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Everything posted by Shagbag
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I'll be 60 next month and had a major health issue a couple of years ago, coupled with a left hip that required a full hip replacement procedure. I had a minor heart attack in 2007...I had no chest pains, but felt like I had major heartburn that radiated a little from my upper chest into my throat. It persisted off and on for several days, so I decided to go into the emergency room. To make a long story short, Doc said it was a heart attack and one of my arteries was almost completely closed. Didn't need by-pass, ended up getting two stents and everything has been fine since. A few months later, my hip would lock up on me, which was very painful. Cutting to the chase, a THR fixed that. I haven't done much these past few years to prevent these issues from recurring. I'm a big guy (6-4) who has a very big frame. I am able to carry my weight very well, but I admit I was VERY overweight. I've weighed anywhere from 295 to 310 probably since about 2002. I also smoke and I know I was a poster child for another heart attack or stroke. My wife is 23 years younger than I am, and she's a fit little thing. She's always hinted it would be good for me to get on a program and lose some weight...something my doctor is always preaching to me about as well. Up until about 2002, I was fit and worked out. So I decided it was now or never and took action. I decided to tackle the weight problem first. Didn't think it was a good idea to try and lose weight and stop smoking at the same time. I put myself on a 2500 calorie diet to start off. I'm no expert or anything, but it's not rocket science and there's a lot of free advise and calorie counting software available free on the internet. I didn't really exercise for the first two months, just counted the calories, while keeping track of "where" the calories were coming from. I weighed in at 302 to begin the program and after two months on the program I weighed in at 277. At that point I reduced my calories to 2100 per day and I continued to lose weight, about 1.5 lbs per week. Still no exercising to speak of. Last week I re-jioned the fitness center I used to belong to. It has everything...weights, all the cardio machines, swimming pool, hot tubs, steam room, sauna, racquet ball courts, hoops, classes, etc. I weighed in at 273 when I joined. Haven't weighed in since I joined but I will probably weigh in once a week now. I do the stationary bikes, threadmill, and most of the weight lifting machines for the various parts the upper and lower body. I also spend lots of time in the steam room, sauna and hot tubs. I'm going to stay on the 2100 calorie a day thing, excercise regularly and see where I end up. Like I said before, I have a very large frame (52 inch chest) and I look the best between 240 and 250, believve that or not. My doctor agrees that 245 would be a great weight for me, so that's my goal weight wise. The next immediate goal is tobbacco, which is going to happen very soon after I'm into the regualr exercise routine full steam. I am feeling much, much better and based on past experience I know I'll feel even better down the road! Just thought I'd share
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Was given draw driver by mistake... proper way to correct?
Shagbag replied to johnclayton1982's topic in Golf Talk
There are only three proven methods to help players who fight cronic slices or fades. High MOI drivers don't really promote a draw, but they do help to promote straighter shots, especially on "off center hits". Closed face angles, usually about 1° to 1.5° can offer a little help in this respect as well. Offset hosel drivers are only for those who really need help in his area. You can get drivers with 1 or a combination of all three of these engineering concepts. Another concept thats been marketed to death and is simply "marketing hype" is the idea of "heel biased weighting" to correct fades/slices. The headweight of a driver is such that it's impossible to redistribute enough weight to specific areas of the head to make any difference whatsoever. Don't buy into this concept, it doesn't do anything to change the flight pattern of the ball. Drivers with screws for this purpose are pretty much a joke....except when these screws are in the back of the driver (opposite the face), they will help move the center of gravity further from the face ever so slightly, which is a good thing, but will do nothing to promote a draw. Cleveland is one of the companies who promotes the "weight biased" marketing hype. That concept will do nothing. But these Cleveland Draw Biased drivers also come with a 1° closed face angle. That's a concept that does work, but only slightly. It will not change the pattern of your ball flight significantly enough to really notice, but it may help shots which are the result of an occasional poor swing be a little straigher than with a square or open face. So in my opinion it's nothing for you to worry about...you simply have the same version of the regular non-biased driver, the only real difference is that you have a slightly closed face angle. An important consideration is also "how you feel about it"! If that word "draw" on the sole of the driver "worries" you, then you should take it back because confidence in a club is extremely important. Personally, I don't fight a fade or slice BUT I do prefer a driver with a 1° closed face angle. I also prefer a high MOI driver. So naturally I use a High MOI Driver with a 1° closed face angle. -
I have set of 6 Irons (6 thru AW) shafted on Grafalloy ProLaunch Blue Graphite Shafts (R Flex). This set was MOI matched and the resulting swing weights range from D3 to D5, which is consistent for MOI matched clubs. Clubs are in 9 to 9.5 condition, tough to wear titanium faces ;) I'm 59 and thought I'd go ahead and try graphite. This experiment didn't work for me and I'm going back to steel shafts. I'd use these heads again, but it's just too much trouble to attempt to remove the necessary weight that was added to the heads in order to shaft them with the graphite. This would be a top notch set of clubs for anyone who uses graphite shafts. Asking $240 shipped anywhere in CONUS. When you take shipping into the equation, this price is less than the cost of shafts! And take my word for it when I say the heads cost more than the Grafalloy ProLaunch shafts! PayPal ok.
