Low Duck Hook Driver!

[Brickman]

I’m having real issues with my driver which are ruining my rounds.  Real low duck hooks off the tee barely goingb100 yards.  Irons are crisp and fine.  I can’t figure it out so I’m reaching out somebody that has had this issue might be able to make some suggestions to help.  Thank you!

[saevel25]

Hard to say what you are doing unless you start a My Swing thread and post a video of your swing. 

[iacas]

Face is closed and your compensation is to swing out, typically with very little loft. Lack of backspin also makes it easier to tilt the spin axis hard in the hook direction.

But… a Member Swing topic would be helpful.

[HitemHard]

If I was going to try to help someone fix a low snap hook without actually seeing their swing I would have to tell them to break down the problem into pieces. See if you can fix the "low" part of the problem first. A low ball flight tells me you are probably swinging level or hitting down on the ball instead of hitting up on it. Try teeing the ball higher than you are comfortable and put the ball up in your stance a little further up than comfortable...try putting it off your left heal or even the left toe. Try to feel like your club head is swinging up through impact. Try that first and see if it gets you to a high snap hook or a high pull hook. 
 

If you want to address the hook part of the swing you are going to have to look at two areas of the swing as well as your concept of what the arms and hands do through impact. I love talking through this stuff with people but I'll only go into it further if you really want to go down that rabbit hole...you would have to say so. Swing well my friend!

[saevel25]

  On 12/12/2024 at 4:05 AM, HitemHard said:

A low ball flight tells me you are probably swinging level or hitting down on the ball instead of hitting up on it.

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Not necessarily. You can hit up on the ball, and if you take a 10-degree driver and close it down to 5 degrees and swing out like 10 degrees. You can hit some nasty snap hooks. (been there and done that 😉). 

  On 12/12/2024 at 4:05 AM, HitemHard said:

ry teeing the ball higher than you are comfortable and put the ball up in your stance a little further up than comfortable...try putting it off your left heal or even the left toe. Try to feel like your club head is swinging up through impact. Try that first and see if it gets you to a high snap hook or a high pull hook. 

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Might not help with the duck hook. Swinging up more can cause a person to swing out, which will cause it to hook more. Swinging down and left (a fade or slice path) feel might be better. I had a nasty hook for a while, to play functional golf, I had to feel like I was swinging like 20 degrees outside to in through impact. I would hit it straight. The swing felt like I was hitting down, but the ball went normal trajectory. 

Feel isn't real. I wouldn't suggest mechanisms that cause the ball to draw more to someone who is duck hooking the ball. 

Again, to the OP, create a My Swing thread, and lets some of us get some eyes on the swing for more concrete suggestions. 

 

[ChetlovesMer]

  On 9/2/2024 at 2:02 PM, Brickman said:

I’m having real issues with my driver which are ruining my rounds.  Real low duck hooks off the tee barely goingb100 yards.  Irons are crisp and fine.  I can’t figure it out so I’m reaching out somebody that has had this issue might be able to make some suggestions to help.  Thank you!

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As many have already said. Without seeing your swing it's really hard to know for sure what's causing your issue. I will say I had similar results way back in the early 2000's. My irons were okay, but my driver kept producing ugly, worm-burning duck hooks that were impossible to play. 

The golf coach I had at the time (honestly not as good as my current coach, but not terrible). Helped me with the simplest solution possible. At the time I was coming way off the ball to the trail side during my back swing and then going way past the ball on my swing. My head was moving like 18 inches. It was ugly. (Both my head and my movement. 😜) When I saw it on video I was shocked how bad it looked. It was relatively easy to tame though after I saw it. 

The point of that is not that you should think that's the same problem you are having. The point of that is that you should get some quality video of your swing. 

Let us know how you get on. Good luck. 

[GolfLug]

I think it's rare for someone to be consistently hitting low hard dipping duck hooks without a super strong grip. I can't comment on anything else without seeing their swing.

[saevel25]

  On 12/17/2024 at 9:19 PM, GolfLug said:

I think it's rare for someone to be consistently hitting low hard dipping duck hooks without a super strong grip. I can't comment on anything else without seeing their swing.

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Extremely outward path with a very closed club face. Maybe unless you have a stupidly weak grip, like right hand way over top, I don't think the grip is necessary highly correlated to this. 

[GolfLug]

  On 12/17/2024 at 11:10 PM, saevel25 said:

Extremely outward path with a very closed club face. Maybe unless you have a stupidly weak grip, like right hand way over top, I don't think the grip is necessary highly correlated to this. 

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Matt, the equation is simple from my perspective. Stronger the grip, greater the potential of application for twist torque at impact. And if it it is combined with an extreme outward path as you say, god help you. Not too many skilled players with super strong grips, are there?

Sure, it's all about match-ups but the connection to super strong grips and duck hooks is common from what I see and have dealt with myself.

[ChetlovesMer]

  On 12/19/2024 at 3:09 AM, GolfLug said:

Not too many skilled players with super strong grips, are there?

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Dustin Johnson? 

I think Freddy Couples was known for a really strong grip. Bryson plays a strong grip. I know Zach Johnson does too. 

There are probably others. 

I'm no Alfred Einstein but I'm pretty sure it's all about match ups. If you do X you need to do Y. ...etc... Jordan Spieth and Colin Morikawa have swings which match their quote-unquote weak grips, where Dustin Johnson has a swing that matches his quote-unquote strong grip. 

