2thetee

The game of golf needs to "evolve". So I am looking for input from the Sand Trap members to help me create a viable alternative to USGA golf. I am looking for your input criticisms, modifications, advice or alterations. The ultimate goal is to create an alternative golf game that is fun, fast, and plays real shots on a real golf course. Do not compare to USGA golf -- this is supposed to be different. Objectives 1. 1. Play 6 holes in 60 minutes or less; faster game 2. 2. Make a golf game that is easier and more accessible for ALL golfers 3. 3. Make a golf game that is different but similar to USGA Golf, yet fun for everyone and playable on existing courses without course modifications 4. 4. Increase participation, lower price (1/3rd of cost) , less time, more family oriented 5. 5. Increase golf course revenue (split 18 hole course into 3 six hole courses) e.g. during evening tee times 6. 6. Develop skills for USGA golf “Speedy” Golf Rules 1. 1. Play from most forward set of tees 2. 2. With any Ball in play through the green (except green side bunker) – you may Lift at any point and place in fairway no closer to hole – 1 stroke penalty 3. 3. With any Ball in play – green side bunker -- lift from bunker and place the ball within 3 steps of bunker no closer to hole– 1 stroke penalty -- may play from that location or choose to then apply Rule 1 and play from fairway no closer to hole which would add 1 more penalty stroke 4. 4. Water hazard /out of bounds / lost ball -- lift and place the ball within 3 steps no closer to hole – 1 stroke penalty – may play from that location or choose to then apply Rule 1 and play from fairway no closer to hole which would add 1 more penalty stroke 5. 5. Green – all balls within 3 feet of hole are conceded 1 putts 6. 6. Green – 2 putt maximum – if you are not within 3 feet after 2 putts – add 2 stroke penalty and your are done 7. 7. 2 players may play at same time so long as it is safe (including on the tee and green) – if balls collide on green surface then replace both balls at point of contact – if balls collide in air play as found 8. 8. Maximum time to execute any shot after arriving at ball is 15 seconds -- violation = 1 stroke penalty – counting out loud by other players is permitted 9. Game is automatically over at 60 minutes no matter where you are on the course.

Tiger diagnosis – has not mastered Swing Key #5 club face control Cause -- POWER ACCUMULATORS 2 AND 5 – Tiger has too much #2 and not enough #5 resulting in loss of Swing Key # 5 club face control just a fraction before impact at P7 ranging from 1 degree closed to square to 1 degree open. Translation -- Tiger is uncocking his left wrist too much just before impact (think of the left thumb moving toward the ball causing the left wrist too be completely uncocked or arched down). This turns the club face. The fix – Less uncocking of the left wrist before impact meaning less POWER ACCUMULATOR 2. Employ instead more of the 5th POWER ACCUMULATOR==> the bending (to the individual's "maximum") and releasing of the right wrist (bending in this case defined as knuckles towards top of forearm. See here for greater explanation: http://thesandtrap.com/t/44717/is-there-a-5th-power-accumulator We've now believe there is a "5th" Power Accumulator... After ongoing discussion, research, and classification we (the Golf Evolution team) believe that there is a fifth power accumulator: the bending (to the individual's "maximum") and releasing of the right wrist (bending in this case defined as knuckles towards top of forearm Expected result – less flip at just before contact and less change in direction of the club face resulting in more control of the club face and actually probably greater power. Mastery of Swing Key #5 and more major championships!

Makes sense. If you stand straight up, hold the club straight out in front of you at shoulder height with wrist cock; rotate your shoulders simulating a back swing, rotate your forearm 90 degrees, and then side tilt towards the ball then you end up in perfect position. I saw that on a video somewhere. I would not have guessed that there was 90 degrees of forearm rotation. I wondered when you see Jason Dufner practice a back swing with his driver. It looks like he simulates flipping the back of left wrist to the sky to flatten the swing plane. Lots of rotation. So does forearm rotation flatten the swing plane and allow your hands to go deeper?

What is the proper method of rotating the hands/wrists/forearms? If you do not rotate, then your flat left wrist would be at a 90 degree angle to the club head arc and the club face would be shut -- right? Somewhere after P2 it seems either the shoulder, forearm or the wrist seem to have to rotate. The weight of the club head should cause a rotation - right? I do not think I have ever heard you discuss this point.