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Tom Wishon on being fit for clubs
Shagbag replied to glock35ipsc's topic in Clubs, Grips, Shafts, Fitting
All these companies manufacture quality products made from the finest materials and in the best foundries...the same foundries the major companies use. So from a "materials" and demand for strict tolerances in the finished product standpoint, there is virtually no difference. Do I think one of the component companies is somewhat better than the other companies? Yes, but that's simply based on my experience working with most of these companies, the design features I've seen first hand and it is quite simply my own opinion. I'm not trying to defend one company and trash another. I got into this discussion because of my opinion on Wishon's books. Haven't changed my opinion on that matter and I could care less if anyone else has changed their's as a result of my posts. I had an opinion and wanted to express it. A little off the subject, but I think the one basic concept that sets apart the quality component companies (all of them, not just Wishon) is the "New Technology" marketing angle each and every year by the major golf club companies (the Taylor Mades, Titleist, Ping, etc, etc). These days with limitations on head size, COR, grooves, etc, there is really no new technology to "sell" each year. Most companies aren't selling anything new, just recreating the same basic designs of the past with different fancy cosmetics and calling it something else. I remember when Ping was a great golf club company, recognized for innovations. Ping, under the original owner and founder, could have cared less about cosmetics. Not so today. Major golf club companies think they need the fancy cosmetics to compete. There's nothing different under all that eye candy. What should sell is a proven design that was created with custom fitting in mind. Companies like Wishon...and KZG, Alpha, etc included, don't come up with new radical designs each and every year and try and pass it off as some type of new technology. A good many of these component companies' designs have been around for several years and are still going strong. If something isn't broken, you don't need to polish it up, use different colored graphics and fancy medallions and then pass it off as something else. Major golf club companies do this every year because they can't survive making the same models each and every year....why would you need to buy this year's model if it's the same as last year's? Consumers should really take a long hard look at exactly what they are buying each and every year. Some of the clubs being marketed this year have been marketed in past years...but sport a new look today with perhaps that new fancy paint job and a cool shiny new medallion. Sorry for getting off the topic a little. My rant is over and feel free to own your opinion, that's what makes this country great. -
Tom Wishon on being fit for clubs
Shagbag replied to glock35ipsc's topic in Clubs, Grips, Shafts, Fitting
You're entitled to your opinion, but I will say this in closing. The owner of KZG golf is far from a custom fitting expert. Tom Wishon has more than 30 years experience in designing golf clubs and in custom fitting. He's chosen not to work for the major companies because they simply cannot custom fit mass produced golf clubs based upon the requirements of a single individual. Both Scratch Golf and KZG offer great components. The quality is there. Are they superior to Wishon's designs, nope. Are they inferior, nope. The difference between Wishon and KZG is that each and every component offered by Tom Wishon is designed and manufactured with custom fitting in mind and each component in the line offers something different which equates to a better fitting capability for varying player styles. Another difference is Wishon has been in the industry for 30+ years and the owner of KZG has not and that owner was not even part of the golf industry to my knowledge prior to opening KZG. I build custom clubs for a living and I use other quality components besides those produced by Tom Wishon Golf Technology. I used to carry KZG as well, but no longer do so, dropped them about 5 years go for good reasons, none of which I care to post on a golf forum. Here's another interesting fact for you ... did you know the number two guy at Wishon Golf Technology used to work for KZG? I don't think he has been working with Wishon for the past 8 years because KZG offers a higher quality product. I find nothing wrong with Wishon attempting to educate the golfing public with respect to custom fitting. I also don't have a problem with him charging a price to do so, he is the most qualitified expert in the field of custom fitting and there is little doubt about that. Again, I have yet to find any "trashing" as you put it, with respect to the competition (major manufacturers). He simply states they don't do true custom fitting and sometimes the specs and tolerances are sometimes not what they should be... and that's all true. Don't think he's been sued by anyone yet ;) You know what the book is about before you buy it. Don't buy it if you think it's propaganda. Just a question for you...did you buy the book and read it? If you did buy, I'm sure you could sell it to someone who doesn't think it's propaganda and recoup some of your investment. I'm betting you probably didn't buy it. After all is said and done, you have the right to your opinion and I have the right to mine. Truck on to the next hole brother! -
static weight vs. swing weight?
