Provisional ball question.

[brookter]

The question has never been whether the ball rolled back into the hazard.  The question is whether or not the ball was beyond the hazard margin line before it rolled back into the water.  It is not uncommon to include 5 or 6 feet of usually dry ground within the margin if that happens to be where the natural break of the land leads to the water.  If the ball hit within that piece of ground, then it was never outside of the marked hazard margin on the far side, and thus must be played from the point where it last entered, which was apparently right in front of the tee.

Thank you.

My question was actually about the interpretation of virtual certainty -- the credence to be given to a witness in the absence of personal knowledge, rather than than the precise location the ball entered the hazard. Apologies if that wasn't clear.

[Rulesman]

To be 'virtually certain' that a ball is in a particular place, the answer to the question 'Is the any chance that the ball may be somewhere else other than in that place?'

If the answer is anything other than an unequivocal 'NO', then it is 'virtually certain' that it is in that place.

Just because it can't be found is not the point.

[Dormie1360]

Thank you.

My question was actually about the interpretation of virtual certainty -- the credence to be given to a witness in the absence of personal knowledge, rather than than the precise location the ball entered the hazard. Apologies if that wasn't clear.

Sorry been busy, moving.  Yuk. The OP said he couldn't see the ball land from where he was standing.  His partner said he was sure it went into the hazard.  I wasn't sure if that meant he actually saw it go in, or he based his comment on  knowing where the hazard was and seeing the ball flight.

Witnesses can be used as evidence in determining virtual certainty.  But sometimes that's only one piece of fact finding.  The ball did turn out to be outside the hazard in the OP's scenario.

We often get these types of question regarding "certainty".  In reality it's hard for me to make a judgment when I didn't actually see it nor have the opportunity to interview the players.

[brookter]

Moving -- now that's one issue about which there's no uncertainty at all.... Yuk indeed.  Thanks for your reply.