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Stats Question

wrx_junki

By wrx_junki,
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wrx_junki Great Member

wrx_junki

Some of these are hypothetical but for keeping stat.

1. If your 4th shot on a par 4 is a putt/chip from the fringe and you sink the next putt from the green. Is that considered a up and down?

2. Starting from what yardage do you consider it as an up and down?

3. If you hit your GIR and your next putt rolls off to the fringe, do you consider the next putt coming back from the fringe a putt?

4. How do you keep a scrambling stat? Is it for every hole that you don't hit a GIR?

Trying to keep more stats than fairway, GIR, and putts. Thinking of adding up and downs, sand saves, scrambling, and whatever else is useful. Let me know if you guys have any others that can be of use for me.

« Keith »

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Cooker Well Established Member

Cooker

1. Up and down:
Describes the situation where a player holes the ball in two strokes starting from off the green. The first stroke, usually a "pitch", a "bunker shot" or a "chip", gets the ball 'up' onto the green, and the subsequent putt gets the ball 'down' into the hole.

2. Anywhere starting off the green...(See #1)

3.Not Sure, I only count putts on the green...

4.Scramble:
When a player misses the green in regulation, but still makes par or better on a hole.
In My Bag:
Driver: R7 Limited Matrix Ozik X-con Stiff
3 Wood: 909F3 Aldila Voodoo Stiff
Irons: AP1 3-PW DG S200
Wedge: Vokey Spin Milled 54° NickelWedge: Forged 60°Putter: Rossa Balls: Pro V1XAvatar: Nicklaus North Golf Course, Whistler BC
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Razz11 Member

Razz11

You only count putts from the green. Any shot from off the green is not a putt even if you use the putter. So no, if you putt it off the green your putt coming back on to the green does not count as a putt.

In my Ozone stand bag:
Driver: 909 D2 9.5
3 Wood: MT-15
Irons: 1025-C 3-P
Gap: Spin Milled 52-06 Oil-CanSand: Spin Milled 56-08 RawLob: Spin Milled 60-13 Oil-CanPutter: AntiguaBall: Z-Star X

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zeg Great Member

zeg

You only count putts from the green. Any shot from off the green is not a putt even if you use the putter. So no, if you putt it off the green your putt coming back on to the green does not count as a putt.

False (well, although there is no Rule that addresses this, the USGA (I think) standard statistical method disagrees with you)

Your first putt is any stroke from the green (not including the fringe). *Every* stroke after your first putt counts as a putt, regardless of location. This is the only way that makes sense -- your stats should be punished if you putt off the green. Club selection never enters into the standard putt statistic.

In the bag:
FT-iQ 10° driver, FT 21° neutral 3H
T-Zoid Forged 15° 3W, MX-23 4-PW
Harmonized 52° GW, Tom Watson 56° SW, X-Forged Vintage 60° LW
White Hot XG #1 Putter, 33"

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iacas Hall of Fame Member

iacas

  • Administrator
1. If your 4th shot on a par 4 is a putt/chip from the fringe and you sink the next putt from the green. Is that considered a up and down?

Not in the true sense. But if you're a high enough handicapper that you want to shift the system (like in Scorecard) to count up-and-downs in that fashion, they're your stats, and if you are consistent that may serve you better until you're good enough to track them the more standard way.

2. Starting from what yardage do you consider it as an up and down?

Personally, anything inside of about 235 because I can hit the green from that far away. If I drive into the trees and have to chip out backwards, I still have to get up and down.

I don't keep an up-and-down or anything else when I take a penalty stroke or something. That wouldn't reflect reality. Not sure what they do on the PGA Tour when a guy hits one OB or something.
3. If you hit your GIR and your next putt rolls off to the fringe, do you consider the next putt coming back from the fringe a putt?

You're still putting from your first putt on.

4. How do you keep a scrambling stat? Is it for every hole that you don't hit a GIR?

Up-and-downs for par + sand saves.

These are all defined, you know, on the PGA Tour.com's stats site. Look at the bottom of any stat and it'll tell you how it's measured. A lot of them are also explained in Scorecard's manual.
Trying to keep more stats than fairway, GIR, and putts. Thinking of adding up and downs, sand saves, scrambling, and whatever else is useful. Let me know if you guys have any others that can be of use for me.

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DaveLeeNC Well Established Member

DaveLeeNC

Some of these are hypothetical but for keeping stat.

I use a home brewed system and collect data about my shots and generate statistics from that data. For me ...

1) I make a pretty arbitrary decision when I am a just off the green about 'is the really a chip or is it a putt' (just a quick judgement thing). If it is basically a putt then it isn't an up/down - otherwise it is. 2) 35 yards, although this is parameterized so I can change it if I wish. 3) For me everything after the 1st putt is a putt. 4) In my stats any shot inside of 35 yards and not on the green or in some kind of mostly impossible lie is an up/down possibility. Sand saves are tracked separately. To me this isn't a right or wrong thing - but 'what are you trying to learn about your game'. One of my most useful stats (for purposes of watching trends) is "Error at Par" which is how far am I from the pin after 1 stroke on par 3's, 2 on par 4's, and 3 on par 5's. I then compare that number (both average and median) to my average on that particular course. I find this useful for separating long game from short game trends (and better than GIR's). dave

In The Bag:
- Wishon 949MC 10.5* Driver
- Wishon 525 F/D 3W
- Wishon 515 949MC 5W
- Wishon 60* Cx Micro LW- Wishon 550M SW (55*)- Wishon 550M GW bent to 50* - Wishon 550C 6i - 9i (9i bent to 45*)- Wishon 321Li 3i/4i/5i hybrids- Odyssey Two Ball Putter

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Eeryck Well Established Member

Eeryck

Not in the true sense. But if you're a high enough handicapper that you want to shift the system (like in Scorecard) to count up-and-downs in that fashion, they're your stats, and if you are consistent that may serve you better until you're good enough to track them the more standard way.

So if you chip in to save par, you don't count that as an up and down? So in scorecard would you just mark that as "blank" for the U/D attempt, or would you mark it as unsuccessful even though you saved par?

Forget it, I misread the OP 3 times. Each time I missed the "you sink your next putt bit." I will have to mark myself as "Fail" in reading comprehension -E

In my Grom bag:

Driver........... Burner 9.5* S-Flex
3-Wood......... Burner 15* S-Flex
5-Wood......... Ovation 18* S-FlexIrons............. Pro Combos 3,5-PW Rifle 6.0Wedges......... CG12 52.10, 56.14, 60.10Putter............ 33" VP1 Milled PutterBall................ e6+ or B330-SRangefinder.....

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sam004 Well Established Member

sam004

I use a home brewed system and collect data about my shots and generate statistics from that data. For me ...

Dave,

I like this idea. This is my biggest weakness in lowering my HCP that I have noticed. I have countless shots per round because I missed GIR. I think the distance of your 1st putt is also good one too.

Driver: X460 tour- 9.5*
3-wood: 3+ - 13*
Hybrid: BB HW 20*
Hybrid: 24*
Irons: X-20 Uniflex SteelWedges: Colonial 56* & 60*Putter: XG SabertoothBall: GPS-8âIf you are caught on a golf course during a storm and are afraid of lightning, hold up a 1-iron. Not even God...

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