If you just started playing on 6/2/2012 then it is unlikely that you have an equipment problem. Although most golfers do love to blame their equipment for their bad swing results. You have learned this in a short period of time. There are many excellent articles on TST about ball flight direction. The ball starts in the direction of the clubface and curves based on your swingpath. A single digit handicapper could both draw and fade the ball with your clubs even with the offset. I would suggest taking a swing lesson from a qualified instructor before you invest any more money in equipment to learn more about your swingpath and clubface control.

Arguing with a fool proves there are two . At the risk of engaging Patrick57 on his topic: my “PLAYING CONCEPT” is much simpler and one I too often ignore to my own detriment. It is simply AT&T.; AT&T; translates to: Alignment – defined as alignment of stance and clubface Target – pick a reasonably precise target for the club selected Trust – trust your decision and swing like an athlete. “GAASP - Grip, Alignment, Aim, Stance and Posture” cannot be defined as a playing concept nor a swing mechanic. There are too many variables. Grip can be weak, neutral or strong or interlocked, overlapped or baseball. Alignment can be open, neutral or closed. Aim can be an open, neutral or closed clubface. Stance can be tall, neutral or short. Posture can be s-curved posture or flat lumbar with slumped shoulders. Everyone would agree that if this is your checklist, then you would be frozen is swing thoughts. “Concept 1) Involves cutting the grass”??? Slope up, level or slope down? All swings are downward. Not so with all ball contacts. This has no meaning. The swing of the sweetspot has to be down, out and forward to be successful. “Concept 2) Tick-tock” in putting -- okay I could buy this as a simple tempo thought for putting. “Concept 3) Hammer and nail” – sounds like a practice range concept to me. If you mean that the swing thought should be to hit the ball in the center of the sweetspot then I okay I could buy this as a simple playing concept. “Concept 4) Exploding long bread shaped chunks of sand out of the bunker”. CHUNKING is certainly not a positive swing thought for bunker play. Some people pretend there is a dollar bill under the sand and that the clubhead will sweep the dollar bill out of the bunker using the bounce of the club. Granting you the benefit of the doubt I assume that this is what you intended to articulate. Before the shot, I might also review in my own mind or practice swing – steady head and weight forward and getting the hands down faster. SWING MECHANICS. Probably 75% of the people playing the game would do well with one single thought – hit the little ball before the big ball. I think I have successfully rebutted your post without impugning your character. I will grant you the benefit of the doubton your alleged reformation.

You would think that all golf instructors would know their As and Ps and use them to communicate with their students. Few do. Anyone contemplating taking lessons should probably print this post out and give it to their instructor so that you both on on the same page when you are talking about different segments of the swing. Golf pro, golf instructor, golf coach -- whatever you want to call yourself -- it really comes down to golf teaching and communication. You need a common language to do that succesfully. The instruction you are giving may make perfect sense to you, but if we the students can not put the instruction into the proper perspective then you have not taught and we have not learned anything. This is one of my favorite posts in all of TST. Is their a way to bookmark your favorite posts in TST?

What would be the estimated ball park cost of this sample dream vacation? Is it one of those cases where -- if you have to ask about cost then you cannot afford it anyways?

I see no problem. Spraying is regulated by your state EPA. The golf superintendent would be following the state EPA regs in terms of what is permitted to be sprayed. Now, they can not even use chemicals that will kill earthworms. Also, OSHA would govern the employees safety in applying the chemicals. I have never seen a golf course worker on a tractor wearing a respirator. I am going to guess that they are probably applying some sort of nitrogen and weed killer and/or fungus preventor this time of year. You could always ask the golf super for the MSDS sheets if you are seriously concerned. Don't eat the grass, lick your ball or your fingers during the round. Use your golf towel and you will be fine. Golf courses are probably one of the most environmentally safe places that you could be outdoors.

Keegan Bradley -14 Tiger Woods -13 Hunter mahan -12

I would suggest that you send one to the forum creator -- IACAS -- to do a product review. I am intrigued. Most golf training devices can be duplicatted by some homemade materials in your basement. Not this one. I could see how this could be useful if it told you about the position of the club at impact.