Shagbag replied to Texas solo's topic in Clubs, Grips, Shafts, Fitting
Really? I always thought it was because graphite is lighter than steel. I also always thought swingweight was pretty much just a "number" that presented the balance of the components used as measured on a fulcrum and had nothing to do with total weight. All things being equal, i.e. headweight, grip weight and shaft length, I was under the impression that steel shafts would ALWAYS produce higher swingweights that graphite shafts. Well....since I can make a sledgehammer swingweight to D3 with proper components and a feather light graphite shaft swingweight to D3 by adding weight to the head and lightening the grip, I guess what I always thought was true, is true. And to take it a step further, I could make the sledgehammer swingweight higher than the feather light graphite club if I so desired. And if I did so, I can also guarantee you'll swing the club with the feather weight graphite shaft faster than the sledgehammer. -
static weight vs. swing weight?
Shagbag replied to Texas solo's topic in Clubs, Grips, Shafts, Fitting
I agree with the previous poster. About the lightest "reliable" steel shaft you'll find is between 85 to 90 grams, with most closer to the 90 gram mark. -
The shaft has little or no effect with respect to "getting the club through the zone quickly" UNLESS you have a very late release. Most amatuers have an "early to midway" release point. If the club is released early to midway the shaft has done everything it's going to do with respect to "unloading" (or whatever term you choose for downward flex action during the downswing) well before the clubface arrives at the hitting zone. The downward flexing action of the club occurs instantly when the club is released.
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I agree, cleaning grips will make them last much longer. I quit using soap a long time ago. I wouldn't recommend using any soap whatsover, especially "concentrated" soap. You'll never be able to get the residual soap residue out of the grips, which will tend to "rot" the grips over time. I've found the plastic scrub brush and very hot water works just as well without having any soapy residue left behind. Hot water and a good scrubbing will remove all the dirt and oils in the grips. Using soap simply adds another contaminate to the grip in my opinion.
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Tom Wishon on being fit for clubs
Shagbag replied to glock35ipsc's topic in Clubs, Grips, Shafts, Fitting
Let me begin by stating this post isn't intended to a "personal" attack or anything, but I thought you had some interesting views, especially with your propaganda statement, that I'd like to comment on. Every golf company uses "progaganda" to help market their product. Doesn't Taylor Made make a point of stating their drivers are used by more pros than Callaway, Ping, Nike combined? Not sure exactly how they put it, but something like that. Progaganda is defined as presenting "facts" which can positively influence an audience. Progaganda will omit "facts" that quite possibly would not be beneficial to the ultimate "goal". I think if you really researched Taylor Made's claim you'd find that although true, the real underlying fact is they developed more endorsement deals with pros than all the other companies combined. I think Wishon presents tons of facts in his books which are undisputable. He has attempted to educate players about custom fitting, specifically how they can benefit from the process. Does he have an utltimate marketing interest in promoting custom fitting? Sure he does, but so what. You're allowed to market your product to the public. All companies market what they have to sell. You make it sound like a sin. I've read all his books and personally attended training conducted by Tom Wishon. I've never heard him trash the quality of major golf company equipment, quite the contrary, he says these products are top notice from a manufacturing standpoint...but the product could be even better through individual custom fitting. Likewise, I've never seen where he's slandered any of these companies in print. I've never seen his company being sued for slander by any of these major companies. Must be some sort truth in what he's published and promoted. As a matter of fact, I believe Wishon and other companies devoted to custom fitting have forced major brand companies to offer some sort of custom fitting options so they can attempt to garner sales in this area as well. Wishon has a research, test and development center at his headquarters. I believe he has data to back up his views with respect to custom fitting. His abilities as a design engineer are quite impeccible. In over 30 years as a design engineer he's been credited with more than 50 design "firsts". That's quite a few more than anyone else in the industry anywhere. Sounds like I'm a Wishon "commerical", I know. But my main point is this...he does know what he's talking about. He's been sought after by more than one major golf company as the head of design, research and development. He turned down these positions because he truely believes in custom fitting while the major companies are only interested in marketing and sales. He started his own company so he could be in control of what's designed without having to worry about the bottom line, which is overall sales with major companies. Does he have a marketing interest in writing his books and promoting his business? Sure he does, but wnat company doesn't? Does he tell lies and trash other companies in order to increase sales? I don't see it, he simply points out facts and you come to your own conclusions. -
