PhilsRHman

I'm 90 pct sure it's a local rule that you get a free drop from all greens other than your own, no closer to the hole. I'm sure someone else can say for certain, but it's definitely not a penalty stroke, since you're taking a drop out of respect for the course, as opposed to being in a hazard, etc. The other question is, whether or not you MUST take a drop. I know there are plenty of examples of guys chipping/pitching off their own green when it's a funky shape and they can't putt. But that's far different than hitting a 9 iron.

I'm still smarting from this one. Smoked a drive on 1, put a 6-iron just off the green, chipped to 2 feet, then missed the putt. Second hole - 210 yard par 3, dead into a howling 30 MPH wind. Wind didn't matter, topped it into the shit 50 yards up. Took a whack at it, no one ever saw it come out. By the end of the hole I made an 8. By the end of the day, the scorecard was so ugly, I couldn't even be mad, I was just laughing. 111. What a day. How can a person go from 77, 80, 81, 81 in a two-week stretch to a 111????? First theory - it was a course, and all those others were on a tougher, but more familiar track. If I hit it 60 yards left at home, I know exactly where it will be. Here, I lost at least 4 balls just off the fairway thanks to fescue and brush on every hole (one hole I hit a sand wedge from 70 yards, just missed the green and never found it in the heavy rough). Add in a lot of blind shots and it was a debacle. Second theory - My prior round I didn't hit the ball well and decided at the range I need to have better posture and hold my hands higher at address. Spending a week thinking about that stuff without the chance to get to the range just really messed with my head. Third theory - Out of my comfort zone. Simply getting out of my routine completely screwed me up. There was no driving range and I got on the first tee right after a 3 hour car ride. The wind seemed to mess with me, too, as I tried way too many knock down shots. Didn't help that the greens were just aerated and I didn't make a single putt over 2 feet (and missed at least two from 2 feet or less). I can't blame the 111 on a couple putts, but I do think it got into my head, especially given the fact I made 6 straight bogeys and still managed 111. Fourth theory - Just a brutal day and everyone has them. The next morning on another new course I shot 41 on the front before ballooning on the back, but I chalk that up to some bad news I got on the course and losing all concentration. Anyone have any advice for how to deal with a day like this? I'm glad I got back out the next day so I didn't stew for a week or two thinking I forgot how to play the game.

Phil's win today was especially special and emotional for me. He's always been my favorite, and in turn, my grandmother is a huge fan of his (whenever the phone rings on a Sunday afternoon if I'm not by a TV, if it's her calling I know Phil's in contention or winning because she wants to let me know she's watching and thinking of me). She's such a fan that this summer she came to visit so I could take her to a tournament and watch him play, which she called the "highlight" of her life. She might be 75, but that day she was as excited as a teenager who saw her favorite rock star. He even signed an autograph for her after the round and she got to tell him that she prays for Amy every morning, and he thanked her for that. Fast forward to this weekend. My aunt (my mom's sister) passed away of cancer, which she has battled for two years. It's been a very sad few days, which is to be expected when a young woman in her 40s passes away and leaves two college age kids behind. Needless to say, turning on the TV and seeing Phil atop the leaderboard really brought out the emotions. It was nice to escape reality and watch some golf. I'm not a really religious person, but it's hard to think that someone from above wasn't trying to put a smile on some faces that really needed them today. Since I know that sounds as crazy to read as it feels to write, I'll just send this message -- Phil, unknowingly you became an even bigger part of our family history today. Thanks for all the great memories, the type that bind generations and make golf a game for a lifetime.

I volunteered at the Barclays, marshalling at the practice facility and clubhouse. Harrington stood out to me as the most fan friendly of all the big stars. I was always pretty "eh" about him, but he's launched into my top couple players to root for after that week. The first day, it must have taken him 30 minutes to make the 200 yard walk from clubhouse to driving range because he signed for every kid and fan along the way, chatting the whole time. Compared to others who were too busy on the phone, or simply blew people off (Els and Couples were surprisingly icy toward the fans) Harrington was fantastic. He was also one of the few that had a real rock star aura, which shocked me since I didn't think fans would respond to him as they did to Phil and Tiger, but among golf fans, he was very well recognized.