PP3 is an essential ingredient to both TGM and the Ernest Jones golf swings by giving you a feel for the clubhead.. For TGM I recommend reading http://golfingmachinist.com.au/article.php?id=66 Pressure Point #3 senses the Inertia of the Lagging Clubhead. This is Clubhead Feel . You must Feel the Clubhead, not the Clubshaft. This my Readers is what is "Clubhead Lag". http://3jack.blogspot.com/2009/09/3jacks-translation-of-tgm-part-7c.html The clubhead lag pressure point is right where the #3 Pressure Point is. In fact, the #3 PP is considered the clubhead lag sensor. Ernest Jones is all about "making the clubhead work for you" and feeling the clubhead from start to finish of the swing. Amazingly, the Earnest Jones book is FREE!!!!!! online here. FREE. http://archive.org/details/golfswingernestj00hammiala Read the book in light of what you know about S&T; and the 5 Swing Keys from this site and you see a lot of what Jones said about fundamentals being variables and not fundamentals in 1920 continued to be taught for almost 100 years. IMO what he said in 1920 is just as applicable as in 2012. I interpret his word "leverage" to mean maintaining the "flying wedge" and to having a flat left wrist at impact. In my book if you put together and understand Ernest Jones, Homer Kelley, Mike Bennett, Andy Plummer and Dave Wedzik you have an outstanding insight on the mechanics of the swing. I happen to believe that you learn the feel from the mechanics and not vice versa. Good luck on your quest to learn more about pressure points, power accumulators and clubhead feel! I would like to hear what others have to say on this topic.

Steady head + weight forward + better flying wedge from P5 to P6 + hard work = conference championship

Tricky My guess is that your swing is already "repeatable". Just not the kind of repeatable that you are lookiing for I like the fact that your pro did the interview. I would be more impressed if he asked about your ball flight, what your swing and playing goals were, how much time you can spend practicing, how committed are you to making a swing change, how many lessons do you see yourself taking and how long a period you want to work on your swing, i.e 1 month 3 months 1 season etc. You should answer these questions yourself. Making swing changes can be a bumpy road -- full of failure and success. Are you committed to working through some of the rough spots? I am not too impressed with a pro watching a few swings and making an instant analysis -- even though the analysis may be spot on. This is why -- its not the best learning tool for you. I would prefer that the pro video your swing from DTL and FO. Show you the video. Draw some lines on the video as to proper positions and so forth. 1. You can see what you actually look like and what you are really doing -- feel is not real. 2. The pro would be teaching you what to look for in the future when you video yourself. You will be able to tell what progress you are making. Also after analyzing your swing the pro should show you the video of some pro that fits your profile and show you how your particlar flaws could be corrected to look like the video pro. This gives you a look back at your flaws and a look forward as to where you should be. It gives you a road map. It gives you some mileposts to know whether you are actually acomplishing something. It allows you to see whether you are making any measurable progress. My preference for instruction is 1. Show me the new swing postion in ultra slow motion 2. Show me a drill or drills to practice the position 3. Tell me what I should see on the video, what I should feel and make me verbalize what it is that I have learned 4. Give me a drill for 50% or 75% swing to incorporate the new position 5. Write down what happened at the lesson both for the instructor and for you -- otherwise neither one of you will know wheter you are making progress You can practice the slow motion feel inside your house. Doing something correectly 1000 times will make you better. Doing something 500 time right and 500 times wrong will get you know where. Video some practice swings yourself and check your progress. Also, you are on a great website. Read the Practice section and watch the videos. Lots of good stuff. I would be more impressed if your instructor was working on 1. Steady head 2. Weight forward 3. Flat left wrist at impact I know those items would remove the slice and improve your game. good luck!

