My simulator experience....

[green6767]

Well, I was on a simulator today testing out new drivers. I was previously hitting an R7 425 Quad 11.5 degree with R Shaft. I have outgrown that one and its hard to get the ball straight now due to increased swing speed. I tried the R7 460 10.5 degree w/ S shaft and the R7 Super Quad 10.5 degree w/ S shaft. I honestly couldn't tell a difference. So at $100 less, Im probably gonna go with the R7 460. My questions are:

- My ball speed was between 145 and 155 MPH, what does that translate into a swing speed? The employee watching me said roughly 80% of the ball speed is your swing speed. Is that true, I just cant picture myself having a 120 mph swing speed, but who knows, I've never seen myself on video.

- My launch angle was between 11 and 15 degrees, is this ok?

- My average carry was about 250 to 260 yards with about 8 to 12 yards of roll. The employee also said dont pay too much attention to that as its not completely accurate. He said the main things I should be looking at were the launch angle and ball speed to find the right club.

- I asked about a shaft and they pretty much could tell me nothing. I would like a shaft that is suited for me. If the shaft on the club is the one, then so be it, but I hear of so many people upgrading their shafts because its one of the most important components of the driver and its important to get a shaft suited for your swing. So, based on the info I gave, would there be a recommended shaft for me? Im partial to Fujikura because of all the good things I've heard from many good golfers who ALSO use the R7 460. But which one? I have been to all the shops in my city and nobody does a definate "driver fitting".....which surprised me, so I'm kinda of clueless as to what I do for shaft fittings. Any help is GREATLY appreciated!

[glebert]

When I use the simulator I have a slightly lower ball speed (140ish) and on a launch monitor my SS was 103-106.

[green6767]

thanks for the reply. I have checked numerous places in my city but nobody has a launch monior...just similators. Hopefully somebody else can chime in with some input, I would greatly appreciate it.

[aquacooled]

glad things worked out for you and you were able to find the right driver..

if the rep said your swing speed is 120mph and your carrying 260ish, cant be right. With a swing speed that fast with that loft is to much IMHO of course I wasnt there and didnt see the read out from the monitor.. But the figures your telling me just dont match.. Was this a fitting pro or some sales rep from X store??

Tigers swing is 125mph with a ball speed of close to 180mph and he hits well over 300 yards... yours I could see around 90 ish maybe 98mph

I checked my swing speed and it comes in around 100 to 115 top, with this swing speed I can carry 300 yards. Of course it also depends on your angle of attack i.e. hitting down on the ball with the driver.. However again I wasnt there to see your swing results myself..

[green6767]

Thats what I was confused about too. Last year, on the course I could carry the ball quite far, but with not so much accuracy. Maybe 270/280 but with sometimes a killer slice. I have gotten over that it seems and my swing speed seems faster. Again, this was on the simulator and this "salesman" told me that the carry distance is off, and not to look at that so much, just the ball speed to determine swing speed. I have not been able to find a real "fitter" in my area. Kinda sucks, but I think Im making progress on which driver I will buy, just need to keep testing them out I spose.

I dont hit "down" on the ball with the driver, but I seem to de-loft the club at impact. Meaning my hands are a bit before the ball at impact. Thats why I use a 10.5 driver and not a 9.5.

[allin]

For good golfers you can multiply swing (clubhead) speed by 1.4 to 1.5 and get approximate ball speed. That would mean for an indicated ball speed between 140 and 145 mph a club head speed in excess of 98 mph maybe as much as 105. For solid shots that would translate into carries of between 250 and 260 and drives at least occasionally over 280, maybe close to 300. That assumes launch angle, spin and descent angel are all optimized. Those additional factors explain why Tiger hits it by guys with 5-10 mph greater clubhead speed.

[Fisherdude]

This is a very, very complex issue. Many commonly-held beliefs about loft, launch angle, etc., that have been around for decades are being shown to be incorrect by new computer launch analysis.

Green6767, you're right about your ball speed and swing speed. A ball speed of 140 or so would have a swing speed closer to 100, not 120. You're also right that your hand position relative to the ball at impact will have a big influence on the effective loft, and thus the launch angle.

