Different kinds of games

[bunkerputt]

I played 9 holes with two guys today.  Both of them had technically terrible, low ball speed, home-grown swings.  Neither were very flexible, both were very thin and flippy, and the shots just kind of went low and slow, and then rolled out 40 yards or so.  One guy hit 7 iron on a 165 yard hole and started calling for it to sit down as soon as it left the clubface.  I thought, dude, that's going to be 40 yards short, which it was when it landed, but then proceeded to roll off the back of the green.  I hit my shot, nearly the same total distance as that guy, same club, but it just rockets off the clubface, climbs, lands and backs up a little, all carry.  We get up there and end up shooting the same score.  This happened on almost every hole, with me losing ground in the long run.  I thought about throwing in the towel because both of these guys were beating me.  I realized they were much better at two things:  scoring, and scoring with the game they've got.  I'm starting to think that no matter how technically correct your techniques are, you are just waiting to get schooled by someone flipping a 7-iron 120 yards if you let them out-concentrate you on the course.  I wondered what they were thinking about.  Probably the target.  I was thinking about getting good extension, keeping my arm swing in sync, how quickly the pace of play was going, where I should stop and get a bite to eat on the way back....  Crap, I even thought at one point in my backswing how Nick Faldo was talking about how he thinks of all sorts of stuff in his backswing.

[Gerald]

On thurdays I play with a bunch of old fellows, some have low caps, some are mid ....... and I know a few that can top three strokes in a row and still make a lot of bogeys,,,,, it can be frustrating a bit, all those lucky bastard shots and still make a nice score......

[SpacklersEdge]

That's known as a hustlers swing

What yardages were you playing total?  I bet if you played tips of 6600+ they might struggle, or if the course had some forced carries etc.

Originally Posted by bunkerputt

I played 9 holes with two guys today.  Both of them had technically terrible, low ball speed, home-grown swings.  Neither were very flexible, both were very thin and flippy, and the shots just kind of went low and slow, and then rolled out 40 yards or so.  One guy hit 7 iron on a 165 yard hole and started calling for it to sit down as soon as it left the clubface.  I thought, dude, that's going to be 40 yards short, which it was when it landed, but then proceeded to roll off the back of the green.  I hit my shot, nearly the same total distance as that guy, same club, but it just rockets off the clubface, climbs, lands and backs up a little, all carry.  We get up there and end up shooting the same score.  This happened on almost every hole, with me losing ground in the long run.  I thought about throwing in the towel because both of these guys were beating me.  I realized they were much better at two things:  scoring, and scoring with the game they've got.  I'm starting to think that no matter how technically correct your techniques are, you are just waiting to get schooled by someone flipping a 7-iron 120 yards if you let them out-concentrate you on the course.  I wondered what they were thinking about.  Probably the target.  I was thinking about getting good extension, keeping my arm swing in sync, how quickly the pace of play was going, where I should stop and get a bite to eat on the way back....  Crap, I even thought at one point in my backswing how Nick Faldo was talking about how he thinks of all sorts of stuff in his backswing.

[tristanhilton85]

I play with old guys like this all the time... crappy looking swing and yet somehow they still manage to get around with a good score.  The thing that they have that I don't at this point is knowing exactly what they can and can't do.  They focus on hitting to certain spots and have good course management while I'm still focusing on my swing...

[Dabbler]

You've said it all in your post. My weekly golf colleague and I "collect" what you could call "scorers". We keep a mental note of all low handicappers with weird swings/ ball flights. The lowest we have right now is a guy who plays off 4. If you saw Jim at the range and took bets you'd be bankrupted. Awkward swing, weird follow through and ugly looking low fade. The only clue would be if you watched were his balls are landing when he's hitting the same club; all within a six foot circle on the range. But then you and I wouldn't see that because like you (maybe) one of the things I'm moat drawn to is the look of the swing. I famously once creamed a drive dead straight, high flight and with a considerable roll. My group were all hollering with glee, only to see me annoyed that I had nearly fallen over in my follow through and struggling to keep balance!

[bunkerputt]

Originally Posted by Dabbler

You've said it all in your post. My weekly golf colleague and I "collect" what you could call "scorers". We keep a mental note of all low handicappers with weird swings/ ball flights.

The lowest we have right now is a guy who plays off 4. If you saw Jim at the range and took bets you'd be bankrupted. Awkward swing, weird follow through and ugly looking low fade. The only clue would be if you watched were his balls are landing when he's hitting the same club; all within a six foot circle on the range.

But then you and I wouldn't see that because like you (maybe) one of the things I'm moat drawn to is the look of the swing.

I famously once creamed a drive dead straight, high flight and with a considerable roll. My group were all hollering with glee, only to see me annoyed that I had nearly fallen over in my follow through and struggling to keep balance!

I was really only looking at the ball flight and lag through impact.  Everything else can look as awkward as it wants too and you can still play some good golf.  The course was pretty short, par 30 or something, 6  3-pars and 3  4-pars.  We played from the "tips", which means the longest par 3 was 190 with about 160 forced carry.  One guy dunked it in the water, dropped, then got up and down for a bogey.  The next hole, he hits some kind of serious mishit along the ground into the woods on the right, then throws another ball down and sticks it to 8 feet from 180 yards.  Makes the bogey.  I hit a beautiful 6-iron that barely missed the green and then I failed to get up and down for the same score.  You wouldn't think our games were that many light years apart from looking at the scorecard.  It was a short round, so maybe in the long run.  I don't know what their handicaps were.  I remember watching one guy on the tee and thinking, "Does he know his club face is shut and this shot is going left?"  Hits it left...  then he gets up and down for par.

[bunkerputt]

I guess one thing that was missing on this particular course with these course regulars was forced carries.  All of their iron shots had about 30-50 yards of roll.  That seemed to work great because there was never anything protecting the front of the green, so you could just run it up there every time.  It was also pretty windy, so a low runner seemed to work best.  I guess I might have had them if the course were longer.  I've never had an ultra low-flat runner in my arsenal, unless I catch it thin.  All of my shots have a ton of spin.  I can hit it medium-low, but it just climbs, or not if I back off, but it's still pretty high and stops quickly with a loud thud you can hear from the fairway.  I think another thing I've realized is that your game has to match a course to score well.  This course matched these guys games because it was short, pretty much no forced carries, and nothing guarding the green.  It also makes me wonder how much to adapt my game to fit a course.  I've pretty much been shooting for the games on TV:  medium-low wedges, medium-high long irons and drives.  Maybe that only works on TV.

[saevel25]

Yep, been there.. Had a guy drain a 40 footer to beat me by one stroke, pain in the ass..

[PiustheDrGolf]

OP's observation could be big jump to his game.  The game comes down to how low you can go or lower than opponents each hole. We as amateur golfers don't get to experience of competitive golf much.  if we look closely weekly senior torney in any golf club (usually point game and bet a dollar for 9 holes), we know how they play competitively.

I play 9 holes normally such as focusing on my swing or shots.  But for back 9, I go for lowest score. I don't think about my swing or (ideal) shots.  And time to time, register for PGA's Playing Ability Test to remind/test me if my Game is there or not.  Each year, my swing and shots are less likely when I was in teens or 20s, but my game improves each year.