Confessions of a serial flipper. This is how am I attempting to overcome the flipping problem which for ME -- I describe as an early (before P7.5) downward cocking of the wrists which destroys your flying wedge that should be maintained to impact. My flip occurs between P5 and P6. FIRST I have attempted to read all that I can on the mechanics of the swing and flipping. I recommend 3Jack and The Machinist instruction on their blogs as follows: Example of hands slowing down and quitting: http://3jack.blogspot.com/2009/09/3jacks-translation-of-tgm-part-6g.html Example of keeping the hands moving at a constant speed and how acceleration is really created in your swing by the endless belt: http://3jack.blogspot.com/2009/09/3jacks-translation-of-tgm-part-6f.html See also the Machinist blog at http://golfingmachinist.com.au/article.php?id=1 3Jack states: “The hacker who has throwaway slows down those hands and loses that lag pressure in the hands. That causes the clubhead increase in mass and the hands keep slowing down. One major thing to note in the golf swing is that ONCE THAT LAG PRESSURE IS LOST, IT'S GONE, YOU CAN'T GET IT BACK IN THAT PARTICULAR SWING. Furthermore, ONCE YOUR HANDS SLOW DOWN IN THE DOWNSWING, YOU CAN'T SPEED THEM UP IN THAT PARTICULAR SWING.” Example of geometry of the circle and why the low point is after impact: http://3jack.blogspot.com/2009/09/3jacks-translation-of-tgm-part-5.html and http://3jack.blogspot.com/2009/09/3jacks-translation-of-tgm-part-6e.html As 3Jack states: “If you 'flip' the low point will move further back in your stance, but it's tough to figure out where the low point will be. If your left wrist is flat, the low point will always be opposite of the left shoulder.” The low point of the swing is after impact BUT only if you have not flipped. If you flip prior to P7 then you have lengthened the radius of your swing causing you at best to sweep the ball at impact. Flipping destroys your constant hand velocity and slows the swing AND deprives you of the acceleration at impact. Know the 3 pressure points of the grip and 1 pressure point between the chest and left arm. Read the Machinist blog: http://golfingmachinist.com.au/article.php?id=66 Know what the FLYING WEDGE is! Read the Machinist blog: http://golfingmachinist.com.au/article.php?id=30 Know what the 4 power accumulators are: http://3jack.blogspot.com/2009/05/understanding-basics-of-tgm-part-v.html Know whether you are a swinger THUS 423 or a Hitter THUS 4123. SECOND. Practice drills that I am using: 9 O’clock to 3 O’clock wedge drill (acquired motion drill) with a wedge – Exaggerate -- get your hands all the way to your left thigh before impact Visually – allow yourself to see your hands go by the ball before impact occurs; Audible –allow yourself to hear impact after your hands go by the ball; Kinetically – allow yourself to feel the low point 3 inches after the ball; No divot before the ball. Same drill with 8 iron off a tee and put tee in ground 3 inches after ball. Make sure divot is after the ball impact. Hit the second tee. Hit the 8 iron as low as possible. If you are a swinger then hit ¾ iron shots off a tee taking the divot after impact. Concentrate on constant hand speed. For me this means keeping enough pressure at PP#1 (right heel pad on left thumb) so that the hands work as one unit to keep a constant speed but not so much pressure as to stiffen the forearms and you do not want to activate Power accumulator #1 – extension of the right arm – you are practicing 423 power accumulators NOT 4123. IDEALLY Allow your left arm to completely unwind all the way to your left thigh while keeping the flying wedge. Pleaselet me know what you have found that works for you. Thanks for listening.

R McIlroy -15 K Bradley -14 P Michelson -13

Working on weight forward, handle forward, right shoulder down. As you can see my right heel comes off the ground, right knee and hip moves toward the ball, causing right hip to move toward the ball between P5 and P6 which means I get the club stuck. I have to stand up to get out of the way instead of smoothly moving the knees and hips latterally toward the target. Also, I do not go back into flexion early on in the downswing making it difficult to get to proper P6. That causes you to lose the flying wedge and flip. Thanks for the comments.

After my second lesson back in September of 2011, within 4 hours of working on my swing, my golf instructor left the country to return to England and still has not returned. I think thats taking the "I never want to see this student again" just a little too far! I had paid by check -- but don't you know that he had time to deposit my check before he scadadled. Fortunately, one of his colleagues picked up the pieces and tried to put my swing back together. Its a work in progess. Constructive criticism is welcome. The enclosed video is not very good -- only shot with a casio exilim and slowed down with Windows movie maker. For those who care about such things my GHIN index is 7.1 Working on S&T; and the 5SK. Suggestions, drills and swing thoughts from all SandTrap critics would be appreciated.

I am waiting for the Casio ZR200 to come out in April at $379 Supposedly you can shoot at 1000fps and control shutter speed. See this review http://youtu.be/Xpi75AJIHzE

I believe this is Nick Starchuk Toronto, Canada / now Orlando, Florida He was a golf pro in Toronto at the course where they played the Canadian Open. Now he is teaching at the Charley Gilchrist school in Florida .. I think he has posted here before. I believe he has posted here before. This is my 1st post to the Sand Trap. I belong at Whispering Woods in Erie, Pa -- home of the Golf Evolution School. I am not an S&T; guy (yet) but I have watchd Dave Wedzik and others give lessons at the range. They need no accolades from me -- their results speak for themselves. I have not taken any lessons from these guys but I am thinking about it. Anyways, this is the best golf video I have ever found -- since he seems to say it works with both S&T; and a Leadbetter swing. Why do golf instructors always concentrate on the arms and upper body? If you do not move the lower body correctly, then it will change the upper body rotation anyways. Mix this in with the Titleist performance institute on having the right joints either being stable or mobile and I think a lot of instructors could really help their students golf swings. Yes-- I have seen some of the other golf evolution videos. I am interested to hear what this learned group has to say!