I'll second the post about thanks for keeping this thread alive and keeping us posted. I've been trying to plot out a calendar for getting into more competitive golf. First step was joining a club, where next year I'll take advantage of even the weekend tournaments just to get my game used to playing with something on the line. Tentatively - since I need to shave another 1.5 strokes off my handicap in the next couple of months - I'm looking to play in the NJ Mid-Am and NJ Am qualifiers. I think they both required qualifying scores in the upper 70s this year, which isn't beyond what I can do on my best days. More importantly, I want to use those spring tournaments as a barometer for where I need to get to for the 2011 season, in which I hope to be competitive in state-wide amateur events. The long-range goal is to have my game in shape to play in the USGA mid-am by 2012. I've got a long way to go until I get my handicap to the required 3.5 for that one, but hell, it's 2-plus years away. I feel like the fact I brought my index from 13 to 8 this summer without a ton of work other than playing a lot means there's still a lot of upside. Although I feel like I'm 62 some days, truth is, at 32, it seems I've got lots of good golf years left. Of course with my luck, my soon-to-be wife will pop out a kid next year and I'll be back to playing once a month and on special occasions! She great about me getting out of the house and playing now, but I'm sure that'll chance when Jr. arrives.

I think you need a crash course in the mental game. You're currently falling into every pitfall possible. Forget about qualifying or not. Since you don't know if 74 or 84 will qualify, all you can do is play your best, keep sharp focus on each shot at hand, and see what it adds up to at the end. Also, the time to overhaul or fix or tweak your swing is obviously over. You don't reach a handicap like yours without having a solid shortgame, and that's what will matter, regardless of how you hit the ball. You need to make a very concerted effort tonight and tomorrow to put all thoughts of mechanics out of your head and trust that the game you've honed over years will deliver you results. On the range tomorrow before your round, forget all the mechanical stuff and think of hitting targets. Give yourself a nice amount of time at the putting green and think only of making putts, and chipping to very specific targets. If you need a shot of confidence, the entries are open to anyone up to 10.0, which means you're twice as good as some, if not most, of the field. You just need to play your game, take dead aim, and see how it all works out. Best of luck, and make sure to stop by with an update!

Add me to the 5W camp. I gave up on my 2H Rescue after swearing for the 10th time I was going to snap it over my knee if I hit it into the woods left again. I'm sure now that I'm playing better I should give it another shot, especially because I'm not exactly tearing it up with my 5W. To tell the truth, I'm hitting my 3I so well off the tee (215 with a gorgeous little low draw) that I'm tempted to break out the 1I and 2I again and see if I can't get them back in the mix. Can't imagine there are too many people opting for long irons, but think it might be worth a shot.

Funny to hear your explanation. It makes perfect sense. On the other hand, I think the reason I play better on tighter driving courses is that I tend to pay more attention off the tee and play with more strategy -- hitting 5W, 3I, or will focus more on exactly where I have to hit my driver. When I know that I can spray it 50 yards left or right, I end up playing bombs away and simply trying to overpower the course.

As I've mentioned, the Little Red Book is the closest I've ever come to formal golf lessons. I also read a bit of Ben Hogan's book, but they struck me as polar opposites. Mr. Penick is all about feeling the swing, using anecdotes, and never overcomplicating the game of golf. As I started to read Hogan, I felt like I was in my high school physics class. Now that it's been a decade I should circle back and try Hogan again, but I've been very careful to steer clear of anyone who wants to get really technical about the golf swing. I'd love to know what some others think about this seemingly huge difference in teaching philosophy. Can they complement each other? Or will they just complicate?

