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Posted
I could use some suggestions on a distance gap I have in my clubs on the upper end of my yardages. Basically, here's the problem: [U]Carry numbers[/U] 3W: 240-250 (estimate) 21 deg Hybrid: 210-220 (trackman) 4 iron: 215-225 (trackman) 5 iron: 205 (estimate) The problem is that I got new irons last fall and they made it so my hybrid overlaps with my 4 iron. Silly taylormade strong lofts. So, my hybrid is basically useless to me right now. The only time I find myself pulling it out of the bag right now is when I have a really bad lie in the rough. Which is less than once per round at this point. I'm looking for a club that will bridge the gap between my 4 iron and 3 wood. I have been trying 2 and 3 hybrids, and my results are consistently that my 4 iron is just as long as the hybrids. I am curious if anyone had suggestions. Here's what my thoughts are now: Hybrid is probably out, unless I can find the right 2 hybrid. Haven't been able to yet. I could try to order a 3 iron speedblade from TaylorMade. This is what I'm leaning towards now, although I'd need it done to custom specs. I don't particularly like driving irons. Haven't been able to hit them well and I want something I can easily hit off the deck. 5 wood seems hard to find, but could solve my problem. The issue is that I don't want to buy one without trying, and that's probably what I'd have to do because most golf stores do not have a stiff shaft 5 wood for me to hit. I have 4 wedges already, and I don't really need to put another wedge in the bag. So, anyways, any help is appreciated.

-- Daniel

In my bag: :callaway: Paradym :callaway: Epic Flash 3.5W (16 degrees)

:callaway: Rogue Pro 3-PW :edel: SMS Wedges - V-Grind (48, 54, 58):edel: Putter

 :aimpoint:

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Posted

A 5 (or even 7) wood seems like the answer, if you do not feel that the 2 or 3 hybrid is giving you the distance desired. Is there a specific brand/model of wood you're looking for that makes getting that club difficult?


Posted
... The problem is that I got new irons last fall and they made it so my hybrid overlaps with my 4 iron. Silly taylormade strong lofts. So, my hybrid is basically useless to me right now. ...

TM, the source of your problem ( ;-) my irons go too far!), might also be a solution.

Across the board, almost all* the current TM hybrids have a 19° 3H . With a stronger loft, and the general TM face hotness, possibly this could bridge the gap. Also, a 3H likely would give you better launch out of the rough than a 2H.

Check these models: SLDR S/ SLDR/ SLDR TP / Jetspeed / RBZ Stage 2 (which now only costs $129).

---------------------------------

*(RBZ Stage 2 Tour has 18.5° loft)

Focus, connect and follow through!

  • Completed KBS Education Seminar (online, 2015)
  • GolfWorks Clubmaking AcademyFitting, Assembly & Repair School (2012)

Driver:  :touredge: EXS 10.5°, weights neutral   ||  FWs:  :callaway: Rogue 4W + 7W
Hybrid:  :callaway: Big Bertha OS 4H at 22°  ||  Irons:  :callaway: Mavrik MAX 5i-PW
Wedges:  :callaway: MD3: 48°, 54°... MD4: 58° ||  Putter:image.png.b6c3447dddf0df25e482bf21abf775ae.pngInertial NM SL-583F, 34"  
Ball:  image.png.f0ca9194546a61407ba38502672e5ecf.png QStar Tour - Divide  ||  Bag: :sunmountain: Three 5 stand bag

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Posted
A 5 (or even 7) wood seems like the answer, if you do not feel that the 2 or 3 hybrid is giving you the distance desired. Is there a specific brand/model of wood you're looking for that makes getting that club difficult?

