Clones broke!!

[Shanks A Million]

But, did you know knock-off speakers and guitars sound exactly like the originals? True story.

To the average amatuer musician, yes, they do. I could upload a clip of my $100 Squier bullet, and my $22,000 1963 all Original Fender Stratocaster, and I can guarantee you couldn't tell the difference.

Why the hell do you think people buy Bose speakers? Cause they're idiots. Bose makes the most atrocious, horrible, worthless speakers on the market, and they charge a fortune for them. People continue to buy them. And do you think you get what you pay for? Take this as an example: Bose Acoustamass with subwoofer ($1,300) Response - 46Hz 13.3kHz at ±10.5 dB Sensitivty - 85.1dB Freq plot: Event SP8 (800$) Response: 35Hz - 20kHz, ±3dB, Ref 500Hz Sensitivity - 88dB Freq plot: Sometimes you can't count on paying more for a better known name. Most of you have probably never heard of Event, but anyone who knows the music industry does, and those who know Event, know Bose is crap.

[sean_miller]

To the average amatuer musician, yes, they do. I could upload a clip of my $100 Squier bullet, and my $22,000 1963 all Original Fender Stratocaster, and I can guarantee you couldn't tell the difference.

Who said anything about Bose speakers?

[Shanks A Million]

Who said anything about Bose speakers?

You said knock off speakers and guitars weren't as good as the name brand. I'm telling you here and now, most people can't tell the difference. And to illustrate, the fact that people will pay good money for a name brand that is crap.

[Kingfisher]

To KingFisher,

Well, bugger me with a pitch fork, you're right - If I'd have noticed that the broken ferrule was on the Fokey wedge, I could have really ripped into the OP. Not only does he think that Z10s are as good as G10s, he thinks Fokeys are as good as Vokeys

Anyway, back to your point, although that was not what I said, what you say is more or less true. The Oakley / protection thing I mentioned was merely an example - for sure Oakley lenses will offer better UV protection than Foakleys will. As for trying to imply that I generally think more expensive things offer more quality (by saying quality I am assuming you really mean value for money), you're just being a jerk. That said, cost does usually have an influence on one or more factors which could include quality, comfort, performance etc...depending on what item we're talking about.

[Kingfisher]

To the average amatuer musician, yes, they do. I could upload a clip of my $100 Squier bullet, and my $22,000 1963 all Original Fender Stratocaster, and I can guarantee you couldn't tell the difference.

So, since there's no perceptible difference, why don't you sell away the Fender Guitar and make do with the Bullet?

[Shanks A Million]

So, since there's no perceptible difference, why don't you sell away the Fender Guitar and make do with the Bullet?

I said there was no perceptable difference to the casual listener. For me, there is, and also, the intonation, output, quality of construction, etc. Those are important. For me. For the OP, a golf club is a golf club. For most people, an instrument is an instrument. It takes a very high level of skill to point out the differences.

Besides, how many people on golf forums still talk about "forged" as if it were a way of life, or even a metal. It's merely a production method. There's even threads asking about where the sweet spot is on forged irons, or why forged irons have less offset, etc. Forging is nothing more than shaping hot steel with a hammer.

[Kingfisher]

I said there was no perceptable difference to the casual listener. For me, there is, and also, the intonation, output, quality of construction, etc. Those are important. For me. For the OP, a golf club is a golf club. For most people, an instrument is an instrument. It takes a very high level of skill to point out the differences.

Shanks, I've read many of your posts and generally agree with much of what you say, so I am not knocking you. I also agree with the forged thing, that people think forged irons are some mythical demi-god that should be worshipped not hit.

Getting back to the point in question, any half-decent golfer who thinks a newbie is better off with a set of Z10s, Q10s or whatever they are, over a used set of 'real / decent' golf clubs is naive or working for a clone manufacturer! If clones really were okay, everybody would be using them so why are they not? If a new golfer is serious about getting into the game and improving quickly, he'll be better off starting off on the right foot. Do you honestly believe that all of the sticks in a clone set are going to have correct length, lie, loft and swingweight? The OP already mentioned that once he can consistently shoot in the 80's he'll buy a 'real' set of clubs. What's up - the clones not good enough for shooting in the 80s - why ever not? By getting himself a 'real' set of clubs now, his journey to the 80s may take a less time, be more enjoyable and not have to cost any more money.

[Ash1974]

Each to their own, but now I have been playing for a few years and know what is available on the 2nd hand market I would not buy clones.
If I could not afford OEM irons new I would get a second hand set of OEM, I sold my G10's 4-PW 2 years old and mint for £250 (they were £489 new) so would not pay £200 for Clones.

On the subject of fake clubs however, I got stung as a newbie golfer thinking I could save money on retail (yeah dumbass but I have never bought another club other than from a pro shop/golf retailer)

Story goes... when I took up golf I was given a set of Hippo Irons and a Putter so needed a wood, my dad said to get a 3 wood and leave a driver for now, so I went on Fleebay and bought a Callaway Big Berther 3 wood (2007) listed as real but £50 off RRP, when it arrived even being the golf newbie I was I could see it was clearly a fake.
I compared it to a real one at pro shop and the pro said the head was a clone as it was identical other than the paint job (same but not as neat finish) the shaft however was like a fishing rod and cut to driver length next to the OEM one. The seller was de-registered and had sold loads of clubs, Fleebay were shite as were PayPal and I never saw my money

If the OP is happy with his Clones then I aint got no beef with that, after all he was posting asking for help with the "black piece that fits around the shaft" that had come off his FVokey, not to get his ass chewed about playing clone irons.