I was just thinking about this myself. Since joining a club where the slope is 134 or 137 depending which tees I play, my handicap has plunged. Started 2009 at 12.1, creeped up to 13.2 in late June. The suddenly I not only started playing better (several rounds in the lows 80s and a 77), but they were all on a slope about 8-10 points higher than I'd been playing. The latest update and I've dropped to 8.3. Playing a ton of golf in August helped me replace a bunch of low 90s with low 80s, which led to the quick drop. So, are there skeptics out there about the system? I know it measures potential, but I'm not sold that I would be shooting 3-4 shots better on a 122 slope course, although I hope to find out this weekend when I've got a 3-day golf trip planned. Really hoping to close out the season with a couple more rounds in the 70s because I want to play in some state tournaments early next year with a handicap requirement of 7. What do you guys think of the slope/rating system? Does it overemphasize a good round on a tough course? Or even overemphasize a so-so round on a tough course? Is there an actual numerical value for how many strokes difference between an 80 on a 120 vs. an 80 on a 137?

Yes. You should be parrallel to the line of the ball's flight. If you laid a club at your feet and that club pointed to the target itself, then either your stance is incredibly closed, or your club face will be aimed a good 10-15 yards right.

I find that hitting a bucket of balls with alignment guide (a long iron on the outside of my ball) with regularly checking of my feet by laying the club down and then walking behind gets me more comfortable and trusting that I'm actually aligned right. Once I'm on the course, the easier way is to place the iron over my thighs (I've got the bad habit of opening my shoulders and hips at address, so this especially helps me stay square). What I'm trying to say is, use the range to get comfortable with what square looks and feels like, espcially once you take your stance, look at the ball, then at the target. When you're really out of whack, you'll look up for the target and be startled at how open/closed you are. But once you're used to it, you can look at the ball, look up and know exactly where your target will be. I'm really careful not to think technically on the course, but if things feel especially out of whack, the quick club on the thighs move helps.

Thanks, I just wanted to make sure it's not a tell-tale sign of something obviously wrong after adjusting my lie angles. I did realize I've gotten further away from the ball and have been slouching at address. Since watching the pros on at the Barclays last month I've paid a lot more attention to my posture on the putting green and it's paid off nicely with better, more consistent strikes. Now I think it's time I think about posture on the full swing. Standing slightly more upright definitely helped me hit crisper iron shots on the range and eliminated the occasional awful fat shot (I hit a 5 iron on a par 3 earlier in the day that took a 2-foot, nasty divot and was so far to the outside of the ball I have no idea how I didn't whiff completely). I'm only 5-foot-5 and I've always had a flat swing that leads to quite a hook/draw and in order to hit the ball straight I need to try playing a cut, so I think that means I swing quite far from the inside. I've also been told I have an old-style swing in that I drive much harder with my lower body and hips, thanks primarily to Harvey Penick's "Magic Move" of the left heel and rigth elbow driving the swing.

I'm striking the ball quite well, but noticed at the range yesterday (thanks to the cheap range balls) that I'm hitting the ball consistently on the same spot on all my irons -- slightly off center, toward the toe. I've always had my lie angles bent 3-4 degrees flat, and I'm not sure if this is a lie issue, a swing plane issue, etc. I know that club fitters use impact tape to check this, I just can't remember what it means to consistently be toward the toe and if it's an equipment adjustment issue or a swing issue (can't be the swing, gotta be the clubs ) Sorry about starting a new thread, but several searches came up empty on this question.

What happened to golf being a gentleman's game, the only one in which we call penalties on ourselves? This discussion is a demonstration of how far we've come and how pathetic people are to be looking for every loophole in order NOT to follow the rules of golf. Sad.

It's sad, but true how few people know the rules. My golf coach started every season with a session in a classroom, going over the rule book in language that made it easy to understand, and it always started with: Rule 1 - If you break a rule and fail to penalize yourself, you are disqualified. Rule 1a - If you witness a rule being broken and fail to call it, you are also disqualified (this is the 1.3 spoken of above, in language high schoolers get). Since so few golfers play golf in competitions (I'd say not a single friend I play with has every played in anything that required turning in a scorecard) they don't bother with learning the rules. I don't think it's a malicious thing, they just don't have the impetus to learn. But I will fully support those who say there is no gray area. The rules are very specific, and while there might be some instances where rules seem to conflict, there is the USGA Decisions book. The saddest thing is that we're arguing over such simple, easy rules as advice, and agreement to waive the rules. Actually, the saddest thing is that any PGA professional would have blown that one.