Well, I love my Ping G20 3W, so ideally, I would like a 5 wood to match that. The issue is getting the proper flex on the shaft. There aren't many stiff 5 woods out there. I would be fine with the G25 5 wood, but I haven't been able to try one of those with a stiff shaft. Seriously, I went to a Ping demo day and they didn't even have the option to hit a stiff shaft with the 5 wood. I'm just a little hesitant to order that club without knowing that it will bridge the gap. I don't want to spend $200 and then have the same problem. [quote name="WUTiger" url="/t/74587/help-with-distance-gap#post_990256"] TM, the source of your problem ( ;-)  my irons go too far!), might also be a solution. Across the board, almost all* the current TM hybrids have a [COLOR=0000CD]19° 3H[/COLOR] . With a stronger loft, and the general TM face hotness, possibly this could bridge the gap. Also, a 3H likely would give you better launch out of the rough than a 2H. Check these models: SLDR S/ SLDR/ SLDR TP / Jetspeed / RBZ Stage 2 (which now only costs $129). --------------------------------- *(RBZ Stage 2 Tour has 18.5° loft) [/quote] I've tired the TM hybrids and I don't like them at all. I've never hit one solid it seems. And, trackman has shown that I get the same distance from the TM 3 hybird that I do from my 4 iron. And I have the same issue with any 2 hybrid, plus added inconsistency.

-- Daniel

In my bag: :callaway: Paradym :callaway: Epic Flash 3.5W (16 degrees)

:callaway: Rogue Pro 3-PW :edel: SMS Wedges - V-Grind (48, 54, 58):edel: Putter

 :aimpoint:

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Posted
Also, part of the problem is that I've never liked TaylorMade's hybrid or fairway woods. Even though I love their irons and I have the R1 (and like that club too), there is something that doesn't work when I try out their hybrids or fairway woods. I feel like if I liked those clubs better, it would solve the problem. Alas, that's not the case.

-- Daniel

In my bag: :callaway: Paradym :callaway: Epic Flash 3.5W (16 degrees)

:callaway: Rogue Pro 3-PW :edel: SMS Wedges - V-Grind (48, 54, 58):edel: Putter

 :aimpoint:

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Posted

Two things:

1. Have you tried the PING G20 hybrids? Maybe, since you like that as a fairway wood, you might like their hybrids as well?

2. You're right, finding a stiff 5W is a bit tough. I'm just kind of going through sites, and have found a few options. You mentioned not getting to try the G25 in a stiff shaft, not sure if you have that same concern with a G20 stiff for a non-3W, but here's what I found:

-- Here's a site with the PING G20 available in 3-7W options, and they have both the standard and Tour shaft options in stiff. It's $150.

-- Dick's has a stiff G20 4W for $150, not sure if it's enough of a drop-off to help that distance gap. They also have the G25 in 4-W options and stiff, maybe see if one nearby (if you have a Dick's close) could let you demo one?

-- Golfsmith has the G20 4W and 5W in stiff, though the 7W is only in light and regular. $150, same as the others. They also have the 4W in a stiff Tour shaft.

-- Golf Galaxy has the 5W in a stiff, as well as a stiff version of the Tour model, both are $150 again.

So, like I said, if you're OK with the shaft on your G20 3W and are willing to go into a G20 5W without a test, it's there online for $150. If you're near any of those stores, you could call them up and ask if one is in-stock to try at the store. I kinda stopped looking at the G25 options once I saw a few sites with the G20 there, but I imagine you'd get a similar story that you can find it online (I think they were $200, though).

  • Upvote 1

Posted
Great suggestions. Thank you very much. I think I will swing by my local Dicks to see if they have it.

-- Daniel

In my bag: :callaway: Paradym :callaway: Epic Flash 3.5W (16 degrees)

:callaway: Rogue Pro 3-PW :edel: SMS Wedges - V-Grind (48, 54, 58):edel: Putter

 :aimpoint:

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Posted

What's the loft on your 3W? You are tying to fill a twenty yard gap at 230 yards? What with different wind and turf conditions, different lie angles, seems like splitting hairs at that yardage. But if you must, I haven't found anyone who doesn't like the tour edge fairway woods. Try a xcg5 5 wood from ebay, they are 3 years old and you can get them fairly cheap.  Their hybrids I am less impressed with and don't waist your time on a tour edge driver. But I have 3 woods, a 13 degree 3W and a 15* 3W and a 16.5* 4 wood and they make the ball fly a country mile and as straight as anything. Easy to hit off the turf. I have settled on the 15* for awhile, might put the 13* in my bag just to see.