Tom Wishon on being fit for clubs
Shagbag replied to glock35ipsc's topic in Clubs, Grips, Shafts, Fitting
Quote: Originally Posted by sean_miller What some people are saying is that there is a ton of selection in off the rack golf clubs and that the average golfer could play off the rack the equipment and shoot the exact same scores (if not better). There is a ton of golf equipment available right of the shelf, without a doubt. Most of what is available is quality equipment as well, at least the designs from the major golf club companies anyway. I don't Tom Wishon or any similar company who designs and developes custom components has or will ever try and dispute this fact. I don't think any custom club maker would dispute the quality of the equipment available off the shelf either. That's not the question here. The vast majority of what is available is mass produced, companies manufacture hundreds, if not thousands of sets a day. The majority of people who buy golf clubs will hit demo versions into a net before they buy. Most of these buyers will buy the product in the box they come in. Some will demand some sort of a fitting. So, for instance, they will end up buying a set of irons 1/2" over the standard length, with an "R" shaft, with the lie angle 1° flat and a mid sized grip. There are many scenarios for this type of purchase, with the buyer thinking he received a custom fitting. Custom fittings are much more involved than being fit for length, flex, loft and grip size. What I mean is the process of arriving at these options are more complex, with the resulting "options available" virtually unlimited. I agree, you can't turn a 22 handicap into single digit player through custom fitting. There is no substitute for solid swing fundamentals. But the vast majority of amateur golfers fall into the 20 to 30 handicap range. Most have swing flaws that will never change. Some have swing flaws that will get better because they will work on their game. Custom fitting offers so many variable options for the 20 to 30 handicapper to "help" compensate for less than stellar swings ((notice I did not write "correct or fix" these flaws) . These options can help to increase distance, enhance trajectory AND direction and promote a much better "feel". I also agree better players (0 to 10 handicap) can well with almost any equipment. But what makes you think low handicappers wouldn't benefit even more with a detailed custom fitting? I don't think anyone who plays golf for a living does so with equipment right off the shelf. There must be a reason for that. Just my opinion...doesn't mean it's worth the time it took me to type it out to you. It does to me, that's why I took the time. I believe anyone can benefit from a quality custom fitting to some extent. The process is generally less than the investment of what the major companies charge for their equipment right off the shelf. That will vary of course as some club fitters do charge a pretty penny just for the fitting process, but there are many quality customer fitters who don't "charge" for the fitting process if a purchase is made. -
Tom Wishon on being fit for clubs
Shagbag replied to glock35ipsc's topic in Clubs, Grips, Shafts, Fitting
I never said pro ball players didn't use custom ordered equipment. My point was there are many more options available off the shelf for baseball bats than there are for golf equipment. When I played baseball and softball I had many options available right off the rack...not so with golf equipment. So the basis of the post was any option is available for golf equipment through custom fitting. -
Tom Wishon on being fit for clubs
Shagbag replied to glock35ipsc's topic in Clubs, Grips, Shafts, Fitting