So I've suddenly gotten far more serious about my game this summer, and it's starting to show. My handicap has plunged from 13.2 early in the year to what my trend says will be an 8.3 at the next revision, thanks primarily to five scores between 77-83 in the past month, knocking out some scores in the mid-uppers 90s from early in the year. Decided that it's been 5-6 years at least since having my irons checked for loft/lie and since they're forged Wilson Staff RM Midsize, that were once bent 3* flat, chances were they were due for a review. I especially wanted to check the two used Vokeys (56 and 60) I picked up this year because they were flying noticibly left on full shots. Went to Golf Galaxy but they wanted to do a $50 swing fitting, but I explained that I didn't want new irons, and I knew that's what the goal was for the fitting, and I didn't want to waste their time (or my $50). They said they'd bend them if I knew what I wanted, but all I really wanted at first was the measurements (which I'd have paid for or tipped the guy to do, or whatever) which they didn't seem to grasp. Left there frustrated but found a small independent shop who said they'd get me all the numbers for nothing but it would be $5 to bend each club if I decided to. That seemed fair. Here's how out of whack my irons were: Club - Loft - Lie 3I - 20 - 55 4I - 22 - 55 5I - 26 - 56 6I - 31 - 57.5 7I - 35 - 58.5 8I - 39 - 58 9I - 43 - 60 PW - 48 - 58.5 Gap - 53 - 60.5 56* - 55.5 - 64 60* - 60 - 64.5 The one thing the guy couldn't get over was how much weaker my lofts are than "today's clubs" which I found funny since I can't believe how delofted "today's clubs" are just so people can hit their irons "longer" but that's another discussion. Anyway, we agreed to clean them up and get the gaps right. I should have thought about it before going to see him, but when I got home I found the original lofts/lies on these clubs and it turns out we're pretty much at 3-4* flat now on all of them, with the shorter irons and wedges a bit flatter than the longer irons. Is this right? Or am I now running the risk of short irons that are too flat? I also noticed that from one set of Wilson Staffs to another, there's a huge 2-3* variation in lie angles. Any idea why this might be? Here's where we ended up: Club - Loft - Lie 3I - 21 - 56 4I - 24 - 56.5 5I - 27 - 57 6I - 31 - 57.5 7I - 35 - 58 8I - 39 - 58.5 9I - 43 - 59 PW - 48 - 59 Gap - 53 - 60 56* - 56 - 60.5 60* - 60 - 61 Any club repair/custom fitting guys out there who can put my mind at ease and tell me we did this right? I didn't have total confidence in the guy who did them since I basically met him through the phone book. In hindsight I should have gotten myself onto a lie board to see if 3* flat is even right for my current swing, but it was a rainy day and I needed a few new grips and I was antsy to find out where my clubs currently were. At least now I know what my starting point is if I decide to make any adjustments.

I agree with a lot of what's been said here -- first, you can't have rabbit ears on the course. I find the more focused I am on my target, the less I'm distracted by people or by noise. However, there are some things that really will break your concentration. It's best to address it or else it will fester and really get into your head. I've played with a ton of beginners who just don't know that standing too close, or being in someone's line is a distraction. What I'm typically done, if that's the case, I'll act a bit startled that they created the distraction/movement (this works espcially on the greens when standing over a putt), back away, and apologize for the delay. They always get the point that they are the one who did something wrong, but you're not acting like a jerk about it. As for standing too close on the tee, I love that idea of walking behind and taking a practice swing. Even if it's just a case of visualizing from behind the ball, you'll be able to clear out plenty of room around you with subtle body language. And again, stepping away in an exaggerated way, but playing it down, will send the message, usually with a funny "if you've seen me make a bad swing you might not be safe there." They should get the picture. After a second or third time though, I'd just bluntly say, "do me a favor and stand on this side of me when I'm hitting, otherwise I pick you up in the corner of my eye on the backswing and it's a bit distracting." As with anything, you can come across as a jerk, or a personable in these situations. I find that being self-deprecating will always strike the right tone, but still help you get your way.