In my bag....

Bombtech Grenade driver. 10.5* Aldila DVS60 stiff, 45"

Ping i20 irons, ProjectX5.5. 5 thru PW.

Tour Edge 3 Hybrid, Adams A7 4Hybrid

Titelist SM4 52-8. 56-12

Cleveland RTX 60-12 wedge.

Tour Edge xcg5 15* 3 Wood

Cheap crappy Wilson putter that works as well as anything for me.

It's a work in progress, I've only been playing for going on two years or so.


Posted
What's the loft on your 3W? You are tying to fill a twenty yard gap at 230 yards? What with different wind and turf conditions, different lie angles, seems like splitting hairs at that yardage. But if you must, I haven't found anyone who doesn't like the tour edge fairway woods. ...

madolive3 suggests a strong 3W as part of the solution.

Seems like your current 3W might be bunching up against your 4i. But, you can't figure out how much true gap you have without 3W Trackman data.

Also, we don't have physical specs on your 3W, or how many wedges you carry. If you had a detailed What's In My Bag in your sig line, you could save us a lot of guessing for possibilities on bag set-up.

What you need to do is go to a demo day and try FWs of different lofts and shaft types. If you find you can't hit a low-lofted 3W, you might be better to put three extra wraps of tape under the low hand of your current 3W, and just choke down a half inch to shave distance.

Focus, connect and follow through!

  • Completed KBS Education Seminar (online, 2015)
  • GolfWorks Clubmaking AcademyFitting, Assembly & Repair School (2012)

Driver:  :touredge: EXS 10.5°, weights neutral   ||  FWs:  :callaway: Rogue 4W + 7W
Hybrid:  :callaway: Big Bertha OS 4H at 22°  ||  Irons:  :callaway: Mavrik MAX 5i-PW
Wedges:  :callaway: MD3: 48°, 54°... MD4: 58° ||  Putter:image.png.b6c3447dddf0df25e482bf21abf775ae.pngInertial NM SL-583F, 34"  
Ball:  image.png.f0ca9194546a61407ba38502672e5ecf.png QStar Tour - Divide  ||  Bag: :sunmountain: Three 5 stand bag

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Posted

Question: what do you use those clubs for? Do you hit any of them off the tee a lot or choose one for certain situations? 3w off the deck?

In My Bag:

Adams Super LS 9.5˚ driver, Aldila Phenom NL 65TX
Adams Super LS 15˚ fairway, Kusala black 72x
Adams Super LS 18˚ fairway, Aldila Rip'd NV 75TX
Adams Idea pro VST hybrid, 21˚, RIP Alpha 105x
Adams DHY 24˚, RIP Alpha 89x
5-PW Maltby TE irons, KBS C taper X, soft stepped once 130g
Mizuno T4, 54.9 KBS Wedge X
Mizuno R12 60.5, black nickel, KBS Wedge X
Odyssey Metal X #1 putter 
Bridgestone E5, Adidas samba bag, True Linkswear Stealth
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Posted
I've got the mizuno jpx 825 hybrid for that gap I've had it bend to 17 degreesf! It knocked my 3iron mp59 out So i could place the extra wedge. I hit it better than 3i off the deck

Dirver: Mizuno JPX 825 9,5 Fujikura Orochi Red Eye Stiff 65 g.
3 wood: Mizuno JPX 825 14 Fujikura Orochi Red Eye Stiff 75 g.
Hybrid: Mizuno JPX 825 18 Fujikura Orochi Red Eye Stiff 85 g. 
Irons: Mizuno MP 59 3 / PW KBS Tour stiff shaft ( Golf Pride Niion )
Wedges: Taylormade ATV Wedges 52 and 58 ( Golf Pride Niion )
putter: Taylormade ghost series 770 35 inch ( Super Stroke slim 3.0 )
Balls: Taylormade TP 5


Posted
madolive3 suggests a strong 3W as part of the solution. Seems like your current 3W might be bunching up against your 4i. But, you can't figure out how much [COLOR=0000CD]true gap[/COLOR] you have without 3W Trackman data. Also, we don't have physical specs on your 3W, or how many wedges you carry. If you had a detailed [COLOR=800000]What's In My Bag[/COLOR] in your sig line, you could save us a lot of guessing for possibilities on bag set-up. What you need to do is go to a demo day and try FWs of different lofts and shaft types. If you find you can't hit a low-lofted 3W, you might be better to put three extra wraps of tape under the low hand of your current 3W, and just choke down a half inch to shave distance.

