the same ball ever time.

I've never really thought about that TBH and it's not something I hear mentioned a lot. Do you mean start the swing with the torso, like Rory whipping his hips and body around like a spring uncoiling? Lihu mentioned flicking/ flipping which I know is bad and I never realised I did that so I will look into that first as that's certainly killing my LA, unless you mean the same thing? I like the youtube guys M&M; Golf and Crossfield so will give the below a whirl. Not sure whether I should totally sort this collapse out first.

Bloody hell, a 460 par 4 would give me nightmares :( At best I would have to go 250 (including roll), 180 hybrid, pitch, putt, putt! that's 3-4 hard shots for someone like me! Yeah, my gripe is with our type of golf clubs and HCP system, although the US one ain't great either. For me it's a big problem over here, it's like everyone likes to have an artificially high handicap so they can sandbag and score 45 points. People whinge when they get cut, when surely it's a good thing? 90% of the comps at clubs are Stableford, Matchplay, Scramble's, Greensomes, 4BBB etc. It's too much of an easy way out being able to shoot a 12 on a hole and just forget about it and bogey the next and everything is great. Personally I dislike it (other than for a matchplay Ryder cup/ pick your team scenario), for me I want my handicap to be a low as I can physically get it, I couldn't care less about winning a bottle of wine on a Thursday night in a 4BBB. Everyone should be accountable for their scores and made to putt out if playing for a prize, at least that time people can put 20 cards a year in, rather than the normal three or five or none. There's old guys playing at my club that pretty much get 45 points every time in stableford, playing off about 20 for the last 10 years apparently, because they "can't make" the medal for their handicap, even though half of em are retired! If I was you I would ignore your handicap and just play any format you can (other than BB) and just putt out everything, then just tot up your card against CSS/SSS and adjust your handicap on any full "normal" round. Personally I've used rounds where I go out on my own and "play honest" but for your level you need the rounds where people are watching, with the extra pressure etc. Randall's SG SSheet will give you a cracking insight though, for the rounds that aren't competitive, but the way I see it, any rounds you're playing with these top guys is enough personal pressure as you can get? Anyway, just change that 5.1, it's doesn't look like you're anywhere near that now, probably closer to scratch!

Might have a slight problem going any higher though as my shoulders are unstable due to me used to being working on aircraft with my arms above shoulder height (also playing hockey too) and now having a desk job (muscles contract to hold them forward apparently, I forget what the problem is but it's very common). Anything above 90 degrees to my shoulders makes them sort of pop out as the muscles are tight forwards apparently. This is very treatable though, but as I'm going through knee MRI's (causes foot pain from a crushed nerve playing hockey) and nerve tests it's not something I can tackle at the same time unfortunately as the NHS physio's aren't great at sorting one thing out. I should have my knee results next week though and once clear of that I can concentrate on my dodgy shoulders and back. There's no pain in my knee or foot at the minute (and nothing from golf) so don't worry too much about thinking you're going to cause me medical problems, I'm fully aware of what I can/ can't do and what I will try etc.

You beat me too it, I was going too post this! After that point my shoulders stay the same angle just lift up more as I swing further back. Think that may be due to be being told to "swing around" more and being scared of a steeper backswing as I used to be very steep on downswing and very out to in (hockey again).

Yeah I feel like I need to stand upright, and sort of arch my back back/ upwards! As if I don't I look very hunchbacked (too many years working on a computer) on the DTL, upright doesn't make me feel all that comfortable in all honesty, but it's how I've heard and seen I "should be"? I'm not sure what you mean by flattening shoulders? Would this be poor rotation? I've played field hockey all my life which is very much a no rotation and big collapse swing, which is hard to get out of. I've quit hitting the ball playing hockey though, at 33 I'm past it now anyway! So now I'm trying not to collapse I'm not getting a full swing/ need to get more rotation to compensate for irrepetable collapse swing? I know it may not look like it but that collapse is nothing compared to last month. I can feel a change which has greatly helped where I impact on the club face, even though it is still nowhere near looking "textbook". I experimented with the golf tee/ towel/ headcover under my right armpit on backswing (to keep it locked in) but it just didn't feel great and led to some crazy strikes which I can't risk in the garage/ swing room (had a few shanks zip past my head)! It's going to take some serious stretching to get my shoulders 90 degrees to my lower body (if it's even possible). Going to be more medicine ball work I think.

Even though I'm 100% behind what he's saying I find this guy little bit hard to understand/ relate to, maybe it's because he just looks so young or it's just a different teaching method? I find it much easier by looking at how cogs work and then by Crossfields videos etc. This guys description of the change in gear effect (specifically about how COG effects) with regard to where the tungsten weight goes is very good though.

Must have been some kind of bizzare de-lofted flier fluke, I can't understand how it beats my best 7i by about 10 yards though, yet my longest 9i is 184! Funny thing is I've loads of 8's in the 165-190 range(total), must hit a lot out of the rough!! I'm not trying to claim I can whack it btw (far from it), I'll be totally honest in saying these "good" hits are from my often strikes out of the light rough! Generally an 8i used to carry about 140, maybe up to 150 at absolute best (but usually a pull) for max distance. Now my 8i goes about 130 carry at best (and then spins back!) due to my ****ed up loft :S Most of my longer shots were using Bridgestone e7's too, not even god could get any club to go above 5000rpm with them . Sound great for distance but playing every shot from the back of the green as it's bounced through is false economy!

I've got kinovea which is cracking for splitting it up, drawing lines (swing plane) and doing frame by frame etc. I've rarely used it recently though as I can only film my swing without real balls (limited garden) outside, don't want to risk my neighbours cars/ windows. Most of my work is in the garage and can't film in there or on course (no time to set up). I would have used my iPhone instead of the SLR (120 or 240 FPS) but it narrows the FOV too much to be worth anything. Really appreciate the effort of breaking it down for all to see though, should hopefully give others an easier insight into how to help/ educate me :) I would bet $20 that you would expect me to have some kind of software/ anylitical tool to video my swing though?