Hitting with a pull

[GolferDot]

Ok, I have been working on this for a while now, My swing seems to be on plane except right before impact when it dives inside the line.

What are the possible causes of this ??

I get great length put I pull the ball about 15 yards left of target. This is a very consistant pull to the point that I could just aim 15 yards right but I want to get my swing right.

[Fugly]

Hi GolferDot, just a couple of quetions...

1. Does the ball start left of your target and go straight left or
2. I there any shape to the ball, either draw or fade

IMHO, the key is clubface at impact( this is mainly controlled by grip) And then swing path trough impact... thus the questions.

lest try to figure out witch it is that is causing your problem?

[jambalaya]

Could be one of several things. The same swing faults that produce slices and weak fades can be the same ones that produce a consistant pull because of over compensation like a closed club face or rolling turning the wrists over or early release. I have been pulling the ball a lot on my practice sesssions due to my persistant over the top move. Here is a paragraph from a book I am reading:

The clubhead path through the impact area for a normal shot has been described by some instructors as from inside the target line to impact to immediately back inside the target line. They call this inside-to-inside. This will produce a straight shot if the clubface is square to the target line at impact. However, this is very hard to do, and probably could be done consistently only by a machine. Any small error can result in a very bad shot. Unfortunately, this is the clubhead path and clubface angle that most poor players are trying to use. Their most common errors are swinging outside-in and/or leaving the clubface open.

For a draw, the correct path for the center of the clubface is from inside
the target line to impact to outside the target line to back inside the target
line. This is commonly referred to simply as an inside-out swing. To get the
correct picture of this clubhead path in your mind, you must understand that
the center of the clubface does not come back inside quickly. Even if you
swing inside-out only a little, the center of your clubface must continue on
that path, taking the entire clubhead outside the target line, and extending
toward a point to the right of your target. How much that point is to the
right of your target, of course, depends on how much inside-out you swing.
Your clubhead should come back inside the target line only when you are
well into your follow through.

You may be bringing the clubhead back inside too quickly at impact or your clubhead may not be square but turned inside at impact. You may want to try and adjust your clubhead path by swinging towards right field a bit so your club isn't coming back inside at impact. Try to swing at about one or two o' clock. (Clock on ground with target at 12 o' clock).

[GolferDot]

  Fugly said:

Hi GolferDot, just a couple of quetions...

Straight no shape, divots point left, but swing plane seems good until last minute, do you think that left foot flare might have something to do with it ?

[GolferDot]

  jambalaya said:

Could be one of several things. The same swing faults that produce slices and weak fades can be the same ones that produce a consistant pull because of over compensation like a closed club face or rolling turning the wrists over or early release. I have been pulling the ball a lot on my practice sesssions due to my persistant over the top move. Here is a paragraph from a book I am reading:

I understand that aspect, what I can't get my head around is what part of my setup is causing this particular move especially considering my swing seems to be on plane until the last minute of my swing, perhaps this is the inside-inside that is being talked about and ball position might be enough to resolve it, will have to try that at the range.

[kfowler]

So you have a pic that you consider on plane? Still sounds like you're coming over the top. Are you hitting lots of shots off the toe?

[Mr.Wedge]

Consider this: if you maintain swing radius established at address and maintain spine/thigh angle as well as levels, it is impossible to do what you describe. What you describe is "getting stuck", which inhibits your abillity to swing and release through the ball. What this means is you are losing your spine angle by moving the hips toward the ball near the bottom of the swing. Not saying this is what you are doing, but based on your description, because it is a very common swing fault. You could be extending the radius as well which will cause out/in.

[GolferDot]

  Mr.Wedge said:

Consider this: if you maintain swing radius established at address and maintain spine/thigh angle as well as levels, it is impossible to do what you describe. What you describe is "getting stuck", which inhibits your abillity to swing and release through the ball. What this means is you are losing your spine angle by moving the hips toward the ball near the bottom of the swing. Not saying this is what you are doing, but based on your description, because it is a very common swing fault. You could be extending the radius as well which will cause out/in.

Can you please explain what extending the radius feels/looks like. Is this casting ?

I don't think I would be hiting driver 270 yards if I was casting but maybe this is possible. I have looked into the hips and don't think this is the cause, if I am spining out does that mean my shoulders will be open at impact ? Also I seem to hit it straight if I try to hit the ball rather then swing at the ball.

[Mr.Wedge]

Swing radius is controlled with the lead arm (left for a righty), and defined, IMO, as the line from the center of the sternum to the tip end of the wrist (ulna). Elongating that line by any measure of reaching from the left shoulder will cause a powerful pull, usually straight. This would not be casting. If you "glue" the left armpit and allow no movement of that flesh, you will have a consistent radius. I like to glue both armpits which then assures me of a smooth torso rotation. From there, I just swing the triangle of the arms and shoulders allowing the club to hinge and unhinge on it's own with straight and powerful results. It has pretty well been proven that if you key the entire swing with the left shoulder in this fashion then the hips and legs will sequence with little thought provided you maintain leverage and levels.

[Fugly]

Hi there GolferDot, just going on the fact that your divots are going left, it is more that likely that you are indeed coming over the top!

In other words, the club is coming down higher/above the intended swing plane, thus you have a outside to inside swing path, (across the intended target line) through impact with a square clubface on that path! This would also explain why you are not losing any distance...it does sound however that this move is very small in your case and that could be why you are not aware of it!

I will try my best to explain in my words how you could try to work on this...
an over the top is usually caused by hitting with you right hand, the things that you could focus on is,

1. in your set-up try to relax your right arm,
this is to make it less active throughout the swing,
2. the move from the top of your backswing what you should try and feel is, your left hip moving laterally to the target (instead of rotating away from it) and at the same time, your left hand pulling down to start the downswing...

This would start the swing down on the same plane and would stop that over the top move...

I hope that this helps you a bit!

Fugly.

[GolferDot]

That sounds like it might just be my problem. Now that I think about it I can almost feel my left shoulder causing the pull. I will give this a try at the driving range. Mr. Wedge I have to say your advice is always great and has helped me dramatically the past few weeks.

[GolferDot]

  Fugly said:

Hi there GolferDot, just going on the fact that your divots are going left, it is more that likely that you are indeed coming over the top!

Hi Fugly,

I understand why you think it is still an over the top move but would'nt trying to hit at the ball extentuate the problem not resolve an over the top move ??? ie. when I try to hit at it it goes straight. One other reason why I have my doubts about an over the top move is when I do a Freddie Couples loop, ie. swing upright and loop back to the inside I hit massive hooks. Like they start 20 yards right of target kinda hooks.