My 3W is the standard Ping G20 - 15 degrees of loft. While I don't have trackman numbers to confirm 100%, I feel pretty good about a 245-250 estimated carry (probably about 240 carry off the deck). There is a big difference when I hit a 4 iron vs. a 3W off the tee. I don't need another wedge really. My wedge set up is Rocketbladez PW (45 degrees), and then Vokeys: (52/08 bent to 51, 56/14, 60/04). It covers my gaps fairly well, and I'm pretty good at controlling my distance with 1/2 and 3/4 swings. I could maybe swap out the 51 degree for the Also, on the in your bag sig line, I don't believe I can have a sig yet. Or, at least, I can't figure out how to do it. [quote name="LuciusWooding" url="/t/74587/help-with-distance-gap#post_990820"]Question: what do you use those clubs for? Do you hit any of them off the tee a lot or choose one for certain situations? 3w off the deck? [/quote] I rarely hit my 3W off the deck - maybe once every 3 rounds or so. I envision using this club off the tee but also off the deck a lot more. Probably 60% off the tee and 40% off the deck. My 3W is probably more of a 80/20 split on that, maybe 90/10. In general, if I'm using a 3W off the deck, it means I got myself in trouble on a par 5 and need to make up distance fast. For now, by the way, I ended up buying a Ping G20 5 wood. I'm not 100% sure it fills the gap, but it's good enough for now. The real reason I need this club is for a par 3 hole on my home course that measures about 240 from the tips. Well, and I don't want to waste one of my 14 clubs. I'm thinking I might also look at getting one of those mini drivers/2 woods for off the tee and then getting a 4 wood or something. That might gap me better, and as I rarely hit my 3W off the deck, it might make more sense to have something built more for play off the tee. Thanks for all of the advice and help.

-- Daniel

In my bag: :callaway: Paradym :callaway: Epic Flash 3.5W (16 degrees)

:callaway: Rogue Pro 3-PW :edel: SMS Wedges - V-Grind (48, 54, 58):edel: Putter

 :aimpoint:

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Note: This thread is 4239 days old. We appreciate that you found this thread instead of starting a new one, but if you plan to post here please make sure it's still relevant. If not, please start a new topic. Thank you!