For someone who doesn't have anything against custom fitting you seem to make some pretty strong comments to the contrary. Custom fitting is not a cure all for one's golf game. There's no sustitute for practice and solid swing fundamentals. I don't think Wishon has ever said "It's not you, it's your clubs!!!" Any clubmaker who promises you that all you need are clubs that fit is probably not anyone you'd want to do business with. Solid swing fundamentals learned through practice and experience is the only way anyone is going to hit the sweet spot everytime. But I'd like to know my equipment is optimized and "working" for me, not "against" me when I do hit the sweet spot. A true custom fitting can enhance anyone's game and provide consistency. There is much more to custom fitting than figuring out someone might need longer clubs. Others have said people can do pretty good picking up softball bats, hockey sticks, etc right off the shelf. That's not really an accurate comparison...this equipment is available right off the rack custom fit to a great extent (don't bats have different handle sizes, overall weight, length, etc). There's more options available because only one instrument is needed to play that sport. A set of major manufacturer golf clubs could be assembled with hundreds of different options, yet you get very limited options off the shelf and perhaps a few more options if custom fitting is offered. Major companies can't manufacture hundreds of variations of the same product, it's not cost effective. If my car's not tuned, I get 18 mpg....if it's tuned and optimized I get 23. Not a huge difference, but it all adds up. -
Tom Wishon on being fit for clubs
Shagbag replied to glock35ipsc's topic in Clubs, Grips, Shafts, Fitting
Yes anyone can be fit for major manufacturer clubs, but in most cases the fitting process is at best a partial fitting. Custom club fitting is certainly not rocket science. But it does require a substancial investment for the proper tools and equipment not to mention the knowledge and experience to evaluate each individual player to make sound fitting recommendations; coupled with the ability and attention to detail necessary to properly assemble the clubs. Most professional clubfitters have a tremendous investment in launch monitors, gauges, loft/lie machines, frequency analyzers, moi counters, shaft profile data software which is required to properly evaluate and fit an individual player. The fitting process with a professional custom clubfitter and that of the major manufacturer is different to say the least. A major manufacturer will certainly measure swing speeds and launch angles and the individuals physical characteristic's and make recommendations as to shaft flexes and in some cases, limited shaft options. You'll get a lie adjustment and have your clubs made to a specific length. Do you think this is a true custom fitting? Do you think these are the only options you'll get from a qualified customer fitter? Do you think these companies are going to "weight sort" and "align" shafts? Are they going to take the time to evaluate launch angles, spin rates and swing speeds to search for a shaft profile that is optimal? If they don't have a contract with a specific shaft company already, they aren't going to recommend a shaft from that company as part of the deal. If you'd benefit from a 1° closed or open face angle on a driver, you think they will take the time to hand pick a head for you? Just a few questions for you off the top of my head. Have you ever disassembled a major band set of irons and measured the individual components? I have. My findings and the findings of others who have done this, would surprise you....and not in a positive way. But you and others will continue to purchase this equipment because these companies spend millions of dollars a year in promotions and advertising to convince you to do so. You think Wishon attempts to make custom fitting more complicated than it needs to be? That's a fairly broad statement and I'm not sure what you meant. Are you impling that every aspect that goes into a true custom fitting isn't important? And in closing....I simply what to do better than "OK". -
Last (Golf) Thing You Bought?
Shagbag replied to JYB's topic in Balls, Carts/Bags, Apparel, Gear, Etc.
Golf Balls....it's the only thing I buy in a golf shop. -
Shaft PUREing, Puring, or Spining
Shagbag replied to GreensDruid's topic in Balls, Carts/Bags, Apparel, Gear, Etc.
Shaft puring is simply shaft alignment to help stabilize the shaft during the swing. No shaft is perfectly symmetrical, so shafts can be inconsistently when flexed during a swing. There will always be a section of the shaft which is most resistant to bending (the spine). My take on alignment is to align the shaft so that the spine is at 12 oclock to assist in the "droop" produced when the shaft is released during the swing. -
Good luck with that, especially in Autzen Stadium which is one of the toughest places to play in the nation. I believe Oregon turned the ball over 5 times last year in your house and still managed to beat the Cats in overtime. Don't count of getting 5 turn overs this year. Autzen stadium is the loudest (decibel reading-wise) stadium in the nation. To quote Lloyd Carr when he coached Michigan and brought in the #3 team in the nation to play the Ducks and Lost...."That's the loudest place I've ever been in." Mr. Carr had played in more than a few stadiums in his time.