Years ago the thinking on shaft flex was that if it was too flexible for your swing speed, you would tend to draw/hook the ball, not slice it. If the shaft is too stiff, you would tend to fade/slice the ball. But, it's not as much of a factor as you would think. The vast majority of players play with shafts stiffer than necessary, and this costs distance.

A launch angle of 11 degrees is ok, 15 degrees is too high.

If you can find somebody with a launch monitor, and not a simulator, I'd try to find that. I'm not certain you're being given accurate numbers.

1. Your natural swing tempo, and where in the downswing you tend to most accelerate, will determine the best shaft flex for you.
2. Unless you're a monster hitter, I'd probably be looking in the 10-11 degree loft range.
3. Biggest thing you can do to hit it farther? Hit it in the middle of the clubface. Use some talcum powder on the ball, or one of the indicator labels you can buy at Golfsmith, but find out where on the clubface you tend to hit the ball. Keep this in mind: If you hit it low on the clubface, the effective loft will be less than optimum...if you hit it high on the clubface, the effective loft will be higher. Most important: The average shaft length on the TOUR is 44.5". I'm guessing any club you look at will be 45-45.5". Do club manufacturers really think average players have a better swing than Tiger? Give some serious thought to going to 44-44.5", and make sure the seller can order one with the length you want, and keep the swingweight the same. See if they have demo clubs with shorter shafts. The sweet spot is worth another 15 yards, easy!
4. You need to know your angle of attack into the ball. This will have a huge effect on the actual loft and launch angle. You'll absolutely need a launch monitor for this. Your angle of attack should be from zero degrees to +2.5 degrees, i.e. level to very slightly upward. If your angle of attack is -2 degrees, you're going to need 14 degrees of loft to get the right launch, and you'll still end up with too much backspin and loss of carry.

If you don't want to get this deep, just hit as many different club/shaft combinations as you can find, and go with what works best for you!

[green6767]

Thanks alot for the reply! A lot of what you said makes tons of sense. I had an 11.5 last year and I was just launching it way too hard, im just debating between a 10.5 and a 9.5. Im leaning toward 10.5 at this point so I can keep learning. Im also leaning toward a stiff shaft, but I dont want to over do it. Definately NOT an X shaft, but a stiff I think will be good. I will see if I can find a launch monitor and get a driver suited for me. Thanks again!!!

[Fisherdude]

If you're interested in doing some reading, I would recommend "The Search For The Perfect Club", by Tom Wishon. He's the head tech guru for Golfsmith, and has been in the industry for decades. Very highly respected. This book came out around 2005.

Also, he has a new book out specifically about drivers. Can't recall the exact title, but Barnes & Noble will carry it. I would definitely spend the money before I dropped $300 on your new stick.

[North49]

Thanks alot for the reply! A lot of what you said makes tons of sense. I had an 11.5 last year and I was just launching it way too hard, im just debating between a 10.5 and a 9.5. Im leaning toward 10.5 at this point so I can keep learning. Im also leaning toward a stiff shaft, but I dont want to over do it. Defineatly NOT an X shaft, but a stiff I think will be good. I will see if I can find a launch monitor and get a driver suited for me. Thanks again!!!

Hey Green,

I just went for a full fitting experience at a place called Hot Stix Golf in Phoenix http://www.hotstixgolf.com . They had all the toys and a lot of drivers from me to hit. My guess is that you are not insane enough to fly down there, and then spend another $400 for a fitting session. But you seem to be waffling over shaft flex. Based on my 105 swing speed, I am defineatly going to a stiff flex. And because of my very high launch angles (some as high as 19 degrees) I am going with an 8.5 degree driver. I never would have dreamed of hitting that kind of loft, but when I tested the two clubs they lent me (Cleveland Hi Bore & Nike Sumo SQ) I hit them both pretty well. Still TBA on the purchase. I read about a golf fitter in Minneapolis (in Golf Digest about 2 or 3 issues ago)that does all that stuff, so maybe a "quick" trip down there will help you find the fitting I think you really need. Good luck. I hope to make the trip to fargo this year and try to play a few course down there. Les in Winnipeg.