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  • Posts

    • Day 1: 2025.12.26 Worked on LH position on grip, trying to keep fingers closer to perpendicular to the club. Feels awkward but change is meant to.
    • Please see this topic for updated information:
    • Please see this topic for updated information:
    • When you've been teaching golf as long as I have, you're going to find that you can teach some things better than you previously had, and you're probably going to find some things that you taught incorrectly. I don't see that as a bad thing — what would be worse is refusing to adapt and grow given new information. I've always said that my goal with my instruction isn't to be right, but it's to get things right. To that end, I'm about five years late in issuing a public proclamation on something… When I first got my GEARS system, I immediately looked at the golf swings of the dozens and dozens of Tour players for which I suddenly had full 3D data. I created a huge spreadsheet showing how their bodies moved, how the club moved, at various points in the swing. I mapped knee and elbow angles, hand speeds, shoulder turns and pelvis turns… etc. I re-considered what I thought I knew about the golf swing as performed by the best players. One of those things dated back to the earliest days: that you extend (I never taught "straighten" and would avoid using that word unless in the context of saying "don't fully straighten") the trail knee/leg in the backswing. I was mislead by 2D photos from less-than-ideal camera angles — the trail leg rotates a bit during the backswing, and so when observing trail knee flex should also use a camera that moves to stay perpendicular to the plane of the ankle/knee/hip joint. We have at least two topics here on this (here and here; both of which I'll be updating after publishing this) where @mvmac and I advise golfers to extend the trail knee. Learning that this was not right is one of the reasons I'm glad to have a 3D system, as most golfers generally preserve the trail knee flex throughout the backswing. Data Here's a video showing an iron and a driver of someone who has won the career slam: Here's what the graph of his right knee flex looks like. The solid lines I've positioned at the top of the backswing (GEARS aligns both swings at impact, the dashed line). Address is to the right, of course, and the graph shows knee flex from the two swings above. The data (17.56° and 23.20°) shows where this player is in both swings (orange being the yellow iron swing, pink the blue driver swing). You can see that this golfer extends his trail knee 2-3°… before bending it even more than that through the late backswing and early downswing. Months ago I created a quick Instagram video showing the trail knee flex in the backswing of several players (see the top for the larger number): Erik J. Barzeski (@iacas) • Instagram reel GEARS shares expert advice on golf swing technique, focusing on the critical backswing phase. Tour winners and major champions reveal the key to a precise and powerful swing, highlighting the importance of... Here are a few more graphs. Two LIV players and major champions: Two PGA Tour winners: Two women's #1 ranked players: Two more PGA Tour winners (one a major champ): Two former #1s, the left one being a woman, the right a man, with a driver: Two more PGA Tour players: You'll notice a trend: they almost all maintain roughly the same flex throughout their backswing and downswing. The Issues with Extending the Trail Knee You can play good golf extending (again, not "straightening") the trail knee. Some Tour players do. But, as with many things, if 95 out of 100 Tour players do it, you're most likely better off doing similarly to what they do. So, what are the issues with extending the trail knee in the backswing? To list a few: Pelvic Depth and Rotation Quality Suffers When the trail knee extends, the trail leg often acts like an axle on the backswing, with the pelvis rotating around the leg and the trail hip joint. This prevents the trail side from gaining depth, as is needed to keep the pelvis center from thrusting toward the ball. Most of the "early extension" (thrust) that I see occurs during the backswing. Encourages Early Extension (Thrust) Patterns When you've thrust and turned around the trail hip joint in the backswing, you often thrust a bit more in the downswing as the direction your pelvis is oriented is forward and "out" (to the right for a righty). Your trail leg can abduct to push you forward, but "forward" when your pelvis is turned like that is in the "thrust" direction. Additionally, the trail knee "breaking" again at the start of the downswing often jumps the trail hip out toward the ball a bit too much or too quickly. While the trail hip does move in that direction, if it's too fast or too much, it can prevent the lead side hip from getting "back" at the right rate, or at a rate commensurate with the trail hip to keep the pelvis center from thrusting. Disrupts the Pressure Shift/Transition When the trail leg extends too much, it often can't "push" forward normally. The forward push begins much earlier than forward motion begins — pushing forward begins as early as about P1.5 to P2 in the swings of most good golfers. It can push forward by abducting, again, but that's a weaker movement that shoves the pelvis forward (toward the target) and turns it more than it generally should (see the next point). Limits Internal Rotation of the Trail Hip Internal rotation of the trail hip is a sort of "limiter" on the backswing. I have seen many golfers on GEARS whose trail knee extends, whose pelvis shifts forward (toward the target), and who turn over 50°, 60°, and rarely but not never, over 70° in the backswing. If you turn 60° in the backswing, it's going to be almost impossible to get "open enough" in the downswing to arrive at a good impact position. Swaying/Lateral Motion Occasionally a golfer who extends the trail knee too much will shift back too far, but more often the issue is that the golfer will shift forward too early in the backswing (sometimes even immediately to begin the backswing), leaving them "stuck forward" to begin the downswing. They'll push forward, stop, and have to restart around P4, disrupting the smooth sequence often seen in the game's best players. Other Bits… Reduces ground reaction force potential, compromises spine inclination and posture, makes transition sequencing harder, increases stress on the trail knee and lower back… In short… It's not athletic. We don't do many athletic things with "straight" or very extended legs (unless it's the end of the action, like a jump or a big push off like a step in a running motion).
    • Day 135 12-25 Wide backswing to wide downswing drill. Recorder and used mirror. 
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