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You should be careful here when dealing with "pro shop clubfitter". What are his credentals? Is he a clubfitter because he says he is and works in a proshop? Precisely what is he going to do to custom fit you? There is plenty that goes into a true custom fitting, right down to the clubhead! The club head you want to purchase might not be the proper club head for you, but the pro shop guy isn't going to tell you that if you are inclined to purchase what they are selling. Might want to do some research with respect to what really constitutes a custom fitting. The Search for the Perfect Golf Club by Tom Wishon would be a good place to start....290 pages of why you should be custom fit and what exactly constitutes a custom fitting. It's worth cost of the book to know what you should be getting, how all the components of a golf club work, and exactly what questions to ask. Wishon does a great job explaining the more complex aspects of custom fitting in a way that's easy to understand.
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"The Search for the Perfect Golf Club" by Tom Wishon
Shagbag replied to iacas's topic in Reading Room
If someone wants to know the true benefit of custom fitting from the ground up, this is the book you need to read. There are probably a lot of golfers who don't know who Tom Wishon is. He's devoted his entire career (30 plus years) to custom fitting and designing components for that purpose. He's had offers to head up design, research and development for some of the major companies but turned those offers down because the major companies cannot truly custom fit the consumer. He has more "design firsts" than anyone in the business. The major companies offer an outstanding product, but what good is that product if it doesn't fit you? Some of these companies have a custom fitting program but none offer a true custom fitting in the strictest sense of what a custom fitting actually is. Wishon does an excellent job defining what a custom fitting is, 475 pages worth! He has presented some excellent analogies to illustrate custom fitting. Like if you purchase a baseball bat, they come if various lengths, barrel sizes, handle sizes, weights, balance points, etc. You can choose one off the shelf that you are comfortable with. There are literally hundreds to choose from. Golf companies can't do this because of the number of clubs that comprise a set. Building 50 or 60 different variations of the same model isn't cost effective. So they basically build "one version fits all" and call it "standard." Even if they have a custom fitting program, the best you're going to get is a shaft stiffness designation of "A", "R", "S" or "X", length of the club and Lie angle adjustment. Listen to Wishon when he says this is only the tip of the ice berg when it comes to custom fitting. The major companies spend big bucks to brainwash the public into thinking their product is the best available. They pay huge endorsement fees to pro's and have huge advertising budgets to accomplish this brainwashing. Who do you think pays these costs? The consumer every time they purchase a driver or set of clubs that don't really fit them. Trust me, this is an excellent book, if only to educate yourself on what you should be getting when you purchase a set of golf clubs. -
I am usually a solo player as well. I semi retired and moved back to Oregon where I grew up and have some life long friends, none of them play golf. I have one golfing buddy I play with who lives about 100 miles away. We manage to hook up for a round every now and then. I'm not in the Appleton area, but I used to go there quite often. My ex-wife's family all live in that area and I've played a few courses in that area (Winneconnie).
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Why were woods made of wood?
Shagbag replied to James_Black's topic in Clubs, Grips, Shafts, Fitting
Primarily because of weight. In the early days of the game all clubs were made from wood so as not to damage the ball. As the ball evolved to be made out of hard rubber, clubs made of steel began to be made and were called "irons". Wood continued to be used for Drivers and Fairway woods because of the weight considerations. As steel alloys improved and became lighter and lighter, companies began to experiment with making woods out of metal. I think Taylor Made marketed the first actual "metal" wood in the late 1970's. -
The Golf Station in Euless is listed on the Tom Wishon Golf Technology Clubmaker locator. Since Wishon doesn't list just "anyone", it's a pretty good indication of their clubfitting ability. I'd recommend staying away for retail outlets with respect to clubfitting. There are very few qualified custom clubfitters in retail outlets. Retail outlets are primarily sales motivated and you'll rarely find anyone who has any real clubfitting accreditation.
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The RBT 360 has been around for a long time. It's a solid driver head but it only comes in 9 and 10.5 degrees if I recall correctly. If you are new to the game you might need a little more loft than 10.5 starting out. But it's a good deal and I'd recommend getting it even if it's not a perfect fit right now. As your swing and swing speed improves I'm sure it'll be a pretty good club for you down the road.