My uncle and I are looking for a good test up in northwest NJ since it's midway between both of us. We've always said we should check out Ballyowen sometime and we're thinking about going Friday. It looks like it would run us $125, which is about as expensive as you'll get in NJ for public golf. It seems to top most NJ public rankings, but I don't know anyone who's played there. Anyone have any input? We're both about 10 handicaps and hit it pretty long, so we've been looking for a place that we can grip it and rip it. I'm sure it's a great course. Just not certain it's worth $125.

As a young guy, I would suggest looking into getting a part time job at a local course. That was the best thing I ever did. Not only was the money great as a college kid, but the work was enjoyable (cleaning carts, helping members with their bags, cleaning their clubs when done, etc). If you find a place with a liberal policy for playing as an employee, you'll have the chance to play and practice a ton, plus you'll have great access to the pros to pick their brains, get impromptu lessons, etc. I still look back on the years I spent in the cart barn as some of the most fun of my life. And it was definitely the foundation for a game I can play and enjoy the rest of my life.

I pulled the trigger and joined a few weeks ago. I couldn't be happier. I've eliminated the "OK, I want to play, but where, when, with who ..." then try to organize a tee time, etc. When I want to play, I hop in the car, know I'll meet someone on the range to play with, or maybe it will be so quiet I can zip around the course by myself. At least twice I've played in the afternoon and finished a round in under 2.5 hours. And even during a morning round with another member and behind a few groups we played in 3.5 hours. Much better than the 5.5 hours I'd gotten used to. More than anything though, my scores have been off the charts for me. Over the past 6 years, my handicap had ballooned above 13 after playing in the mid-single digits when I was in my early 20s. Suddenly now, I've got a driving range, putting green and short game area that I can use as much as a I want. I haven't put in any major practice time, but 30 minutes a couple times are really paying off already. Especially when I discovered I was holding my putter way up in my finger tips and was way too handsy in my putting stroke. I needed a couple session on the putting green to get used to the adjustment, which is something I'd never do when I was always just playing "whereever" you know? Here, I feel like part of a club. I can just arrive, have something to eat, BS in the pro shop, hit the practice green, hang out a little more, head to the range, see if anyone's around to play, decide if I want to just warm up or put in a serious practice session, etc. It's been really fantastic. Being about to get there at 4 p.m. and get in 18 holes by 6:30 really opens up the chance to sneak extra rounds, too. My scores are really showing it, too. I went from a lot of rounds in the upper 80s to low-mid 90s. While I've still posted 4 rounds of 88/89, I've also shot 82, 80, 81, 77. Yesterday I shot 80 with two doubles and a three putt, so I felt like that round should have been in the 70s. It's amazing how playing more simply helps you find a comfort zone. I'm not sure if part of it is how tough this course is (6600 yards, 72.80 rating; 134 slope from Blues and 7000/74.60/137 from Blacks) that forces me to focus more, play smart off the tee (a wayward drive on any hole here will leave you in lots of trouble, unlike places where you can be 50 yards right/left and still have a wedge to the green from the other fairway), etc. It could also be the comfort factor of playing a course I really know well from my high school/college days, great pace of play, etc. All I know is that even when I was a 6, I might have been hiting the ball much better, but I don't think I understood all the tricks of both the short game and mental game I have under my belt now.

I guess there's no problem posting that it's Glenwood CC, in Middlesex County ( www.njgolfclub.com ). They've also got some junior memberships that are like $700 if it's something you're interested in. If anyone's interested, do me a favor and shoot me a PM, because I think if I join, I get some sort of credit if I refer people to the course.