Once again, for the OP, @Brickman I probably sound like a broken record, but you should post video of your swing, especially video of the ones that duck hook. It's hard to diagnose exactly what's going on without seeing it. 

[Brickman]

Thanks for all the thoughts and tips.  I truly appreciate it.   I’m going to work on it this winter at an indoor golf facility.   

[ChetlovesMer]

  On 12/19/2024 at 1:59 PM, Brickman said:

Thanks for all the thoughts and tips.  I truly appreciate it.   I’m going to work on it this winter at an indoor golf facility.   

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That'd great. I love indoor practice in the winter.

In all seriousness. don't be afraid to go out and get lessons. It can take a while to find a swing coach that's right for you. I've had a myriad of them, some good, some not so good. One that I'm actually friends with, but he wasn't right for me as a coach. I work with @iacas these days, and he really helps me... I call him Yoda. I'm sure I improve more because of his lessons than I ever would on my own. Finding a good coach can be like finding the right spouse. ... possibly more difficult depending on where you live. 

Secondly, don't be embarrassed to post a MySwing thread. A lot of golfers are like "eh, I don't want everyone to see how crappy my swing is." Don't be that golfer. Be the golfer who says "My swing needs work. Here's where I am at the moment." 

Anyway, that's my 2 cents. 

Enjoy the indoor facility, but time the snow melts away in the spring, you'll be ready to go. 

[saevel25]

@ChetlovesMer, I think @GolfLug is talking about almost having the right or left hand under the club. Like extreme strong grip. I would say DJ has one of the stronger grips. The V in his right-hand points towards his right shoulder. Like up his right arm. 

I can see two ways to hit a duck hook. In my mind, a duck hook is caused by an extreme in to out swing path. I do not think grip strength is highly correlated with swing path. 

DJ has a very strong grip from a PGA Tour perspective, and he hit fades off the tee. Morikawa has a strange weak left hand, but strong right hand and hits fades. Rory has more of a neutral grip and hits draws. 

  On 12/19/2024 at 2:13 PM, ChetlovesMer said:

Secondly, don't be embarrassed to post a MySwing thread. A lot of golfers are like "eh, I don't want everyone to see how crappy my swing is." Don't be that golfer. Be the golfer who says "My swing needs work. Here's where I am at the moment." 

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Yep, this ^

[GolfLug]

  On 12/19/2024 at 3:39 PM, saevel25 said:

@ChetlovesMer, I think @GolfLug is talking about almost having the right or left hand under the club. Like extreme strong grip. 

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Yes, correct. Trail hand wrist in flexion at address. And grip up in palm. 

  On 12/19/2024 at 3:39 PM, saevel25 said:

I can see two ways to hit a duck hook. In my mind, a duck hook is caused by an extreme in to out swing path. I do not think grip strength is highly correlated with swing path. 

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I mean he is hitting duck hooks. You can hit them with any path with trail palm turned under the grip. I wouldn't eliminate that as a possibility sight unseen. 

Extreme outward path highly unlikely for a high handicapper. $5 says trail palm cradling the grip from way under.  

[iacas]

  On 12/19/2024 at 1:20 PM, ChetlovesMer said:

Bryson plays a strong grip.

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  On 12/19/2024 at 4:38 PM, GolfLug said:

Trail hand wrist in flexion at address.

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Trail hand wrist in flexion at P1? Same GIF as above.

That's tough to do.

[GolfLug]

  On 12/19/2024 at 5:09 PM, iacas said:

Trail hand wrist in flexion at P1? Same GIF as above.

That's tough to do.

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It is hard to roll your trail palm underneath the grip (and further up in the palm) which puts the wrist in flexion? What am I missing? 

[iacas]

  On 12/19/2024 at 6:13 PM, GolfLug said:

It is hard to roll your trail palm underneath the grip (and further up in the palm) which puts the wrist in flexion? What am I missing? 

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Now wrap the hand up onto the grip. You've gotta have a pretty extreme grip to have your trail hand in flexion.

[inthehole]

 I too fought the dastardly low duck hook something awful this year - as you say it is a round killer, absolutely demoralizing.  I've golfed seriously for 14 years and this just crept in this year - CONSISTENTLY, never ever had to deal with it before.   Like you, it only affects my driver, not hybrids/irons.   So I fought it all year and spent alot of time trying everything under the sun to fix it.   At end of season, after an incredible amount of work, I did fix it.   It turned out to be a simple fix - it is a grip issue (for me).   

I always set up with my driver with club head lag like the rest of my clubs.   My fix was to set up straight to the ball - NO LAG (no shaft lean).   What this does is slightly rotate the grip in your hands ... automatically, You won't have to intentionally change anything with your grip.   It will feel really weird, but lock in the grip with no shaft lean / clubhead lag & swing normally.   Its pure f'n magic - completely fixed my low short duck hook without any other change in setup or swing, ball position, ball height, etc.  Back to hitting nice high straight balls, even a tad of fade sometimes, which i'm fine with.   Grip still feels really strange & I have to ingrain it in my muscle memory over the winter indoors, but can't argue with the cnosistent results the last 7 or 8 rounds of the season.... absolutely mind blowing what a simple little change can do.   

Edited December 19, 2024 by inthehole