[Ash1974]

noticed yestereday that a black piece that fits around the shaft and the hozel is broken. Damn!! Don't know if I should just super glue it, buy a new one, or get the real deal!!

On this note the ferrule's came loose on a few of my Hippo irons, the shafts were still firm in place so I just glued the ferrule back in place.

If the shaft is still firm in place glueing the ferrule back down will be fine, if your not sure about this then take them to any club fitter and he can check for you.

[Jtjohns]

On this note the ferrule's came loose on a few of my Hippo irons, the shafts were still firm in place so I just glued the ferrule back in place.

Thanks. The shaft is still firm in place. I plan on glueing it down soon. I never thought this thread would get this outa hand, but I enjoy reading the views of other people. Kingfisher, As far as being able to shoot in the 80s with clones. I can definately do it with time, hopefully in a couple months. I said I would get real clubs when I reach that point because I guess I am using that scoring range to assess my ability as a golfer and it provides me with a reward system. I feel that once I can CONSISTENTLY shoot mid 80s, I will have better ball striking, which is not bad now. In my mind, this opens the door for me to get clubs I want to grow with. I have demoed the PING I15 and love them, but I am aware they are for better players, so they will be my next set. Frankly, I'm pretty close to reaching my goal. I'm about 7ish strokes away, most of which is making a few 1 putts and elimating a few 3 putts here and there. I like my clones for what they are, but generaly speaking, I don't care much for the G10s or G15s. I do not care for the feeling I get when good contact is made with either of these clubs, including my clones. I actually demoed the X-22 yesterday and didn't care for the feeling of those clubs either. So.... PING I15s/I10s are just around the corner!!

[Ash1974]

Thanks.

No problem

If you are close to shooting in the mid 80's and shoot low 90's how come your handicap states 25.6 ? I shoot mid 80's to low 90's and am a 17.2 at present.

[Jtjohns]

No problem

I just started keeping a handicap. I only have about 2 or 3 rounds stored. Just so happens one of them was a blow up round :( I haven't broken into the 80s yet as well. BTW, how do you like the I15s?

[sean_miller]

I said there was no perceptable difference to the casual listener. For me, there is, and also, the intonation . . . .

Zingo!

Some players can tell the difference between a quality original and a POS copy, and they prefer the former.

[HytrewQasdfg]

I believe there are clones out there that do come close to offering the same quality as the real deal.

Wrong. Simply dead wrong.

When my daughter was younger I bought a set of Wilson (not Wilson/Staff, but Wilson) ladies clubs for her to get started with. The entire set (Woods, irons, wedges, putter, & bag) was less than $200. For the money it was a pretty decent set. As good as a high end set? No, but certainly worth the money I paid for it.

I believe there are clones out there that do come close to offering the same quality as the real deal.

This is the major problem I have with clones. By copying a brand they are trying to imply they are "almost as good as Pings, but at a lower cost." What they actually have are Ping looks, and Wal-Mart Wilson quality (at best).

Anyone trying to fool themselves into thinking their clone "Pong" clubs are anything like Ping clubs in any way other than looks is, to be perfectly blunt, well I'll refrain from calling anyone a name here.

[Jtjohns]

Wrong. Simply dead wrong.

To each his own, I guess..... This is an argument/discussion that will never end. I'd much rather be the guy playing clones and shooting my current scores than be the guy who cant break 100 playing top of the line clubs. But hey, at least they look good doing it. SIKE!!

[HytrewQasdfg]

To each his own, I guess..... This is an argument/discussion that will never end. I'd much rather be the guy playing

I'd much rather be the guy playing

inexpensive clubs and shooting my current scores than be the guy who cant break 100 playing top of the line clubs. That one word is where we differ. I have nothing against inexpensive clubs, nor do I think you need expensive clubs to play well. I also know there are plenty of inxepensive clubs available that are NOT clones. Wilson, Tommy Armor, Ram, Top Flite, Hippo, Tour Edge, & Adams all make inexpensive clubs that are just as high a quality (if not higher) than any clone club. My point is that if you think a set of Pong clone clubs is a higher quality/easier to play/more technically advanced set than any of the sets listed above, you are fooling yourself. A manufacturer that is dishonest enough to try and sway you to purchase his product by making it "look" like an OEM club and labeling them "Pong" is dishonest enough to cut corners in areas you don't see (and not tell you about them).

[Jtjohns]

I'd much rather be the guy playing

I agree with the word "inexpensive" as well. Funny though, I just got off the phone with a guy that wants to sell his G10s white dots for $250. I was fitted for green dots. Don't know if that will make much of a difference, but I'm thinking about it.

[delav]

I agree with the word "inexpensive" as well. Funny though, I just got off the phone with a guy that wants to sell his G10s white dots for $250. I was fitted for green dots. Don't know if that will make much of a difference, but I'm thinking about it.

Green dot and white dot sets only differ by .75 degrees of lie. Chances are, they could be a good fit for you with minimal modification to length. Also, as cast clubs, bending +/- 1 degree or less of lie doesn't present too much danger of the club breaking.

http://www.ping.com/pdfs/PING_Color_Code_Chart.pdf Not all golfers need a tour-style. Hell, I probably should play something else too... But any golfer at any level would benefit from a genuine set of ping irons versus an imitation pair. As someone else brought up, it's uncertain whether all clone clubs match in lie, length and swing-weight. These are things that any golfer could detect, and chalk up to swing mechanics. $250 is a steal too, I hope you consider picking them up.