I've had some nagging hip/leg pain the past year or so, but figured it was tight muscles, etc. Six weeks ago, I played 54 holes in two days, which was a lot for me. Woke up a day later with stabbing pain in my lower back/hip. After a couple days I saw a chiropractor who found some issues on my x-ray with a compressed disk at the bottom of my spine. He said it's likely been there a long time, causing the nagging pain, and then overdoing it made the pain elevate. Anyway, he put me on a twice-a-week program. First, I get 30 minutes with a massage therapist, then worked on by the chiropractor. He straps me into a table that bends in half, so he's able to stretch me out in a way I've never had before. It's like there's glue in my vertebrae, and he's pulling it apart. Hurts like hell when he starts, but by the end feels pretty good. I also get stretched in my hamstrings and calves. Fast forward 6 weeks to this weekend. I was nervous, haven't swung a club since I hurt my back, and don't feel great. Spent about 20 minutes stretching before my tee time, but just couldn't get loose. Turns out, I hit it better than I have in at least a year. Once I got going, I felt like all the stretching of the past month-plus must have done far more than I'd thought. No pain in my legs all day, back never tightened up. Swung within myself all day, which had to help, but I shot 83, and when considering I didn't make a putt longer than 4 feet, and had two triple bogeys (both from the middle of the fairway), it was by far my best ball striking round in memory. I felt so good that I went out for 9 more -- started with 5 pars, birdied 6, then finished bogey, triple, triple, all thanks to some go awful short game play, that I'll chalk up to rust and fatigue. What sort of experience do you guys have with chiropractors, massage, stretching, etc? As if I wasn't already certain that being loose and limber was huge, this really drove it home. Anyone have any programs they follow? I'm already planning to do some yoga/pilates once my back is up to it. Any good yoga for golf programs out there? I know there are special stretching tapes that seem designed for 80 year old dudes, but would probably help my fat ass, too.

So the country club I worked at through high school and college and basically learned the game on is struggling for members, as are all private clubs. This is very much a golf club, not a country club. No pool, no tennis, no fancy food (just a grill with sandwiches, burgers, etc). But the golf course layout is fantastic, 138 slope, 74.8 rating, hosts the State Open qualifier. Conditions were always the biggest issue, but they just put a couple million into it and had an architect come in to freshen it up, new tees, bunkers, etc. Typically a full membership there is just shy of $5000, which is probably as cheap as you'll find for a completely private course in central/north NJ, but still way more than I'm willing or able to spend. But, get this, they're offering full memberships for golfers up to 35 years old for $1500, to get more young golfers out, I guess to build a base for the future. Plus, if I join now for 2010, I get the rest of this year, too. There are no monthly minimums. Only added charges would be for carts, but half the reason I want to join is so I walk more and get into better shape. So, any thoughts? My fear is playing the same course over and over, although that's balanced with having a place I can always go to, have a tee time, and especially the fact range balls are included. Another problem is that if I want to bring friends, it's $85, which is a lot more than they would pay at the county course, and I'm not sure they would recognize that they're playing at a place worth paying double for. At this point, I'm thinking it's a no-brainer, especially since I'd say my average round of golf is about $75. That would mean I need to play 20 times between now and next December for it to be worthwhile financially. But I'm afraid there are some nagging questions I'm not even thinking of. Anyone out there think of anything I should check out?

Turns out my grandmother caught wind of me volunteering and told me it would be the highlight of her life to watch Phil Mickelson play. So obviously we're going to get her out there for a day. Question is, I think Tuesday is best, but since it's practice rounds I'm afraid it will be pretty random where everyone is going to be and it would be possible she's miss Phil if he plays first thing in the morning. The timing of Tuesday is also tough because I have something I have to do in the city that evening. Wednesday you're stuck with the pro-am, which isn't a big deal and should have smaller crowds. Question is, if there are 125 pros, how do they decide who plays in the pro-am? No way they could get 125 foursomes out there. I guess it could be 1 pro and one am, but that would definitely hold down the point - which is to raise funds, right? Thinking that Wednesday would be more relaxed and smaller galleries than Thursday, but maybe I'm wrong there. So, any suggestions for the best day would be great.